Return to Unfiction unforum
 a.r.g.b.b 
FAQ FAQ   Search Search 
 
Welcome!
New users, PLEASE read these forum guidelines. New posters, SEARCH before posting and read these rules before posting your killer new campaign. New players may also wish to peruse the ARG Player Tutorial.

All users must abide by the Terms of Service.
Website Restoration Project
This archiving project is a collaboration between Unfiction and Sean Stacey (SpaceBass), Brian Enigma (BrianEnigma), and Laura E. Hall (lehall) with
the Center for Immersive Arts.
Announcements
This is a static snapshot of the
Unfiction forums, as of
July 23, 2017.
This site is intended as an archive to chronicle the history of Alternate Reality Games.
  

The time now is Mon Nov 25, 2024 5:20 am
All times are UTC - 4 (DST in action)		 View posts in this forum since last visit
View unanswered posts in this forum
Calendar
 Forum index » Archive » Archive: Cloverfield (1-18-08) » Cloverfield: General / Updates
[META/RANT]Election year political allegory
View previous topicView next topic
Page 3 of 4 [54 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4 Next
Author Message
brettoniasam
Unfettered


Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Posts: 340
clownnation wrote:
Also the Writer's strike would'nt effect the viral marketing. The writer's strike prohibits members of the writers guild to submit screenplays to studios or networks.

Networks and Studios have known of the strike for a long time. They have stockpiled screenplays so they can continue to make films without new writers for several months.


I've wondered about that, too.
SURELY someone with their finger on the pulse of Hollywood like JJ Abrams would have known about the strike months beforehand, and would have completed the "scripts" for all the viral stuff like jamielovesteddy.com and tagruato.jp well in advance.

That's why it surprises me that the websites have remained silent since the strike began.


Quote:
Thats why I think Cloverfield was greenlit with a $30 mil budget.


It was also greenlit because, according to a Variety article many months ago, JJ added a clause to his megabucks deal with Paramount that said he wanted to make -- in addition to big-budget fare like Trek and Dark Tower -- "smaller" films that were more character/plot-driven than fx-laden, at "around a $25 million budget."

Edit - bbcode - MikeyJ

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:01 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
clownnation
Decorated

Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 160
brettoniasam wrote:
clownnation wrote:
Also the Writer's strike would'nt effect the viral marketing. The writer's strike prohibits members of the writers guild to submit screenplays to studios or networks.

Networks and Studios have known of the strike for a long time. They have stockpiled screenplays so they can continue to make films without new writers for several months.


I've wondered about that, too.
SURELY someone with their finger on the pulse of Hollywood like JJ Abrams would have known about the strike months beforehand, and would have completed the "scripts" for all the viral stuff like jamielovesteddy.com and tagruato.jp well in advance.

That's why it surprises me that the websites have remained silent since the strike began.




Yeah, Hollywood wasnt blind sided with the strike. They make most of thier money on DVD sales. The writers back in 1987 or whenever it was, didnt really think that people would buy into home video THAT much and only agreed to less than a percent of VHS sales. (back then VCRs were high luxury items, videos didnt sell too much, no one knew what impact Video Rental places would have)

Now that contract has run out and Writers want a substantial cut of home video takes. The SAD thing is the Screen Actors Guild representatives claim that if the Writers get a riase, then they will demand one too.) My friend is a special effects guy, who could be out of work for a LOOONG time. (He is starting a new buisness as we speak) www.Frightstuff.com / WWW.Frightstuff.com/frightforums

Edit - bbcode - MikeyJ

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:08 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Patrick Star
Unfettered


Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 409
Location: Oregon

 		Re: [META/RANT]Election year political allegory
brettoniasam wrote:
Patrick Star wrote:
brettoniasam wrote:
So...

the new trailer pretty much confirms what I've been saying all along:

This is an avant-garde, experimental thinly-veiled political allegory condemning the politics of deceit and fear that this Bush administration has inflicted upon America (and the world) for the past 7 years.

