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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Lost Experience » TLE: General, Updates, Spec, & Info
[INFO][SPEC] Alvar Hanso Photo (and season 2 evidence)
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SSSS
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The Drunk Monkey wrote:
I don't think the Others could have forged quite a convincing video by the Dharma Initiative with the level of technology available in the station.


But it's often speculated that what we "know" about the Dharma Initiative could be highly misleading or a flat-out ruse. As for "the Others", there's been strong evidence that
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
there's much more going on than meets the eye, and that their whole "primitive grizzly jungle dudes" thing is a total hoax to fool the castaways. Remember the episode Maternity Leave where the rugged, dirty outfits of the Others were discovered to just be costumes, and Zeke/Beard Guy's beard was found to be fake? A more honest face of the Others was revealed in that episode in Claire's flashbacks by the presense of a team of doctors in clean, fresh medical scrubs with plenty of advanced medical equipment, plus a fully-stocked nursery and all sorts of other goodies. We don't even know that they're "stranded" at all.

Besides, it was obvious that Michael was flat-out lying when he came back and claimed that the "Others" were dirty, impoverished, and barely armed; the truth is probably just the opposite.


Quote:
then why would the Initiative/Foundation, apparently, send people to keep pressing the button when there is no need to?


Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Do we know for sure that they truly did ever send anybody? Desmond wasn't one, and we don't know anything about Kelvin, although we're supposed to find out more in the season finale thanks to the Desmond flashbacks we've been promised.


Quote:
However, as far as I know, the Others and the Dharma Initiative arn't related


A few months ago I would have agreed with that, but "Maternity Leave" and several recent events are making me more suspicious.

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 10:57 am
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skywisej
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
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Location: Green and rainy Oregon (Go Ducks!)

 		Ah man, I wish there was a spoiler box inside of that spoiler box. No fair talking about things coming up in eps that haven't even aired in the US yet Sad I try so hard to be spoiler free on this show. Sigh.
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 12:36 pm
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Manchot
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Joined: 05 May 2006
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 		Ditto to that. If you're going to post future episode spoilers, please label them as such.

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 1:45 pm
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Transmission3000
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Joined: 19 Oct 2003
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 		How is it a spoiler? It's speculation based on episode capsules from TV Guide type publications.

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 1:47 pm
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RPGgame
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Joined: 02 Jan 2003
Posts: 501

 		Test Spoiler

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
this is spoiler number 1 inside this spoiler [spoiler]is another spoiler
[/spoiler]
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 1:59 pm
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curiouscat
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SSSS wrote:
Quote:
Spoiler (Rollover to View):

then why would the Initiative/Foundation, apparently, send people to keep pressing the button when there is no need to?



Spoiler (Rollover to View):
I like the Electromagnetism theory at http://tinyurl.com/e9sz5 which if true would mean there's a need to, technically, for the sake of the experiment

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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 3:30 pm
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jmds
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Joined: 05 May 2006
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 		From the latest Persephone update we know that Hanso was last seen in 2002 so that should be an end to the discussions shouldn't it? It definitely means the photo wasn't taken in 2003 and the date of

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
1980 as given in season 2 episode 3 seems much more likely


PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 4:16 pm
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The Drunk Monkey
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Joined: 04 Mar 2006
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Location: UK

 		I hate not being able to make a good argument, having not seen the rest of season 2 (or many of the spoilers for that matter).

jmds wrote:
From the latest Persephone update we know that Hanso was last seen in 2002 so that should be an end to the discussions shouldn't it? It definitely means the photo wasn't taken in 2003 and the date of

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
1980 as given in season 2 episode 3 seems much more likely

It still doesn't answer the question of how a picture taken in 2003 ends up in 1980, or why they're using a picture from 1980 and saying it's from 2003 when it would look far more authentic to use a picture from 2002.
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 4:29 pm
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Chris-uk
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Joined: 05 May 2006
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 		Anagram
Slightly off topic...worked out a convincing anagram for Magnus Hanso....us brits will like this...


AMOS SHAG NUN....


pretty obvious its a clue

Now we need to know who AMOS is.....

Very Happy

http://www.consumating.com/profiles/Richardlol#questions

Is this Alvar Hanso?

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 5:43 pm
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curiouscat
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The Drunk Monkey wrote:
It still doesn't answer the question of how a picture taken in 2003 ends up in 1980, or why they're using a picture from 1980 and saying it's from 2003 when it would look far more authentic to use a picture from 2002.
It can't. And like the pipe-smoking detective tells us, when you eliminate the impossible whatever remains must be the truth.

There is no reason to believe the picture was taken in 2003 just because they say it is.

There is no reason to believe it was taken in 2002 either. Just because that's the last confirmed/presumed AH appearance doesn't mean there is a picture from it.

