Return to Unfiction unforum
 a.r.g.b.b 
FAQ FAQ   Search Search 
 
Welcome!
New users, PLEASE read these forum guidelines. New posters, SEARCH before posting and read these rules before posting your killer new campaign. New players may also wish to peruse the ARG Player Tutorial.

All users must abide by the Terms of Service.
Website Restoration Project
This archiving project is a collaboration between Unfiction and Sean Stacey (SpaceBass), Brian Enigma (BrianEnigma), and Laura E. Hall (lehall) with
the Center for Immersive Arts.
Announcements
This is a static snapshot of the
Unfiction forums, as of
July 23, 2017.
This site is intended as an archive to chronicle the history of Alternate Reality Games.
 
The time now is Fri Nov 15, 2024 3:16 pm
All times are UTC - 4 (DST in action)
View posts in this forum since last visit
View unanswered posts in this forum
Calendar
 Forum index » Diversions » Perplex City Puzzle Cards » PXC: Silver Puzzle Cards
[Puzzle] Silver #238 Riemann
Moderators: AnthraX101, bagsbee, BrianEnigma, cassandra, Giskard, lhall, Mikeyj, myf, poozle, RobMagus, xnbomb
View previous topicView next topic
Page 28 of 47 [697 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, ..., 45, 46, 47  Next
Author Message
Gibbet
Veteran


Joined: 07 Aug 2005
Posts: 121

maevey wrote:
I can't help but think this is a clue to solving this card, following the theory that we need to proof read it. Don't have the card myself, unfortunately so I can't try it out.


Or alternatively, the punctuation and grammer was just awful! Very Happy

I can't see any reason for card hints just yet, as there is no hurry on MC's part for us to solve them. Now if it's season 5 and we still haven't cracked them........

But then again it's as good an idea as any we have at the moment.


Edited to fix punctuation Smile
_________________
"And I would have got away with it if it wasn't for those pesky cards!"

The OK13DTFC is but one of the things i'm ashamed of being associated with!


PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:02 pm
 View user's profile MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
duckiemonster
Unfettered


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 554
Location: Oxford, UK

Gibbet wrote:
grammer


*ahem*

grammar

/pedant
_________________
duckiemonster.com w00t!

PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:33 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
hairysocks
Boot


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 38
Location: Exeter, Devon, England

That letter on The Sentinal really does look like a clue. Assuming it is, I have just tried the following answer to the card. It was wrong, but perhaps I'm on the right track:

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Prime numbers are numbers that cannot be divided by any other [sic] number except themselves and 1. For example, 2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13 and 17 are all prime numbers. Aside from their theoretical interest, large prime numbers have become increasingly important in day to day life since they underpin the cryptography that allows secure transactions to take place on the internet (such as encrypting your credit card details when you buy online).

While there are standard techniques to discover new primes, [sic] and more importantly, check whether a number really is a prime, mathematicians have not been able to discover if there is any order to the way in which primes are distributed. However, the German mathematician G.F.G. [sic] Riemann (1826-1866) noticed that the frequency of primes is highly related to the Zeta Function, now known as the Riemann Zeta function.

[EQUATION]

The Riemann Hypothesis is that 'the real part of any non-trivial zero of the Riemann zeta [sic] function is 1/2.' It sounds complicated (and it is! [sic]) but a lot rests on whether his hypothesis is true. There are many equations in abstract mathematics that have been solved on the assumption that the hypothesis is true – and [sic] if it isn't, [sic] then not only would we have to look at those equations again, but it would also imply that there is a certain order to primes.

(As of 2004, [sic] the largest known prime was 7235733 digits long!)

$1,000,000 prize offered upon [sic] solving this puzzle see
http://www.claymath.org/millennium/Riemann_Hypothesis/

_________________
"You never can tell with Heffalumps"

PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 5:27 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Guin
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 400
Location: Antartica

donstobbart wrote:
Guin, would it be possible for you to post a pic of what you see on the card. All I manage to see is what I found before (4383 file), and I can't see anything past it.

