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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: Deus City » DC: Deus City
[Blue District]Puzzle: "Sign Language" [SOLVED]
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thorlin
Greenhorn

Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 8

 		so in other words, there should only be 3 signs.

Is it possible that the 3 signs on their own would be inert, but if you posted them side by side they would mean something? If the inspections would turn up something that stands out...

Not that it helps us solve the task. Sad

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 6:36 pm
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WolfHawk
Entrenched


Joined: 15 Nov 2006
Posts: 1247
Location: St. Louis

 		I don't know how helpful this is, but I'll stick it here anyway. Since I tend to be a visual person I decided to diagram, in a way, the frequency of some of the signs. We are looking for 3 signs so I marked multiples of three. Two things in particular I wanted to point out:
The white rectangles enclose two signs which appear next to each other 6 times.
The green squares enclose signs that only appear once.

Otherwise signs that appear three times are enclosed in matching frames, ie color/shape. My hope is that someone might be able to use this to determine where each sign begins and ends. It is possible that some words appear in more than one sign so could potentially overlap.

Edit to add additional green box
RoadSignscx.jpg
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RoadSignscx.jpg
_________________
Having abandoned my search for the truth I am now looking for a good fantasy.

The light at the end of the tunnel may be the headlight of an oncoming train.

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:00 pm
Last edited by WolfHawk on Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
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baada
Boot

Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Posts: 10

 		seeing doubles
WolfHawk:

The first thing I noticed about the message was the doubles you have highlighted in white rectangles.

With 31 symbols, we can safely reason this is either a mod31 encryption with unknown interval (possibly 3), or some letters are represented by more than one sign. That is assuming, of course, that we are looking at letters and not words. My hunch is the double-sign grouping is one letter, but I have absolutely no evidence to base that on.

Since there is an instance of the double-sign grouping being back-to-back (in the 7th row), that narrows the possibilities down some, but not much. The only letters I can think of that occur doubled like that are b, c, d, e, f, g, l, m, n, o, p, r, s, t, x, and z.

If we assume these are instructions on posting the signs, is it safe to assume one of the words is going to be "street"? I guess "alley" is another possibility. Based on this reasoning, I think the double-sign is most likely e, if anything I've said has made any sense.

All wild conjecture, I know. This is my first ARG, and I'm desperately trying to play catch-up, so feel free to take this at face value.

PostPosted: Wed Jun 27, 2007 11:17 pm
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LuxCal
Boot

Joined: 05 Jun 2007
Posts: 43
Location: Deep within your psyche

 		Re: seeing doubles
baada wrote:
WolfHawk:

The first thing I noticed about the message was the doubles you have highlighted in white rectangles.

With 31 symbols, we can safely reason this is either a mod31 encryption with unknown interval (possibly 3), or some letters are represented by more than one sign. That is assuming, of course, that we are looking at letters and not words. My hunch is the double-sign grouping is one letter, but I have absolutely no evidence to base that on.

Since there is an instance of the double-sign grouping being back-to-back (in the 7th row), that narrows the possibilities down some, but not much. The only letters I can think of that occur doubled like that are b, c, d, e, f, g, l, m, n, o, p, r, s, t, x, and z.

If we assume these are instructions on posting the signs, is it safe to assume one of the words is going to be "street"? I guess "alley" is another possibility. Based on this reasoning, I think the double-sign is most likely e, if anything I've said has made any sense.

All wild conjecture, I know. This is my first ARG, and I'm desperately trying to play catch-up, so feel free to take this at face value.


If the symbols are being paired together, then the apparent doubles aren't all real. In the third line, for instance, the dividing line between two doubles occurs between the two signs of interest (the 6th and 7th signs on the third line). In fact, the only one that remains is the first one.

All this means is that it's not simply two signs/character.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:01 pm
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thorlin
Greenhorn

Joined: 22 Jun 2007
Posts: 8

 		I have no basis for this theory, but could each line be a word or phrase. The yellow sign with 2 arrows pointing up could be a break, comma, space...

Only the first line seems too long for something like that, but it is only 12 signs long, so 12 letters (assuming each sign represents one letter).

