unforum

psyche · Veteran Joined: 07 Feb 2006 Posts: 72

Well, the ultimate straightforward option is for him to simply level with him: 'We think there's a mole in the crypto department and we need to know anything you can tell us.' But I guess if the guy's really nervous that's not necessarily going to be enough motivation for him to talk...

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:07 am

Brian Morton

Maybe we all are being entirely too cerebral about this. Let's ask Tippy to use her charms on him. Seems to be going ok with Anna. We''ll have Caine work as the middle man. I know my work priorities shift a bit when there's beautiful ladies around.

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:46 am

_________________
"Damn you, Smith- damn you to hell."

jbd · Decorated Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 295

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 10:56 am

UKver2.0 · Decorated Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 270

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:15 am

Mico

I like the idea of setting them a challenge for once.

So if we are to encrypt a message for Caine to pass to Nev, what should it say? Do we need to make it something that he can crack, or just some gibberish to enable Caine to start a conversation?

It may not be good enough to only give Caine a reason to talk to Nev - we need to give Nev a good, persuasive reason to talk as well. Maybe if the encrypted message hinted about coming from Earth? Be an "intercepted" message referring to 3P agents within the Academy? Or maybe even something about the phone call between Hesh & the Crypto dept? Or, as you say, just a straight forward request for info - that way he can encrypt using our method (or his own) to allow the info to get out without Camden sticking his big fat <spec>3P</spec> nose in!

We need to give Nev every opportunity to spill the beans to Caine about his non-speculation.

What encryption method though? RC5, public/private prime-number keys etc need a lot of data to analyse to stand a real chance. As you say, a straight substitution would be too easy and Nev would start to question Caine's motives. I've found a substitution in combination with a Caesar Square to be quite effective, because just performing one decryption still gives nothing readable. What do you reckon?

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:55 am

BBuck · Decorated Joined: 13 Dec 2005 Posts: 184

I like the idea of turning the tables.

[TIAG] However if it's too hard then we're unlikely to get a quick response. Mind Candy are no doubt very smart, but not perfect. Even what appears to be solvable to some, can stump others for months/years (yes, I'm thinking about Shuffled). So, we should consider posting the method on this forum (after a suitable delay) to ensure that the puzzle is solved [TINAG]

As Perplexians are so good at Crypto, I'm sure that Nev can solve anything we can come up with within 48 hours Very Happy

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 12:01 pm

jbd · Decorated Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 295

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 12:11 pm

UKver2.0 · Decorated Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 270

This is good. We might have to PM some of the details to each other if we really want to give them something to work out. Let's come up with a general idea here and then when we are close to consensus, send the message to jbd. jbd can then PM the encoded message (and method?) to others here to make sure it makes sense.

We need some messages to encode (to give Caine some options). One with a straightforward plea from us to help and one with something enticing to get Nev's attention.

Keep the parallel "straightforward" discussion going too. Let's try and get something to present to Caine before Anna's next update.

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 12:44 pm

jbd · Decorated Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 295

Auto-encoder complete.

Now I just need a text. I've already encoded with one; it's a text about the dangers of secrecy, and should be a pretty strong hint -- however, it might be good to have a more straightforward text (if Caine wants to present it as an intentional "challenge" on his part) or a more subtle one (which appears perfectly innocent except in context).

Since the encoder works automatically it's not a hardship to pick two more texts to send off to Caine's email.

Just keep in mind the text must be long for this to work. I suggest 250 words or so.

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 1:40 pm

Scott

It sounds like we are on the track, I think. To answer your question (Because I think it bears observing):

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 1:48 pm

_________________
Perplex City is a game whose only rule is: There must be a party.
Balance of Powers is a game whose only rule is: There must be a political party.

Scott

Here's some text you could use:

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 1:53 pm

_________________
Perplex City is a game whose only rule is: There must be a party.
Balance of Powers is a game whose only rule is: There must be a political party.

jbd · Decorated Joined: 27 Jul 2004 Posts: 295

Thanks, Scott. That's better than I would've done. I sent that one and my more-oblique-hinting version winging along.

*blinks at clock* 4 hours. This is why I wanted to wait for a confirm before starting on this.

Oh well, if they don't go for it I'll post my mystery text and let all of you suffer over it instead. Very Happy

**Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 2:36 pm