Thanks

Don


Will give it a go - but not tonight due to excess of acohol

But on another thought (okay I am wasted) i find it interesting that the Sentinel has something relating to the proof reading thread not long after recent posts - possibly the right tack and i was just seeing things - I will sober up first to decide
_________________
So long and thanks for all the fish! Trout

PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 6:04 pm
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
hairysocks
Boot


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 38
Location: Exeter, Devon, England

Well I did email MC to ask if a proofreading markup language such as PRML is need to solve the card, and the Sentinal's use of [sic] in the letter is actually a type of markup language, so perhaps my email did the trick.
_________________
"You never can tell with Heffalumps"

PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 6:22 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
EvilGenius
Decorated


Joined: 04 Mar 2006
Posts: 227
Location: Vancouver

Agreed - we should try entering either a corrected passage or a properly mark-up one. That seems the most sensible thing I've heard yet. It might take some effort to correct it just right, however. Or maybe my grammer sucks Smile Can we reach some agreement on just what needs fixing? Tried a number of possible corrections but no dice. Now locked out but will keep trying tomorrow. There is still the matter of the last sentence being wrong whatever the grammer . . .

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:42 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Bendover
Veteran


Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 111
Location: San Jose

Reimann Hypothesis Some numbers have the special property that they cannot be expressed as the product of two smaller numbers, e.g., 2, 3, 5, 7, etc. Such numbers are called prime numbers, and they play an important role, both in pure mathematics and its applications. The distribution of such prime numbers among all natural numbers does not follow any regular pattern, however the German mathematician G.F.B. Riemann (1826 - 1866) observed that the frequency of prime numbers is very closely related to the behavior of an elaborate function

ζ(s) = 1 + 1/2s + 1/3s + 1/4s + ...

called the Riemann Zeta function. The Riemann hypothesis asserts that all interesting solutions of the equation

ζ(s) = 0

lie on a certain vertical straight line. This has been checked for the first 1,500,000,000 solutions. A proof that it is true for every interesting solution would shed light on many of the mysteries surrounding the distribution of prime numbers.

Try submitting this description from the Clay Math site. I would try it my self but I have no card (trying to get one) The text is quite a bit different than what's on the card http://www.claymath.org/millennium/Riemann_Hypothesis/

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 2:44 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
oliverkeers13
Entrenched


Joined: 23 May 2005
Posts: 917
Location: London, UK

x wrote:
ok13nli wrote:

Also, X, Register, log in, whatever, not logging in ever doesn't make you cool, it just makes you look like a pathetic dickead who wants to be different, but has the same polystyrene personality as everyone else, so looks to find a silly quirk.
(just so you know, I'm only nli due to using a public comp)


Good than im a Pathetic Polystyrene Dickhead...

You treat newcomers with hostility and anger. Just because you believe you were here first and have put in the most work, therefore everyone should listen to you and shut their mouths.
I have no problem with newcomers, as long as they take the time to read up, have something valid to say, and express themselves well (no 1337, "u"'s etc.)

Quote:
Get off your high horse, you arent god. Your placement on the leaderboard does not impress me.
When did I say I was?
Quote:
I try not to accuse people... But it really angers me when people think they are better than everyone else, and thus everyone else should just leave these boards. No you didnt specifically say that. But you are implying it.
I actually said in my post "Don't leave the forum, or do anything similarly rash. I do ask that you post more intelligently in the future, however. "

Quote:
I dont log in my registered account for one reason, I dont want to deal with you PM'ing me for your bullshit.
Fine, then if I have a problem with you, I'm equally happy to discuss it here, in front of everyone, in the same manner. Just because you use your account doesn't mean people will spam your PM box to shit, don't assume that you're important or interesting enough that people will want to constantly talk to you in private.

Quote:
Leave people alone. If you dont have something constructive to say dont say anything... Complaining on these boards is not useful. And hell im breaking my own thought process by complaining about you.
All my criticisms were constructive. They provided guidance, where did I simply say "you are an idiot, please piss off"? 'Complaining' on the boards is useful, if it helps keep it easier for new people who do take the effort to read up on stuff to catch up.