Monsters? What monsters? The "monsters" you "see" (or THINK you see) in the new trailer are absolutely and deliberately as vague and open to interpretation as any "real" video of boogeymen and bugbears like Bigfoot and ghosts and space aliens.

And, as many have long surmised, you've got damn good odds that the full movie won't give you any clearer shot of the "monsters" than what you already "see" in the trailer.

That's cuz they ain't there. Simple enough plot, seen it a thousand times before: military creates killer virus for biowarfare; accidentally releases it in America; needs to kill off the poor bastards who are infected; need to create a cover(up) story to explain all the deaths; so they invent a story about "monsters" in order to quarantine Manhattan and kill off the disease carriers.

In much the same way that Cheney-Bush lie and invent nonexistent "imminent threats" to cover up their real reasons for military adventurism/conquest in the Middle East. You don't have to be Fellini to see the political symbolism there.

And considering that this movie is falling close on the heels of a veritable rash of anti-Bush/anti-Iraq War movies (In the Valley of Elah; Rendition; Lions for Lambs; more to come) in an election year...

...and considering that those other movies failed at the box office (hey, Hollywood is preaching to the choir: we KNOW Bush lied. We GET it. These movies would have been edgy/ controversial/ effective two, three years ago; but now they're just redundant. Too little, too late), I'm sure "Cloverfield" will meet a similar fate among the art-house intelligentsia and the confused fanboys who were expecting a classic monster movie.


OMG you need an MRI Stat! Rolling Eyes


And you, Patrick Star, need an enema. Cheers. Very Happy


Well you know the old saying "Keep your friends close and your enemas closer".

It's just that left wing whacked out theory is overused by the KOS giplings.

But this really is not the place for it huh?

[SPEC] Just to put this discussion back on track. I bet the Bush Administration actually produced this monster in a mobile lab just so they could acquire the ocean's resources, slusho, oil and isopods for their evil war in Toon Town. It makes sense. Cheney did not have a heart attack he exploded like Marlena, although repaired he still manages to chip away at our freedom. And no doubt Bush is owned by Tagruato or at least has heavy stock in them. They embedded a chip in his head that makes him do everything Ganu wants him to like 9/11, the war in Iraq and the destruction of the constitution. Yea, that's the ticket, yea.

Sounds kind of like your theory I know, but I swear I did not plagiarize.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:09 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
brettoniasam
Unfettered


Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Posts: 340

 		Re: [META/RANT]Election year political allegory
Patrick Star wrote:

Well you know the old saying "Keep your friends close and your enemas closer".

It's just that left wing whacked out theory is overused by the KOS giplings.

But this really is not the place for it huh?

[SPEC] Just to put this discussion back on track. I bet the Bush Administration actually produced this monster in a mobile lab just so they could acquire the ocean's resources, slusho, oil and isopods for their evil war in Toon Town. It makes sense. Cheney did not have a heart attack he exploded like Marlena, although repaired he still manages to chip away at our freedom. And no doubt Bush is owned by Tagruato or at least has heavy stock in them. They embedded a chip in his head that makes him do everything Ganu wants him to like 9/11, the war in Iraq and the destruction of the constitution. Yea, that's the ticket, yea.

Sounds kind of like your theory I know, but I swear I did not plagiarize.


Q: What the hell is a "KOS gipling?" ...No, scratch that -- I'd rather not know.

Listen, n00b, since you're new to the boards AND the thread, allow me to point out that a few pages ago, I DROPPED the political debate. We're having a civilized discussion about the WGA strike and kaiju movies right now, so either keep up or keep out. Cappice? Wink

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:14 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Patrick Star
Unfettered


Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 409
Location: Oregon

 		Re: [META/RANT]Election year political allegory
brettoniasam wrote:
Patrick Star wrote:

Well you know the old saying "Keep your friends close and your enemas closer".

It's just that left wing whacked out theory is overused by the KOS giplings.

But this really is not the place for it huh?

