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Author Message
Coffeebean
name
Personally...I think we should be called the Coffeecups.....

oh wait, I haven't even solved anything! LOL

What about the unFoundation?

PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 12:18 am
petunia
Re: OC Blog message
My thoughts
Good Lord, people!! I can't keep up with this, but it's sure fun trying. I am in awe of your code-fu. Worshippy

surfzoned wrote:
Studying the actual ciphered text on the Blog has brought a couple of idea's to mind.
1) the code seems to be similar to base64 encoding.


Can you explain this for us grasshoppers? I thought base64 would have uppercase and numbers in it, but this just has lowercase. And why does every word have exactly 8 letters? Also, how do you think the link or hover texts (lzzthmat in the pingback, for ex.) relate to the visible text (i.e. hlbgvloi)?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:52 pm
mortality
Ethan says
I have another thought... "...is the rule * all" I translated the symbol to mean "for." But the last line spells out for using f-o-r. So...I think we need to revise it.

Quote:
Dear Mort,

First, let me mention that the bridge call with Christopher and Shannon went very well. And that is probably a slight understatement. Christopher was VERY pleased that the OC concept showed results like this. Shannon did not have much time to digest the text of the note, but her immediate reaction was that it was not from any part of the Amphitheatrum, nor related to it in terms of style or content. She also noted that based on the spellings of some of the key indicator words it is probably American in origin and not more than 150 years old.

One cool point; since Shannon has to file a statement with Hawthorne regarding the discovery of this document she wants to give the proper credit to you all for the deciphering of the text. If it is not too much trouble, can you get with the people who had a role in solving this and find out how they would like to be credited? Also, since I am not really sure who is part of which group, do you all belong to a single organization? If so, does it have a name?

I got a big kick out of your comment "But how often can you randomly find a Bible verse that makes sense in a different context? Probably quite easily." I'd say that every group, sect, faction, denomination, and cult on the planet today is built on that exact idea.

You may be on to something with a book connection. If MSG1 is a poem it is likely from a book. MSG2 is pretty obvious. It wouldn't be much of a leap for MSG3 to be related to a book or books.

Man, we're the ones to be thanking you. I know there are a lot of projects on the internet built on people giving their time just because they want to be involved, but you don't really get a sense of what that means until you're in the middle of it and see how powerful that can be.

Regards,

Ethan Grant
Associate Researcher
The Whitechapel Foundation


So, how do we want to be credited?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:47 pm
casablanca
No WAY!!!!!!
surfzoned wrote:
Gratz to everyone for coming together on cipher 4. /cheers


You guys are something! Very Happy (That may be the last time I spend a couple days at a friend's house when there are codes to break. Heck! Wink ) Very neat.

But I have to admit, I'm glad to have something other than symbols to think about (my head still hurts). This spell sounds ominous to me. Has anyone noticed if there is an Autumn Country connection to this? I read a bunch of stuff over there last week and nothing jumps out, but I have a feeling I didn't find all of it.

Surfzoned, I agree on the moon phase symbols. With the text, that looks like a good bet.

I'm going to do some searches on the spell itself to see if I can get a hit.

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:41 pm
surfzoned
OC Blog message
My thoughts
Gratz to everyone for coming together on cipher 4. /cheers

Studying the actual ciphered text on the Blog has brought a couple of idea's to mind.
1) the code seems to be similar to base64 encoding.
2) the code doesn't have enough cipher text to be frequency analyzed.

The most likely methods of cracking it are ;ascii->numerical base conversion->a different base converter back to ascii; by means of a rail cipher/keyword cipher; by using a digraph cipher.

I'm still experimenting with all of these.
I think the blog cipher is probably the next cipher to be broken unless a serendipitous lead appears for one of the other ciphers.

We're pretty sure MSG1 is a poem and MSG3 could be anything (my intuition tells me its somehow combined with MSG2 and anagrammed to reveal a website.)

