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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!) » The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!): General/Updates
[QUESTION][SPEC] Cole Protocol, the Apocolypso, and You
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chaotic_mind
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Joined: 03 Aug 2004
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Location: Inside my head, behind the eyes
Scumbag wrote:
The Covenant slipspace drives and terran ones are essentially the same, they are simply more precise than our own. They use 256 color graphics at 1280x1024, and we use 640x480 Black/Green, to use a computer analogy. They aren't much faster than ours, they use it better.


I have no hard and fast way to prove my objection to this. It's not so much a matter of fact, and just of tone. But, to be honest, I thought the books always pounded the differences between human slipspace and Covenant slipspace drives. It's often boiled down to this image:

Humans punch a hole in space to get to slipspace. The Covenant negotiate.

I'd bring up the Ascendant Justice, and the short jaunt they took under Covenant power only. Unfortunately, that bit of evidence has been contaminated by the effects of the Reach crystal even then. So, it just seems to be a tone argument. So, YMMV.

Luke P.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 2:15 am
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HitsHerMark
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GunsmithCat wrote:


Well, to be specific, I think 343 mentions that his installation would fire and set off a chain with the others, meaning all four (or more) installations would destroy the whole galaxy. Halo's precise range is unknown (though, unless the others are destroyed ... probably moot).


Well, if there are four of them then we know that the minimum range would be somewhere around one quarter the size of the galaxy. Though it's probably something more then that as you'd want some overlap for such a thing.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 2:52 am
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scibtag
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Quote:
Well, if there are four of them then we know that the minimum range would be somewhere around one quarter the size of the galaxy. Though it's probably something more then that as you'd want some overlap for such a thing.

We don't know that there are four of them, we simply know that the range is approximately 25,000 light years. With that range, and the size of our galaxy, it would take about seven to cover the entire volume, with various pockets of overlap. There would probably be a few more in order to have a margin of safety. Or as much safety as you can have with a weapon designed to destroy all sentient life in the galaxy.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 3:03 am
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jellyfish_green
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 		Nota Bene: In the latest round of phase6/Fable axons, Melissa is asking another question: "What ship am I confined to?"
The Axon Go Hot answer is "Apocalypso".
So, if Melissa knows this to be true, same as she accepted "The Operator" as her nickname, then we've just gotten our confirmation of the ship name. "Set out from Reach one day/on a three-hour tour(three hour tour)/with Capt. Greene,/the Castaway,..."

Was this just a clever way of checking that we were really dedicated axon hunters, or can we take this as canon from here on in?

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:25 am
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Mole888
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 		I find it very hard to believe that Covenant are able to track slip stream travels. If they could then they would have been able to destroy Reach at the beginning of the war before Harvest was glassed. However they had to put a tracking device on the Iriquois for them to find Reach.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:37 am
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jellyfish_green
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Mole888 wrote:
I find it very hard to believe that Covenant are able to track slip stream travels. If they could then they would have been able to destroy Reach at the beginning of the war before Harvest was glassed. However they had to put a tracking device on the Iriquois for them to find Reach.


If I remember right, its not that they can see traces left in Slipspace, but that if they're near enough to see you jump, they can deduce where you're jumping to by measuring your speed and direction as you leave. (And then do the same jump, faster and with more control.)

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 7:46 am
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Mazian
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jellyfish_green wrote:
Nota Bene: In the latest round of phase6/Fable axons, Melissa is asking another question: "What ship am I confined to?"
The Axon Go Hot answer is "Apocalypso".
So, if Melissa knows this to be true, same as she accepted "The Operator" as her nickname, then we've just gotten our confirmation of the ship name. "Set out from Reach one day/on a three-hour tour(three hour tour)/with Capt. Greene,/the Castaway,..."

Was this just a clever way of checking that we were really dedicated axon hunters, or can we take this as canon from here on in?


Trout on the question that Melissa asks

Linkage: one, two, three, four, five, six, seven


PS, it's "What ship are you assigned to?"

The answer is still the same.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:24 am
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thebruce
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scibtag wrote:
We don't know that there are four of them, we simply know that the range is approximately 25,000 light years. With that range, and the size of our galaxy, it would take about seven to cover the entire volume, with various pockets of overlap. There would probably be a few more in order to have a margin of safety. Or as much safety as you can have with a weapon designed to destroy all sentient life in the galaxy.

