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 Forum index » Meta » General META Discussion
What constitutes an ARG?
Moderators: imbri, ndemeter
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Elijah Snow
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Joined: 17 Jan 2003
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 		Someone had mentioned Online Caroline in this thread so I thought I'd check it out. After reading this article I must say this is definitely a step in direction of the customized experiences I was talking about! Although the author of the article states they felt betrayed and mortified by the finale, she makes an interesting observation:

You don't play a simulation (like Online Caroline). It plays you.

Again, if the circumstances were different I wonder if this author would have felt as negatively as she did? "Caroline" also seems to fit Imbri's theory of TINAG. If people come across Caroline with out knowing its true premise, they would have no idea they were participating in the simulation. The lines between fiction and reality are blurred. Dmax's example of Kyra Braswell also seems to fit this definition (although it didn't seem to have the customization and interaction).

So what need do ARG's fulfill exactly? A desire for intellectual challenge? A need to feel part of a community? Or the desire to be fooled?

(I bet someone is going to say, "all three". Rolling Eyes So, if you please, pick the one that speaks strongest to you.) Very Happy

ES
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2003 7:02 pm
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Elijah Snow
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Joined: 17 Jan 2003
Posts: 133
Location: Cin Sity

 		Re-Defined
OK, so we started with the following definition of ARG, as stolen from another thread regarding RedKore:

Quote:
(An ARG is) a game with puzzles to solve...in the sense that there is a puzzle master with THE answer key


After all this discussion, I'd like to put forth a new definition:

Quote:
An ARG is a "collaborative experience" whereby large groups gather to participate in fictional story-games for the purpose of socialization and intellectual stimulation.


Yes? No? Maybe?

ES
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 10:19 pm
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dmax
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Elijah Snow wrote:
So what need do ARG's fulfill exactly?


I think all actions are driven, to a large extent, by the need for a feeling of power. In one sense, I think that's true here. Solve the puzzle or understand the murky plot and you have power, value, worth.

But the real first thing that came to my mind was danger.

There's a sort of danger, like a roller coaster ride. You won't really get hurt, but there's still a sense of urgency and importance.

So I'm thinking that some (plot people) are driven by urgency and others (puzzle people) are driven by the power aspect.
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That sounds like something HITLER would say!

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2003 10:24 pm
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Elijah Snow
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Joined: 17 Jan 2003
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Location: Cin Sity
dmax wrote:
Elijah Snow wrote:
So what need do ARG's fulfill exactly?


I think all actions are driven, to a large extent, by the need for a feeling of power. In one sense, I think that's true here. Solve the puzzle or understand the murky plot and you have power, value, worth.

But the real first thing that came to my mind was danger.

There's a sort of danger, like a roller coaster ride. You won't really get hurt, but there's still a sense of urgency and importance.

So I'm thinking that some (plot people) are driven by urgency and others (puzzle people) are driven by the power aspect.


I would have to agree with you here dmax. For some the forum is an opportunity for socialization, while for others its an audience for them to display their "power".

And with that, I think my curiosity is satisfied...for now.

And speaking of forums... Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2003 9:04 am
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The Watcher
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 		I think the collaborative part is one of the most appealing aspects of an ARG - as long as everyone gets a chance to participate.

In a good ARG, everyone gets to contribute their ideas. Not necessarily solutions to puzzles- just ideas, theories, anything.

Even if every puzzle has already been solved, there can always be theories about characters, the plot, etc.

People have mentioned that an open forum with solutions to puzzles takes away the satisfaction of solving a puzzle yourself.

I think it adds to the experience, if you join with the group in solving puzzles. Everyone builds on everyone else's discoveries, and together you can see the big picture, with everyone contributing a little piece to it.