[SPEC] Just to put this discussion back on track. I bet the Bush Administration actually produced this monster in a mobile lab just so they could acquire the ocean's resources, slusho, oil and isopods for their evil war in Toon Town. It makes sense. Cheney did not have a heart attack he exploded like Marlena, although repaired he still manages to chip away at our freedom. And no doubt Bush is owned by Tagruato or at least has heavy stock in them. They embedded a chip in his head that makes him do everything Ganu wants him to like 9/11, the war in Iraq and the destruction of the constitution. Yea, that's the ticket, yea.

Sounds kind of like your theory I know, but I swear I did not plagiarize.


Q: What the hell is a "KOS gipling?" ...No, scratch that -- I'd rather not know.

Listen, n00b, since you're new to the boards AND the thread, allow me to point out that a few pages ago, I DROPPED the political debate. We're having a civilized discussion about the WGA strike and kaiju movies right now, so either keep up or keep out. Cappice? Wink


Yup, always a warm welcome from Uf's top dogs in the threads. Wow, do I smell Gingerbread cookies baking. I love it here. It's more of a dry heat, but lovely none the less.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:18 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
clownnation
Decorated

Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 160

 		Come on, your just picking a fight at this point. I totally dissagree with his political views, and his thoughts on the meanings behind this movie, but you dont see us going at it. You said your piece, stop insulting please. Just add to the discussion.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:20 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
brettoniasam
Unfettered


Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Posts: 340

 		Re: [META/RANT]Election year political allegory
Patrick Star wrote:
brettoniasam wrote:
Patrick Star wrote:

Well you know the old saying "Keep your friends close and your enemas closer".

It's just that left wing whacked out theory is overused by the KOS giplings.

But this really is not the place for it huh?

[SPEC] Just to put this discussion back on track. I bet the Bush Administration actually produced this monster in a mobile lab just so they could acquire the ocean's resources, slusho, oil and isopods for their evil war in Toon Town. It makes sense. Cheney did not have a heart attack he exploded like Marlena, although repaired he still manages to chip away at our freedom. And no doubt Bush is owned by Tagruato or at least has heavy stock in them. They embedded a chip in his head that makes him do everything Ganu wants him to like 9/11, the war in Iraq and the destruction of the constitution. Yea, that's the ticket, yea.

Sounds kind of like your theory I know, but I swear I did not plagiarize.


Q: What the hell is a "KOS gipling?" ...No, scratch that -- I'd rather not know.

Listen, n00b, since you're new to the boards AND the thread, allow me to point out that a few pages ago, I DROPPED the political debate. We're having a civilized discussion about the WGA strike and kaiju movies right now, so either keep up or keep out. Cappice? Wink


Yup, always a warm welcome from Uf's top dogs in the threads. Wow, do I smell Gingerbread cookies baking. I love it here. It's more of a dry heat, but lovely none the less.


Not gingerbread....it's brownies. Here, have one. Brownie Yum!
Nighty-night, y'all. Drool

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:21 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Chump Force 1
Decorated


Joined: 13 Sep 2007
Posts: 286
Location: Next in line after 'Client 9'

 		I personally think it would be a creative cop-out by the producers and writers of this movie if it went in the direction of a "government cover-up/bio-warfare created monster.

Everything about this movie to date has been fresh and original (well, as fresh and original as a traditional monster movie can be). To basically punt and go with the tired and used Hollywood "government conspiracy" formula seems contrived and stale to me.

Besides, nothing on the ARG/E side would indicate this is the case (Slusho, Tagruato, etc). Everything so far points to some Japanese Corporation either accidentally or purposely discovering the monster(s?).

The only thing I will give you is the name Cloverfield. This could be a codename for some Government weapon or something, but other then that, nothing else points in that direction.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:24 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Patrick Star
Unfettered


Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 409
Location: Oregon
Chump Force 1 wrote:
I personally think it would be a creative cop-out by the producers and writers of this movie if it went in the direction of a "government cover-up/bio-warfare created monster.