Quote:
So i will stop. ... Sorry people i cant help tame this board, nothing will. People are just cruel and easily irritated. No solution. Just deal.
I may well anger easily, but as you can see, my views are shared by others.
_________________
"You're talking last ditch, I need top drawer" V
"To be in opposition is not to be a nihilist" CH
"im iver an idiot or a genus" Dekuprince
Perplex City Video


PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 4:17 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
Jakeo
Decorated

Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 159
Location: Edinburgh

Let me precede this post with an apology for further inflating this thread. I'll delete it after a portion of time:

Quote:
Fine, then if I have a problem with you, I'm equally happy to discuss it here, in front of everyone, in the same manner. Just because you use your account doesn't mean people will spam your PM box to shit, don't assume that you're important or interesting enough that people will want to constantly talk to you in private.


While you may both be happy to discuss this publicly, I'm not happy that you feel the need to discuss it on this thread.

Ollie - you're defeating a large portion of your original argument by filling this thread with garbage.

X - This is not a forum for you to complain about specific posters. If you are unhappy with what Ollie has to say, take it to him or a Mod. Of course this might mean that you have to log in.

Both of you - Start a new thread somewhere I don't want to read if you wish to continue this.

While the original post was reasonably vacuous, both of you subsequently made the situation worse. My inclination is to ignore any post that starts with 'I haven't read this whole thread but...' because I have stared at this card long and hard enough to be sure that all of the 'obvious' suggestions have already been covered and statistically the post is unlikely to contain any new information. I'm even more willing to accept that sort of post if its well qualified with reasoning. I know that the reason behind it is related to Von's clue, but I'd really like to see that other people have at least learnt that much! Its no different to someone saying 'I haven't read anything on cryptography, but have you tried ROT-13?' on the Thirteenth Labour thread. Its irritating, wastes my time and doesn't get us any closer to the solution.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:24 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Guin
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 400
Location: Antartica

Hi guys - few developments. Okies firstly I will post the image of what I think my mania is seeing in the text but I am also persuing the proof reading line too. I am at work at the moment so will post images on my site tonight and put up a link here (I am beiginning to doubt my sanity though!!!) I am also seeing my bro tomorrow as he is the sub-editor on the local wrag and he can proof read (yay!) so hopefully he may be able to do a proofing for us. I tried to make sense of it but figured if he can do it for me i can buy him a pint in return (equally I have been trying to get him into ARGs for a few weeks now but have not had a good enough excuse and this will fit the bill)

Okies I need to look like i am working not ARGing

Evil or Very Mad

(I think a group of goldfish have taken over my head! - no that would be the hangover!)
_________________
So long and thanks for all the fish! Trout

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:26 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
kie_yeo
Veteran


Joined: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 85
Location: Romford, Essex

Quote:
Its irritating, wastes my time and doesn't get us any closer to the solution.


I agree 100%. Can we please stop the petty bickering and concentrate on the card. Preferably before I lose any respect I may have for certain individuals

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:38 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
hexDa3m0n
Boot

Joined: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 60
Location: Lancaster, England

OK.

I'm not saying i completely disagree with the idea of having to proof read the card, just that I had a thought, and it was lonely in my head on its own, and wanted to be shared.

If we are meant to proof read the card and re-enter all the text, why have they put the card correction on the solution page? Are people taking this as a hint? I kinda assumed it was because shed loads of people e-mailed them telling them of the error. I know that usually it relates to the correct answer but don't see why it would make a difference if we had to re-enter all the text.

Like I said, not completely disagreeing with the proof read idea, and admittedly, not really sure where we should be heading....but thought it was worth mentioning. Very Happy

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 8:44 am
 View user's profile AIM Address MSN Messenger
 ICQ Number 
 Back to top 
duckiemonster
Unfettered


Joined: 10 Dec 2005
Posts: 554
Location: Oxford, UK

My latest Riemann theory: it's not a proof read. That would be a dissapointing and somewhat irritating answer to an elegant puzzle that's been about for years.

I really do think that the answer to this card is proof of the Riemann hypothesis. I think this card is meant to bug us until the day that some clever mathmo emerges from his dark study, waving a piece of paper in the air and yelling 'beat the bugger!' or local equivalent.

