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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: Cloverfield (1-18-08) » Cloverfield: General / Updates
[SPEC]Extremophiles
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Dr. Awkward
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Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 374
Location: Marunouchi - Tokyo, Japan

Kaitei no mitsu is an animal...
Develops through chemosynthesis...

smartmart wrote:
Sure. But the warmth of a mouth is nothing compared to the near boiling heat of the water around a hydrothermal vents.


I'm gonna take a leap and suggest the temperature neccessary to
awaken the bacteria, or extremophile, or whatever this secret ingredient
actually is, is well below the 700 degrees or so ejected from a
hydrothermal ridge vent, or black smoker. Although some deep sea life
does flourish in these harsh conditions, it's not neccessarily dependent on
such extreme heat.

Another important discovery is that what ever Seabed Honey is,
it's, most likely, certainly alive and part of the animal kingdom.

Sunlight penetrates no farther than a few hundred feet down, leaving the
deep-sea floor as dark as the deepest cave. With no sunlight, there are
no plants; therefore, kaitei no mitsu, as well as all vent life,
belongs to the animal kingdom
.

And with no plants, there is no photosynthesis. All other life ever
identified, on land or in the sea, derives its energy either directly or
indirectly from the sun.

Vent species rely not on photons from the sun, but rather on chemicals
from the Earth's interior.

At any rate, it seems plausible to suggest they develop through
chemosynthesis, like all vent life discovered at these depths.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 8:28 pm
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Kraker
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Joined: 29 Jul 2007
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Re: Kaitei no mitsu is an animal...
Develops through chemosynthesis...

Dr. Awkward wrote:
smartmart wrote:
Sure. But the warmth of a mouth is nothing compared to the near boiling heat of the water around a hydrothermal vents.


I'm gonna take a leap and suggest the temperature neccessary to
awaken the bacteria, or extremophile, or whatever this secret ingredient
actually is, is well below the 700 degrees or so ejected from a
hydrothermal ridge vent, or black smoker. Although some deep sea life
does flourish in these harsh conditions, it's not neccessarily dependent on
such extreme heat.

Another important discovery is that what ever Seabed Honey is,
it's, most likely, certainly alive and part of the animal kingdom.

Sunlight penetrates no farther than a few hundred feet down, leaving the
deep-sea floor as dark as the deepest cave. With no sunlight, there are
no plants; therefore, kaitei no mitsu, as well as all vent life,
belongs to the animal kingdom
.

And with no plants, there is no photosynthesis. All other life ever
identified, on land or in the sea, derives its energy either directly or
indirectly from the sun.

Vent species rely not on photons from the sun, but rather on chemicals
from the Earth's interior.

At any rate, it seems plausible to suggest they develop through
chemosynthesis, like all vent life discovered at these depths.


Hmmm, why do you consider it to be an animal, because it can't be a plant.

Honey is neither...

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 8:35 pm
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Hurley
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Joined: 05 Oct 2007
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Location: Where the surfing is good...

Isn't honey considered a by-product of saliva secretions by bees in the process of hive building?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 8:41 pm
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smartmart
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Joined: 26 Jul 2007
Posts: 351

Re: Kaitei no mitsu is an animal...
Develops through chemosynthesis...

Dr. Awkward wrote:
smartmart wrote:
Sure. But the warmth of a mouth is nothing compared to the near boiling heat of the water around a hydrothermal vents.


I'm gonna take a leap and suggest the temperature neccessary to
awaken the bacteria, or extremophile, or whatever this secret ingredient
actually is, is well below the 700 degrees or so ejected from a
hydrothermal ridge vent, or black smoker. Although some deep sea life
does flourish in these harsh conditions, it's not neccessarily dependent on
such extreme heat.

Another important discovery is that what ever Seabed Honey is,
it's, most likely, certainly alive and part of the animal kingdom.

Sunlight penetrates no farther than a few hundred feet down, leaving the
deep-sea floor as dark as the deepest cave. With no sunlight, there are
no plants; therefore, kaitei no mitsu, as well as all vent life,
belongs to the animal kingdom
.

And with no plants, there is no photosynthesis. All other life ever
identified, on land or in the sea, derives its energy either directly or
indirectly from the sun.

Vent species rely not on photons from the sun, but rather on chemicals
from the Earth's interior.

At any rate, it seems plausible to suggest they develop through
chemosynthesis, like all vent life discovered at these depths.