Everything about this movie to date has been fresh and original (well, as fresh and original as a traditional monster movie can be). To basically punt and go with the tired and used Hollywood "government conspiracy" formula seems contrived and stale to me.

Besides, nothing on the ARG/E side would indicate this is the case (Slusho, Tagruato, etc). Everything so far points to some Japanese Corporation either accidentally or purposely discovering the monster(s?).

The only thing I will give you is the name Cloverfield. This could be a codename for some Government weapon or something, but other then that, nothing else points in that direction.


"MULTIPLE SIGHTINGS OF CASE DESIGNATE CLOVERFIELD". Sure sounds like they have been keeping an eye on the thing for a bit.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:31 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
Bacon Army
Unfettered


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 447

 		Here's the big problem behind any political conspiracy theory plot - why would the US Government make public these tapes unless - UNLESS - there was nothing in there that was directly incriminating? It's highly unlikely that politics will factor into this at all, other than the occasional pixellated face. It's a simple monster movie. It's going to have religious symbology and maybe one or two political references - what Abrams project doesn't? - but that doesn't mean that it's not going to be what JJ's promised - Biggie rampaging through NY, and the tale of the Slusho 7 (or however many are left) picking their way through the disaster.

Simple.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:54 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
detranova
Veteran


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 74
Location: North Billerica, MA/Yidu, Hubei, China

 		Speculation is as Healthy as Skepticism on These Forums...
Bacon Army wrote:
Here's the big problem behind any political conspiracy theory plot - why would the US Government make public these tapes unless - UNLESS - there was nothing in there that was directly incriminating?


But are we sure that the Government authorized this release? The pixellation could be to hide the identity of someone so important that their own personnel can't even know about (black ops?), and then this tape may have been stolen by someone wanting the public to know the truth.

The one thing about the trailer that's been bothering me is how calm HUD is when explaining why he's still recording. It doesn't sound like someone who's just witnessed a giant monster crushing building into dust and coming out on top of a confrontation with the Army/National Guard with nary a scratch. It does, however, sound like someone who's more perplexed than afraid, as in "that monster seems to crushing specific buildings", and "wow, the army sure got here fast! And they don't seem to be surprised by all this...I'd better keep recording!".

Additionally, the conspiracy theory idea would fit in with the Watchmen analogies and references. Remember guys, a conspiracy theory subplot wouldn't exactly be enough to make a 200 foot-tall beastie any less entertaining. Brettoniasam's argument makes sense, as this movie isn't your average monster flick, given it's $30 million budget. Just look at Sushine, a movie with a comparable budget, and how it's revolutionary for modern sci-fi.

For the record, I think it's necessary for us to continue to speculate, as Brettoniasam has done, lest we become too sure or too invested in any one other theory. All possibilities are still open, and will remain so until the movie hits theaters. Even then, deleted scenes and alternate endings ensure that any idea could still be correct even after the movie starts screening. Until we've all seen the movie and watched all the inevitable 120 hours of bonus features (hopefully including a featurette devoted to us...or better yet, me!), let's not be too eager to dismiss other people's ideas. At least give some concrete and inarguable proof if you're going to do so.

Also, about the WGA strike...forgive me if I'm mistaken, but I don't think ARG writers would be covered under the WGA. I believe WGA membership is limited to live-action theater arts and whatnot, and they don't even cover some cartoon writers, so it's unlikely ARG people would be included. Then again, do ARG writers even have a union? This is, of course, is assuming that these writers have not previously been involved in motion pictures, and were brought in solely because of their experience with ARGs. Ultimately, I don't think they'd ever get called out for crossing a picket line, mostly because I doubt anyone would recognize/know who they were.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:24 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address
 Back to top 
Saiyan King
Unfettered


Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 599
Location: Orlando, The crappiest town in America, thanks to Disney

 		Could be the follow up code name
Patrick Star wrote:
Chump Force 1 wrote:
I personally think it would be a creative cop-out by the producers and writers of this movie if it went in the direction of a "government cover-up/bio-warfare created monster.