PS. YAY, CBs back Twisted Evil

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 9:48 pm
mortality
Re: "League"
Yeah, you got it, Coffee. League appeared in the context of a path. A land league is three geographical miles (or an hour's walk). As opposed to a marine league which is...(drum roll) 3 nautical miles (nautical mile = 1 minute of latitude). Very Happy

I can't tell whether it means an actual path and an actual league or whether it's some metaphysical/metaphorical "starting this ritual opens up a path and you'll have to travel down it 3 miles."

Somehow I doubt that every place of power on Earth a) has a path and b) that path travels for 3 miles. The ritual said only a place of power, so it clearly wasn't being specific.

P.S. welcome back. Smile

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 7:53 pm
Coffeebean
Free Advil to All!
Wow... I missed a pretty busy week, but saved myself alot of headaches.
My ISP hates me, and has disconnected me (for some SPAM sender hiding in one of my computers somewhere)....so now I have DSL, and I'm working on getting the network running again. So, just thought I would tell you all that I am here, and will try to help soon.

Carry on.

*tried to read everything, quickly tho, the word League seemed to stand out in that message....isn't that a term used to measure something? Like, 20 LEAGUES under the sea?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 7:25 pm
mortality
Five to Three
Good thoughts. It's unclear. That was just a best guess.

Other interpretations of various things: "the greater" could refer to the big hand of a clock rather than the larger end of a lodestone; the semi-circles and radii could also point in directions on a compass; the semi-circles and radii could also be completely meaningless. Lots of ciphers include meaningless, but elaborate or deliberate doodles as distractions.

I imagine Whitechapel will have a suggestion.

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:37 pm
badaim68
0702
What's the time?
Interesting that the message contains a time, as the lines at the bottom of the paper could be taken to be the hands of a clock.....although the time would be 2 o'clock rather than the 2.55 .....does this suggest that the "five to three" represents something other than time?

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:27 pm
mortality
Email update
I sent Ethan the cleaned up text (gave credit where it was due Very Happy) and he replied with a short note saying he would bring it to Christopher and Shannon.

He also replied to the status update on Case 0701
Quote:
Dear Mort,

Thanks for that recap. It really helps to lay it out point for point.

MSG2: I'm in the "WAS" camp, but I think we may need to understand the others to get this one.

MSG3: I've got to admit that my head is swimming just a little from your feedback here, but I think I followed it (sort of). If I did, then I think your option 2) seems pretty interesting. Impossible to solve, but interesting. There's just so little to work with on this one. I just wish there was something weird or unique about each person that tied them together (I guess that was your point too, with 3) ).

MSG1: This one made me laugh, because it showed me once again why I am not working for the NSA. I'm going to read your explanation of this one a couple more times. I'll let you know if I get anywhere.

Ethan Grant
Associate Researcher
The Whitechapel Foundation

ethanSPLATwhitechapelfoundation.org
www.whitechapelfoundation.org


My reply

Quote:
Ethan,
You're most welcome for the status update and the cleaned up MSG1 from 0702. Just feed us some hits from Shannon's wealth of arcane ritual knowledge or your crytozoological databases so we can go draw more absurd connections. Very Happy

Our thoughts on MSG3 are a result of totally grasping at straws. I have no idea why our author would use book codes in consecutive notes, let alone one so...absurd. The solution has some logic to it once you make the leap to "book code." And given that our author is delivering notes to us, the probable Bible verse makes sense. Seems like something more than coincidence. But how often can you randomly find a Bible verse that makes sense in a different context? Probably quite easily.

I'm not really sure how to justify the leap to another book code in the first place. And there are other Bible references to Ahasuerus, so it could just as easily be a different verse. So...the result is circumstantial. And suspect. Breaking MSG1 seems critical to making sense of anything else, as annoying as that is.