PostPosted: Fri Jul 30, 2004 6:57 pm
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JohnEvans
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Joined: 18 Nov 2004
Posts: 23
Elijah Snow wrote:
OK, here's a messed up idea…

What if there were an ARG that was completely played out in the message forums. The only twist is that the forum was the game?! There would be "character players" who post interaction from the "game" to the forum (puzzles, e-mail, interaction), but no sites would be mentioned or others couldn't get access to them. In theory it might work, since some people play via the forums anyway, in practice I'm certain it would be found out very quickly.

Congratulations on figuring out Level 1 of our new ARG, "NF"! This ARG uses the latest technology to simulate an entire forum of interested users--the only real player is YOU. Pick up your phone, wait for the dial tone and say your unforum password along with the first 10 digits of pi (backwards), and your new player packet will arrive in the mail shortly.

(...I'm joking. Aren't I?)
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PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2004 10:57 pm
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Dorkmaster
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dmax wrote:
I love genesis, and got to watch the birth of the internet. I kick myself for not investing in AOL and Yahoo as I watched them take off. Fortunately, I got in on the ground floor for Webvan... Confused

"We" are also in on the ground floor for ARGs. It's not a phenomenon that's been around for decades (like 12 bar blues) and we're playing within well defined boundaries, adding our own little personal touches.

At least, that's my hope. I'm hoping that the game genre is still undifferentiated enough so that it can encompass more, and not have constraints that limit its creativity.

The nature of TV is that it necessarily shoots for the lowest common denominator, so that it can attract as many people to the commercials as possible. Very little groundbreaking is done, intentionally, since the same old things attract the same old people with the same old money. ARGs will never, I would hope, find themselves in that spot. An undistinguished and rote ARG wouldn't be the sort of thing that would attract a large following, I would expect. "Come do this! You've done it before and it's easy!" (This is, though, the implied message of sitcoms.)

I see some of it already, though. "Oh, that's a Vignere cipher. Oh, that's modulo 25. Oh, that's...." And it's a walkthrough.

So is the genre fixed and are the boundaries set? That would be disappointing, and ultimately - for folks like us - boring.


Ok, so DMax wrote this back in June... And I just read it. And it's compelling as hell, so I've got to comment. (By the way, DON'T EVER LOSE YOUR AVATAR, DMAX! Every time I see it, I smile big, seriously... and this is months now... I love it!)

The point is, and I completely agree, is that we've got to be fresh and new and brave and risky in our newer ideas. Mind you, I don't see a problem with throwing in the occasional ROT puzzle or something, cuz you gotta have something for everyone to an extent if you wanna get played, but at the same time... There is some blandness going on with puzzle ideas. Does this mean all older puzzle styles get tossed to the side? No way. Does this mean we need to innovate as we think laterally as well? Hell yes...

I don't want to see a "Help me find SO AND SO" for a long time. Is it a great premise? YEAH! But is it tired and overused as a plot? Of course. Am I asking too many questions and answering them like an idiot? YES!
(Ok then, I'll stop that.)

But my point is that I am in complete agreement that we need to innovate to be viable. We need to invent to stay new. The point is we need to be new when the mainstream catches on. But at the same time, I see no problem with refining our culture, and our ideals as a community with similarities either. I mean, it's pretty obvious that there are a few staples that are by definition, ARGy. What we need to do, as a community, is take that base, expand on it (making the neccesary mistakes along the way) and grow that base. Grow that core knowledge of what the ARG-iverse is...

Again, we don't need to ditch the roots. We don't need to say "No we can't use phone interaction cuz it was done in ILB" but we can say "We shouldn't use payphone interaction by coordinates to give snippets of the plot away cuz it was done in ILB". Get it? We know what works, but we shouldn't sit down and write a book on how good we've gotten our ARGs to be.

I think this is why people are so excited about Syzygy, because it promises to be something innovative, but still touching on the kind of things (feelings even) that ARGs should encompass.

Anyway, long rambling rant aside, at the core, ARGs should be fun, realistic, and completely immersive. You can't get immersed when you say "Oh, this was like Chasing the Wish" cuz you're instantly pulled from the thick of it.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 14, 2004 4:21 pm
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