Everything about this movie to date has been fresh and original (well, as fresh and original as a traditional monster movie can be). To basically punt and go with the tired and used Hollywood "government conspiracy" formula seems contrived and stale to me.

Besides, nothing on the ARG/E side would indicate this is the case (Slusho, Tagruato, etc). Everything so far points to some Japanese Corporation either accidentally or purposely discovering the monster(s?).

The only thing I will give you is the name Cloverfield. This could be a codename for some Government weapon or something, but other then that, nothing else points in that direction.


"MULTIPLE SIGHTINGS OF CASE DESIGNATE CLOVERFIELD". Sure sounds like they have been keeping an eye on the thing for a bit.


This could be the code name for the event after the fact. We dont know how long after it happens that the footage would be released. Obviously they took time to edit it up and all, thus Cloverfield could be the operational name for the military response

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:33 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
motrbotr
Boot

Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 52
brettoniasam wrote:
I have no desire to enter into a debate about it either.

And I'm not saying what theories I *do* believe about 9/11, Iraq, Bush or anything else, any more than what I already wrote above.

I was merely pointing out that I truly believe that ABRAMS seems to lean towards that kind of theory, and that it's no accident that this movie is set in New York or that the cinema verite handheld camera approach is deliberately evocative of the 9/11 footage we've seen countless times.

Tell you what -- I'll check back after the movie's release and we'll see if my theory still deserves a Screwy . But if I'm right, you better believe I'll be dishing out the humble pie to some of you guys. Razz


Again, the Screwy was in regards to your 9/11 conspracy theory. Regarding the movie, I think you may have something. It very well be a government coverup or military experiment gone wrong. I would lean towards the last one though. I am guessing the population of New York is what, 8 million plus? Probably more. How do you cover that up. Even if only 1 percent of the population were to survive this attack by this creature, thats still 80,000 to try to round up and silence. Seems like an impossible job. I dont know. just rambling here.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 9:33 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
gypsy songman
Veteran

Joined: 11 Oct 2007
Posts: 139
brettoniasam wrote:
But. You know the old Tennyson line as well as I do about "Theirs not to reason why, theirs but to do or die..." You're doing your duty, and that's great. It's not your part to play politics or understand politics -- you HAVE to go wherever the White House sends you.


You got the spirit but not the syntax. Sad The line is actually, "Theirs is not to question why, theirs is but to do and die."

Sorry for the minor correction, back to the Kaiju debate. Smile

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 1:33 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
kosmopol
I Never Tire of My Own Voice


Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 3167

 		This discussion sounds like echo of my feelings after I've seen the trailer.

The movie is really not about monster, I fully agree with brettoniasam. This is about us, about our fears, about lies.
The whole move seems to be (at least after the trailer) a top secret footage of an incident, which sarcastical, typically political euphemism. So the military staff is blured, but civils aren't. They are just "victims", or "collateral damages".

At first time I thought about 9/11-parallels I was like "if it's about a monster destroying USA, and Liberty head flies through the streets, and innocent people are killed by this monster, it could be very primitive, "patriot act"-alike demagogical allegory like "Independence Day". like "kill the as**les for our freedom"... Very untypical for JJ Abrams". But after I've seen the second trailer, I understood, this IS JJ Abrams bitter irony.

The government doesn't much care about its people, it cares about the monster, which (perhaps) was constructed by him. OK, truely, after 2 minutes of the trailer I cannot analyse the whole movie. But I think, the focus of the movie is about this political schizophrenia.

And also about people, how they handle with themselves, and with situation around them. Like it was in Lost: the main theme weren't that idyllic paradise islands, and also not that smoke monsters etcetera, but people with their existential problems.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 4:59 pm
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 3 of 4 [54 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, 4 Next
View previous topicView next topic
 Forum index » Archive » Archive: Cloverfield (1-18-08) » Cloverfield: General / Updates
Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
You cannot post calendar events in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group