If you think about it though, one Halo placed at an optimal position still has potential to destroy a galaxy... 'destroy' doesn't necessarily mean obliterate all matter... although, that's probably the safe guess considering the flood. But even so, a star thrown off course can still destroy planets indirectly if the core of a galaxy is destroyed. So technically, 4 Halos has a very strong chance of destroying a galaxy, but a weak chance of obliterating one.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:30 am
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KaptainKlak
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 		They were already there
Just to help clear something up... The Covenant didn't track the PoA from Reach and just get to Halo first. They were there already. In Halo: The Flood, Cortana talks about how she thought the Covenant merely jumped there ahead of her and were waiting on the other side of the planet. But in reality, they were already there trying to activate the Halo. The entire first part of the level Truth & Reconciliation is an excavation site. The Covenant were trying to find the control room. We just happened to show up. Which is why we surprised them enough when we got there for Cortana to pull off "three... make that four kills."
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:01 pm
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HitsHerMark
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thebruce wrote:
So technically, 4 Halos has a very strong chance of destroying a galaxy, but a weak chance of obliterating one.


Considering that their solution to the Flood is to destroy all sentient life in the galaxy... I think it's safe to guess that they were shooting for obliteration.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:04 pm
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chaotic_mind
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 		I'm not sure about that. What's your evidence?

Look at this way, with supporting evidence put into lists.

Covenant followed us:
*Cortana said so.
*Because they could

Covenant got there first:
*Because they could've (they had access to the same Forerunner artifact that we did)
*The Covenant know a lot about Halo
- The Covenant have also been studing the Forerunner for a long time. They could have a simple Forerunner dig procedure.

To me, it seems most likely that the Covenant got there shortly after Sigma Octanus, since they would know how to read the Forerunner artifact.

But, at the same time, the Covenant didn't have much of a prescence in the Halo 04 system. Most of the warships that came, came from following you from the battle of Reach.

Since it addresses both options, I feel this one is most likely.

But, hey, you might have something I missed.

Luke P.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:08 pm
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Mazian
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 		Re: They were already there
KaptainKlak wrote:
Just to help clear something up... The Covenant didn't track the PoA from Reach and just get to Halo first. They were there already. In Halo: The Flood, Cortana talks about how she thought the Covenant merely jumped there ahead of her and were waiting on the other side of the planet. But in reality, they were already there trying to activate the Halo. The entire first part of the level Truth & Reconciliation is an excavation site. The Covenant were trying to find the control room. We just happened to show up. Which is why we surprised them enough when we got there for Cortana to pull off "three... make that four kills."


From the Early Halo Official Backstory on the Halo Resource Page it was originally presented that the Covenant did follow the Pillar of Autumn.

It was not until the game release and/or the novelization of the game [I am not certain which] that this was changed to the Covenant had already arrived at Halo and by coincidence, the PoA arrived before they were able to investigate.

An easy mistake to make, considering the body of (contradictory) knowledge available.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:11 pm
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GunsmithCat
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thebruce wrote:
scibtag wrote:
We don't know that there are four of them, we simply know that the range is approximately 25,000 light years. With that range, and the size of our galaxy, it would take about seven to cover the entire volume, with various pockets of overlap. There would probably be a few more in order to have a margin of safety. Or as much safety as you can have with a weapon designed to destroy all sentient life in the galaxy.

If you think about it though, one Halo placed at an optimal position still has potential to destroy a galaxy... 'destroy' doesn't necessarily mean obliterate all matter... although, that's probably the safe guess considering the flood. But even so, a star thrown off course can still destroy planets indirectly if the core of a galaxy is destroyed. So technically, 4 Halos has a very strong chance of destroying a galaxy, but a weak chance of obliterating one.


The Halo installations only destroy life forms capable of being hosts for the Flood, nothing else. Quite how they are able to perform this little magic trick is probably left in "dust and echoes" as Cortana put it...

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:30 pm
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thebruce
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HitsHerMark wrote:
Considering that their solution to the Flood is to destroy all sentient life in the galaxy... I think it's safe to guess that they were shooting for obliteration.


I'd agree, but just for argument's sake, if, say, one halo took out the galactic center, I'd be pretty positive that the galaxy would 'die' - ie, any solar systems in the galaxy would be thrown out of wack, even simply out of 'self-sustaining' status, and any planet that would have life, would in essence likely become uninhabitable...

But, as GS put how Cortana put it, it's all dust and echoes (isn't that also how Maximus put it in Gladiator? Razz)

any way you look at it, at least 4 Halo's will in the end make the galaxy non-life-sustaining...

Edit: Just remembered - it's "Shadows and dust" according to Maximus Smile
Edit x2: blah! Just remembered, it wasn't even Maximus, it was the gladiator trainer (his name currently escapes me)... "we mortals are but shadows and dust! Shadows and dust!"
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 1:28 pm
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ROBOGriff
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 		This may be off topic (or back to the original topic), but what proof do we have that all of the stories take place on Earth? I think it's pretty safe to assume Kamal's story takes place on earth, but none of the other storylines give any indication of a common location.

Just a little "out of the box" thinking. I welcome all inputs.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 08, 2004 2:32 pm
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