It would also be extremely cool if in 20 years time we're still puzzling over this card.

What's the rush anyways?
_________________
duckiemonster.com w00t!

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 9:19 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
magicmancraig
Boot


Joined: 29 Nov 2005
Posts: 25

I think proof reading is the way to go Very Happy

Everything adds up now, think about it.There is no question on the card, in the answer box it says show your proof here.The Sentinel posting that bit with lots of [sic] indicating that that is the way to go.Also the correction of the G.F.G Riemann, to obvious!

I have spent a while on this idea (and although not skilled enough to do it on my own) think that the people in these forums can help.

I have found several things wrong(way to many for it to not be done on purpose) these include spellings and punctuation, aswell as gramar.

As we have no where else to go. I highly sugest that we go down the proof reading road, at least until we have another option.

I think we should compile a list of everything that is wrong with the text and also reasons.This way we can make sure everyone knows why there is a [sic] there.I am not 100% sure that we only have to use [sic] I think there may be one or two symbols we have to use.

This is what ive got so far:

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Prime numbers are numbers that cannot be divided by any other number except themselves and 1. For example, 2, 3, 5, 7, 11, 13 and 17 are all prime numbers. Aside from their theoretical interest, large prime numbers have become increasingly important in day to day [sic1] life since they underpin the cryptography that allows secure transactions to take place on the internet ( [sic2] such as encrypting your credit card details when you buy online) [sic3]

While there are standard techniques to discover new primes, [sic4] and more importantly, check whether a number really is a prime, mathematicians have not been able to discover if there is any order to the way in which primes are distributed. However, [sic5] the German mathematician G.F.G. [sic6] Riemann (1826-1866) noticed that the frequency of primes is highly related to the Zeta Function, now known as the Riemann Zeta function.

The Riemann Hypothesis is that 'the real part of any non-trivial zero of the Riemann zeta [sic7] function is 1/2.' It sounds complicated (and it is!) but a lot rests on whether his hypothesis is true. There are many equations in abstract mathematics that have been solved on the assumption that the hypothesis is true – and [sic8] if it isn't, [sic9] then not only would we have to look at those equations again, [sic10] but it would also imply that there is a certain order to primes.

( [Sic11] As of 2004, [Sic12] the largest known prime was 7235733 digits long!) [Sic13]

$1,000,000 prize offered upon [sic14] solving this puzzle see
http://www.claymath.org/millennium/Riemann_Hypothesis/


Reasons:
[sic]1-spelling-correct spellings should be day-to-day.
[sic]2 and 3-Brackets are in the wrong place.Brackets can only go in the middle of a scentence.
[sic] 4-Never have a commar before and.
[sic]5-However is a conective, seems wrong to have a commar after it.
[sic]6-Spelling.
[sic]7-Capital on Zeta.
[sic]8-Can't have - then and.
[sic]9-Seems wrong.
[sic]10-Can't have a commar before but because but is a conective.
[sic]11 and 13-Brackets in totally random places.
[sic]12-seems wrong.
[sic]14-upon?


If we look at the other cards so far yes there have been a few mistakes but this is far beyond that.

If we work together I am sure we can have this card solved before the next set come out! Very Happy

I hope............. Shocked
_________________
Utterly Perplexed......

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 11:25 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
modern_hero
Decorated

Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 159
Location: UK

Euler showed ζ(s) = Σ (1/n)s = Π(1 - p-s)-1, or (1/(1-(1/2)s) × (1/(1-(1/3)s) × (1/(1-(1/5)s) × (1/(1-(1/7)s) × (1/(1-(1/11)s) × ..., which relates the Zeta function to the primes.

Hope it helps.
_________________
I'm Perplexed...

PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:41 pm
 View user's profile Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 28 of 47 [697 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, ..., 45, 46, 47  Next
View previous topicView next topic
 Forum index » Diversions » Perplex City Puzzle Cards » PXC: Silver Puzzle Cards
Jump to:  

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
You cannot post calendar events in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group