After some more discussion about MSG1 we have a couple other things to try. The solution to 0702 put some thoughts into our head that maybe we're underestimating the complexity of the cipher. We're still debating approaches. We'll let you know if we produce any results or come up with something nearly coherent as our first approach.

Thanks for providing all these brain benders for us and humoring our (also suspect) analysis.

Regards,
Mort

P.S. Don't bother trying to find Ezra Pound poetry that matches the X-file. We probably shouldn't have. Very Happy


Which is to say that I haven't found any Ezra Pound poems that match the sentence structure for our X-file in its current form.

Other things to look into on MSG1 0701: based on Case 0702's cipher, the 4 symbols may represent something more complex, like digraphs, trigraphs or whole words.

ETA: On 0701 MSG3, Ahasuerus also appears in the Book of Daniel and the Book of Ezra. Assuming I'm right about it being another book code and the 3:14/3:23 part, then it can't be the Book of Ezra; Chapter 3 only has 13 verses. Verses 14 and 23 from the 3rd chapter of Daniel really make no sense out of context. And I don't think we'd get a Bible book code that would tell us to find only one word.

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 5:00 pm
badaim68
Cipher similarities
Just for interest, the cipher used is similar to that used in the Babington Plot to assassinate Queen Elizabeth (the 1st obviously !!).

The symbols were used to represent both individual letters and whole words (and, of etc).

Link here:
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/spies//ciphers/mary/ma2.htm

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 4:23 pm
mortality
Final (for now) solution to 0702 MSG1
likely possibilities in [], comments in {}, ?=uncertain
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
It must be iron
It must attract {be magnetized?}
It must glow the color [of] the dying sun

Five to three [is] the rule [for] all {2:55 A.M. each night}

The first [is] [when] the night [is] black
At a place [of] power

The second one upon the next {meaning: next night or 2nd black night?}
One league along the path

The last upon the black night following {either 2nd or 3rd black night}
The rule prepares the place {five to three}

In all the greater must pont {point? missing i?} true

In each the blackness will be [complete?] {at 3 A.M., I should hope so}
Prepare to fear

If all [is] done in accordance the glow
[you? we? they?] draw [of] [the] shaped iron will be a
beacon for {whatever this summons}


RUCE was RULE

I'm pretty sure the triangle with a circle is a pronoun, "you," "they," or "we" based on how "draw" is conjugated. I think "we" is the least likely possibility.

"PONT" probably is "point" because I'm guessing that since "it" must be iron and attract, then it's probably some kind of lodestone. So the greater portion must point the right way? Probably north, but maybe not. Who knows with places of power? Consequently, the symbol for "it" might just stand for "the lodestone" since it is referred to as "the shaped iron" in the last instruction.

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 3:29 pm
Andh
mortality wrote:

One correction to the final legend: "<" is the symbol I think means either "of", "on", or "in". The legend has the "V" listed twice.
(...)


Actually I made another mistake:
that symbol is also here
AT A PLACE "<" POWER
instead of an F

So "of" would probably be the meaning.

EDIT: Fixed it
EDIT 2: Forgot another symbol and added it Embarassed

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 3:08 pm
mortality
Thanks! Really good work all around.

ETA: Going to check everything against the original symbols again and see if anything else makes more sense.

One correction to the final legend: "<" is the symbol I think means either "of", "on", or "in". The legend has the "V" listed twice.

I imagine "Five to three" means a start time for the ritual of 2:55. Since it's night, that has to be A.M. (duh...)

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:41 pm
Andh
Re: Updated cleartext for 0702
corrections based on Ethan's email: unsolved in (); suggested corrections in []; comments in {}
mortality wrote:
(...)
It might help to create and upload an image of a legend for the English characters you substituted for the original symbols. Or hand draw and photograph one.


Here you go, I added your suggestions too.

EDIT: Sorry, forgot a symbol
oc0702key.jpg
 Description   
 Filesize   75.1KB
 Viewed   81 Time(s)

oc0702key.jpg

PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:02 pm
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