100% agree on that. That is why I stated that the temparature around the vent gets cooler when you get away from it. So the DSN is ,as far as we know, a micro-organism that is associated with an hydrothermal vent ecosystem and grows on a substrate that is exposed to heat source comparable to the human body

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 8:58 pm
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Melampus
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Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 653

The only reason I think it's important that it melts in your mouth (not in your hands), is because of the procedures put in place to keep it cold "to preserve its flavor." If you have to keep it cold in order to preserve the flavor, then one could assume that the flavor is only 'there' when it's cold, but it wouldn't stay cold in a person's mouth/throat/stomach, so that can't be right. If people smelled frozen Slusho, then it would make sense to say that one had to keep it cold to keep it "flavorful," but people drink it. And, even if it did stay cold in a person's mouth, it would just numb the tastebuds and have relatively less impact on the olfactory system - since it's cold. On the other hand, if it releases some chemicals when it gets warm, and these chemicals could stimulate rare receptor combinations in the tongue (to account for its "inscrutable" taste - MacDooble), and also send up torrents of chemicals into the consumer's olfactory system, triggering narcotic effects, then it would make sense to keep it cold in order to "preserve its flavor." That's all I was thinking.

It's based only on the facts that (1) it's essential to keep Slusho cold until serving; and, (2) it's ingested orally; and, (3) any frozen food (e.g., ice cream) begins to immediately melt once placed in the mouth, and this triggers the release of chemicals that are more smelt than tasted (e.g., you smell the "flavor" of ice cream because it melts in your mouth); and, (4) the general process described in the YMR 'day in the life' article about "fermentation" (i.e., incubating/warming bacteria to trigger the release of bioactive chemical compounds).

The real question is: Even if this is right, WTF does it have to do with a giant monster attacking New York? Confused

EDIT: And, even before getting to the monster connection, I still don't have any idea how/why a person would have to drink SEVEN slushos in order to get the real effect. I suppose there could be a cumulative effect in the central nervous system, of the chemicals released. MacDooble ate chilled salmon and asparagus and he was flyin' high! So, why can't they put the right concentration in just ONE drink? I dunno.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:31 pm
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smartmart
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We will be served with Hollywood magic for the link slusho-monster. Chilled...

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:42 pm
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Dr. Awkward
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Joined: 28 Sep 2007
Posts: 374
Location: Marunouchi - Tokyo, Japan

Re: Kaitei no mitsu is an animal...
Develops through chemosynthesis...

Kraker wrote:
Dr. Awkward wrote:
smartmart wrote:
Sure. But the warmth of a mouth is nothing compared to the near boiling heat of the water around a hydrothermal vents.


I'm gonna take a leap and suggest the temperature neccessary to
awaken the bacteria, or extremophile, or whatever this secret ingredient
actually is, is well below the 700 degrees or so ejected from a
hydrothermal ridge vent, or black smoker. Although some deep sea life
does flourish in these harsh conditions, it's not neccessarily dependent on
such extreme heat.

Another important discovery is that what ever Seabed Honey is,
it's, most likely, certainly alive and part of the animal kingdom.

Sunlight penetrates no farther than a few hundred feet down, leaving the
deep-sea floor as dark as the deepest cave. With no sunlight, there are
no plants; therefore, kaitei no mitsu, as well as all vent life,
belongs to the animal kingdom
.

And with no plants, there is no photosynthesis. All other life ever
identified, on land or in the sea, derives its energy either directly or
indirectly from the sun.

Vent species rely not on photons from the sun, but rather on chemicals
from the Earth's interior.

At any rate, it seems plausible to suggest they develop through
chemosynthesis, like all vent life discovered at these depths
.


Hmmm, why do you consider it to be an animal, because it can't be a plant.

Honey is neither...


That's where I was headed...but you cut me off at the pass. (the animal/plant...not the honey).
Good observation Krake Brownie

So kaitei no mitsu could potentially be a by-product of saliva secretions
from some undiscovered animal whose under sea floor hives are
inadvertantly being drilled into and tapped and marketed and
merchandised... Shocked
_________________
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Launch Randomousity Chat ...
Do nine men interpret? Nine men, I nod.


PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 10:04 pm
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Red Walrus
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Joined: 24 Jul 2007
Posts: 589

I just glad this is finally being talked about . This thread died quickly weeks ago with hardly any views, (thanks Colbybrook).

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 10:20 pm
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Hurley
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Joined: 05 Oct 2007
Posts: 299
Location: Where the surfing is good...

Now, if this is going the right way, and we're under the assumption that DSI is a chemical by-product, or a secretion, of an unknown, or possibly known species, how about this. If it's a secretion, and it's purportedly being mined by Tagruato, is there only a finite amount? Could it be possible that whatever creature is the excreter is being destroyed or eliminated in the process of extraction. IF DSI is the main ingredient in something as incredibly popular as Slusho, and unless it can be synthesized, they'd be running out of options of availability soon. That could explain the spurious instances of drilling platforms, and the development of tech to delve deeper into the earths crust. Perhaps Ganu and company, (every evil empire has a board) are racing the clock trying to find new sites.