There is no reason to believe
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
the film in the hatch
is from 1980 either because, see sub 1, just because THF says so doesn't make it so. We've got an old, crappy photo which, for whatever reason, is the only one they have, or the only one they are willing to let the public see.
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 6:55 pm
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Obes
Unfettered

Joined: 16 May 2005
Posts: 329
Location: England

 		We have the following information...

The Picture is dated twice, accredited to both 1980 and 2003.

Alvar Hanso was last seen in 2002.

NO record whatsoever exists of him after 2002.

Therefore...
A) The photo is from 1980, and is the last available photo of Alvar, who died/vanished that year. Since then someone has been impersonating him. The impersonator mysteriously vanished in 2002. The Hanso Foundation has avoided Impersonator being photographed to avoid investigators realising he is not the real Alvar.

B) Alvar changed his name, and is actually Mittlewerk. He travelled under the name of Alvar Hanso, because it was on his passport. He hasn't left the country since 2002, and thus Alvar Hanso hasn't been 'seen' since 2002.

C) Alvar never existed, and is the creation of the Dharma group as a figurehead. They were unable to produce a meaningful reason and cover-up for his existance, and 'retired' the character. The person playing the part of Alvar retired in 2002, disappearing into Madrid to avoid being traced.

D) Alvar experimented on himself in 1980. The photograph is the last available so that they can cover-up the fact he hasn't aged since then. If he was providing weapons in world war two (lets say he was 20 at the time) he would be 106 this year, and most likely dead...


I suppose that last comment might prove interesting to people that overlooked the fact he was in world war two, and still active.. TODAY, according to the website.

Obes. Twisted Evil

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 7:06 pm
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trillian0921
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 		duh, didn't think of the WWII thing. And Joop the Amazing Chimp is 105/106. Coincidence?

Wait, wouldn't he have to have been born in 1900 to be 106? Thus 39 when WWII started.

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 7:14 pm
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curiouscat
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 		Yes and no, Obes. The photo was USED in a film with a 1980 copyright.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
It is an assumption that it really was, if it's a psychology experiment, the initiative could well have created a deceptively old-looking film to create a particular effect about the stations and what the respondents are really doing and why.


Even if the copyright date is correct, that means the photo existed in 1980, it dosn't mean it was taken in 1980; it could be older.
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 7:34 pm
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Etymologician
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trillian0921 wrote:
duh, didn't think of the WWII thing. And Joop the Amazing Chimp is 105/106. Coincidence?

Wait, wouldn't he have to have been born in 1900 to be 106? Thus 39 when WWII started.


Yeah, I think plenty of us know people who were involved in WWII who are still around today without any fancy life extension. In fact, the fact that Hanso is that old rationalizes his position as a figurehead for the Foundation rather than an active leader. Of course, he could be abnormally old... we don't know that he's not, but I don't think WWII is evidence that he definitely is. Similarly, the c. date of 1980 doesn't necessarilly mean that the photo was from 1980, even if the film was created in that year. It could be even older. Or, the film could be a fake which would allow it to be newer. However, I'd like to hear some evidence for the film being newer than 1980 rather than conjecture that it could be.

Edit: Sorry, curiouscat types faster than I do. Embarassed

PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 7:34 pm
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theShaggy
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Joined: 17 Sep 2005
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Location: Toronto, Ontario
Obes wrote:
We have the following information...

The Picture is dated twice, accredited to both 1980 and 2003.

Alvar Hanso was last seen in 2002.

NO record whatsoever exists of him after 2002.

Therefore...
A) The photo is from 1980, and is the last available photo of Alvar, who died/vanished that year. Since then someone has been impersonating him. The impersonator mysteriously vanished in 2002. The Hanso Foundation has avoided Impersonator being photographed to avoid investigators realising he is not the real Alvar.

B) Alvar changed his name, and is actually Mittlewerk. He travelled under the name of Alvar Hanso, because it was on his passport. He hasn't left the country since 2002, and thus Alvar Hanso hasn't been 'seen' since 2002.

C) Alvar never existed, and is the creation of the Dharma group as a figurehead. They were unable to produce a meaningful reason and cover-up for his existance, and 'retired' the character. The person playing the part of Alvar retired in 2002, disappearing into Madrid to avoid being traced.

D) Alvar experimented on himself in 1980. The photograph is the last available so that they can cover-up the fact he hasn't aged since then. If he was providing weapons in world war two (lets say he was 20 at the time) he would be 106 this year, and most likely dead...


I suppose that last comment might prove interesting to people that overlooked the fact he was in world war two, and still active.. TODAY, according to the website.

Obes. Twisted Evil


What about

E) The photo was taken in 1980, used in
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
the film,

but they claim that it was taken in 2003 on the website to make it appear that he's still alive/active/real over a year after his last known appearance.

I dunno, seems a bit more plausible than "He's an immortal super-being." Wink

(And, that might explain why Persephone was linking the date, why she was mentioning the date and their his last known location)
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PostPosted: Tue May 09, 2006 7:36 pm
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