Thoughts?

also:

Quote:
Wolfhawk:

With 31 symbols, we can safely reason this is either a mod31 encryption with unknown interval (possibly 3), or some letters are represented by more than one sign. That is assuming, of course, that we are looking at letters and not words. My hunch is the double-sign grouping is one letter, but I have absolutely no evidence to base that on.


I counted 34 distinct signs.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 28, 2007 3:56 pm
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TGI Fridays
Veteran


Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 123
WolfHawk wrote:

The green squares enclose signs that only appear once.


probably already caught this, but the lanes narrow sign at the end of the second row might need a green box too.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 3:47 pm
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WolfHawk
Entrenched


Joined: 15 Nov 2006
Posts: 1247
Location: St. Louis

 		Correction made. Thanks for pointing that out.
_________________
Having abandoned my search for the truth I am now looking for a good fantasy.

The light at the end of the tunnel may be the headlight of an oncoming train.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:43 pm
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DetectiveHollings
Veteran


Joined: 29 Jun 2007
Posts: 81

 		So the meaning of the signs is completely ruled out? I saw someone mention a sign that meant something like "Priority over oncoming Traffic." Is it at all possible it means "Priority" or something?

This puzzle makes my head hurt, but I want to help. Sorry if I'm just getting in the way.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:16 pm
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Penfold
Greenhorn

Joined: 02 Jun 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Lost

 		perhaps we are meant to take the sign litterally

when two paths (dual carriageway) | merge | two ways | there's no turning back | at the crossroads |

probably just my imagination running away with me because i can't figure where a picnic area ties in. but hey worth a shot and it is late so give us a break.
by the way this is my first arg aswell so i kinda don't know how these things work.

PostPosted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 9:38 pm
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Penfold
Greenhorn

Joined: 02 Jun 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Lost

 		I asked lisa for the information that they have already decripted and here is what she told me.
Quote:
Lisa says: Hello "penfold". It looks like the Defensecorp editors messed up on that. We haven't actually translated any of the message, but since it was posted to someone in sign manufacture, that's what we think it is. I can't imagine the Underground wanting anything else from one of our men.

Keep in touch!


PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:56 pm
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baada
Boot

Joined: 27 Jun 2007
Posts: 10

 		signs and numbers
The hint about archaic standards stuck out to me, so I got to thinking about standards, rules, regulations..

Found a UK government website that lays out all the specifications for their signs. It even has the proper phrasing of what they mean. Also, the images for the signs on this site are identical to the images used in the message. Most interestingly to me, each sign has a regulated number.

So, translating the signs to numbers, comes up with the attached file. I tried adding the numbers for each sign and translating it to alphabet, but I don't think that got me anywhere, since most of the numbers add up to 10-15 pretty evenly throughout the message. This must be one of those crazy number games, which I hate. So... good luck.

Oh, the site, in case anyone want to check it, is http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2002/20023113.htm#sch7
numbers.txt
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:40 pm
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Beckett Samuels
Guest


 		Sign Language
The message says -

thundershard - we need fifteen copies of the following - the union - save jenna - feet beneath the street - hook

Best,

Beckett

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 9:56 am
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DetectiveHollings
Veteran


Joined: 29 Jun 2007
Posts: 81

 		What? Seriously? How do you know that?

I'm excited, I'm just a little amazed at the abruptness.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:05 am
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TGI Fridays
Veteran


Joined: 12 Jun 2007
Posts: 123

 		answers are
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
the union, save jenna, feet beneath the street
tried it in a dummy account and it works. He's right.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:14 am
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LuxCal
Boot

Joined: 05 Jun 2007
Posts: 43
Location: Deep within your psyche
TGI Fridays wrote:
answers are
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
the union, save jenna, feet beneath the street
tried it in a dummy account and it works. He's right.


Having the answer in front of me, I was able to figure out how it was done.
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
From baada's message, look at http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2002/20023113.htm#sch7. Have a look at the various signs. The first sign, "dual carriageway ends ahead", is sign number 520. Lose the hundreds place, and we have 20 ("T" is letter 20 in the alphabet).

This also explains why different signs are sometimes used for the same letter -- there are also signs numbered 6xx, etc.

Oh, and I can vouch for the correctness of the answer. I'm #4 on the "agents solved" list.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:49 am
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