Brings up three questions, for me, at least.

Could they be trying to drill on land, say in an area that fits the criteria for discovery, there would have to be geological tells as to where the most likely hotspots are.
And what's to stop them from calling it anything besides experimental test site drilling.

And if the DSI is a naturally occurring enzyme, produced by an organism. What organism would be it's major predator/benefactor in the food chain? Everything has something one step higher on the food chain, even an unarmed, weaponless human being.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:10 pm
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Melampus
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Joined: 25 Jul 2007
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Good point, Hurley. What would eat these things? Nuthin'. Certainly, nothing really BIG (it would have to eat A LOT of them, every day - like a filter-feeding whale).

Seems like there are 2 general possibilities for a link between Slusho and the monster:

1. Slusho is a Sideshow - Tagruato stumbles upon some sleeping giant, and all hell breaks loose; or,

2. the 'bioactive' properties of one or more of the chemical compounds they discover in their YMR research allows them to 'grow' a monster, or allows them to start research on something... that goes horribly wrong!!! (cue: dramatic music). Actually, Slusho would be a sideshow in this scenario as well.

I still can't imagine anything REMOTELY plausible that directly ties Slusho, the beverage, to the monster. Anyone...? Bueller...?

PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 1:34 am
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Hurley
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Location: Where the surfing is good...

Melampus wrote:
Good point, Hurley. What would eat these things? Nuthin'. Certainly, nothing really BIG (it would have to eat A LOT of them, every day - like a filter-feeding whale).

Seems like there are 2 general possibilities for a link between Slusho and the monster:

1. Slusho is a Sideshow - Tagruato stumbles upon some sleeping giant, and all hell breaks loose; or,

2. the 'bioactive' properties of one or more of the chemical compounds they discover in their YMR research allows them to 'grow' a monster, or allows them to start research on something... that goes horribly wrong!!! (cue: dramatic music). Actually, Slusho would be a sideshow in this scenario as well.

I still can't imagine anything REMOTELY plausible that directly ties Slusho, the beverage, to the monster. Anyone...? Bueller...?


Check my thoughts on the Ganu thread, makes sense to me, but always up for crit.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2007 1:43 am
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Red Walrus
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Joined: 24 Jul 2007
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Just some "real world" web sites that illustrate what Yoshida Medical Research is doing with it's extremophile research.

link 1

link 2

link 3

Edit - Embedded stretchy links - MikeyJ

PostPosted: Sun Oct 28, 2007 12:55 am
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Rabbit216
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Joined: 11 Oct 2007
Posts: 42
Location: Cincinnati, Ohio

Red Walrus wrote:
Just some "real world" web sites that illustrate what Yoshida Medical Research is doing with it's extremophile research.

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:dcUKSJe1ySEJ:www.accessexcellence.org/RC/AB/BA/1297xtremo.html+cheese+whale+extremophiles&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=ca

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:MLwZ6gesJwwJ:alrlab.pdx.edu/media/currentOBiotech06.pdf+smallest+whale+extremophile&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=ca

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:KCDBaqI9T8MJ:www.germaine-de-capuccini.co.uk/view/product.do%3Fid%3D69+Paraffinum+extremophile&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2&gl=ca


very interesting stuff! thanks for the post Very Happy

PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:28 am
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tigerbaby
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Joined: 29 Oct 2007
Posts: 124

maybe its like that episode of futurama with the poplers
seabed nectar isn't a by product of the monster its the monsters babies!!! she wants to save them and eat anyone who ate any of them
or just kill everyone by raising earth's temperature by 100degrees a day

PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 1:53 pm
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Euchre
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Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 3342

It's amazing what you stumble upon when looking for haiku fodder.

So I was searching for things relative to extremophiles (and it's other spelling, extremeophiles) and found this article at the previous noted accessexcellence.org site:
http://www.accessexcellence.org/WN/SUA10/extreme797.html
The article is about polychaetes worms found that feed on frozen methane in the deep ocean. I found this interesting, because most study and much of the previous discussions here involved the kind of life that exists near the extremely hot ocean vents. Seabed's Nectar, kaitei no mitsu, has to be cold and kept that way - so this seemed to fit a little better.
They look pretty interesting when they are in the native habitat:
http://www.science.psu.edu/iceworms/viewxclose.html
You can even see some video of them (is there anything not recorded and uploaded to YouTube?):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPBAldAOjfk

No, I don't think our monster is a methane eating worm. I think this kind of creature gives us an idea where our monster comes from though. Suppose there's something that ends up eating those worms after they've been disturbed from their habitat?
Baleen anyone?
Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 1:19 am
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