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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: General » Low-Volume Games
[STORIES] [TRAILHEAD] We Tell Stories
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IngyW
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Joined: 08 Apr 2008
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Location: Oxofrdshire, UK
The true hidden names
Cabbage wrote:
How hidden are these names (especially that of John Dee) to Thomas? Or are they only hidden to the hookah-smoking caterpillar?


M-A seems to know something of their true names at least:
Quote:
I have a shrewd idea who my enemy is – or rather my enemies

I guess it's just too dangerous for M_A & Hattie to tell them in the email. I'm guessing it'll be in a book that we'll help Alice find.

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 5:28 am
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batgirl
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Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 261
Location: London

 		Work takes over my life for a couple of days an all the excitement happens!

Looks like the grand finale will be on Thursday at 8pm then, gutted I can't make that - I have rehearsals and I had this miss this week's for being at work as it was Sad

Bring on running around london for The Mirror of Ink book though!

Cabbage, I'm highly impressed with your crossword puzzle solving!! Very Happy

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 5:31 am
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Cabbage
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Joined: 22 May 2006
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Location: North-East England, UK

 		Thanks! Bit annoyed that I am apparently unable to anagram kin to ink, though Sad

Updated list of names:
List of names:
John Dee
Tweedle Dee
007 * 1

Dr Doom
Tweedle Dum
Harrison Maltravers
Dr Destiny * 2
Doctor Niles Caulder * 3

The Devil
Edward Kelley
Jungian archetype e.g. Trickster


Both
Dan / Adrian Smile
Hermes / Thoth (Hermes Trismegistus)
Tezcatlipoca and Quetalcoatl


Have I missed any out?

* 1 see www.skyscript.co.uk/dee.html
quote: It is believed that Dee became a secret double agent to the queen in England's war with Spain and in his private communications with Elizabeth, the secret name identifying him to Queen Elizabeth is reputed to have been that of 007 (I think that this has been mentioned before)

* 2 Dr Destiny (there are startling parallels with what they are trying to do with stories and the obsidian mirror and what Dr Destiny tried to do with dreams using his "materioptikon" see wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr_Destiny if you haven't read it already!)

* 3 From what I have read Dr Niles Caulder was a good guy, wasn't he?

At the end, when we discover the true identity of Dr Doom, aren't we all supposed to go - "Oh yeah! Why didn't we think of that" ? That's why I'm sticking with my Devil theory (for now anyway). Mr. Green
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 6:45 am
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AndyAndyO
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Posts: 70

 		One of the tales in The Mirror of Ink book is entitled 'Ragnarok' - named after the final legendary battle of the Norse Gods - and now also the name of a computer game.
On the following blog, the description seems interesting:
http://unholyhours.blogspot.com/2007/06/ragnarok.html
Quote:
I found "Labyrinths" by Borges. I remembered having a conversation where I interrupted someone because he said "Labyrinth by Borges" when it should be "Labyrinths." Borges has multitudes of labyrinthine stories. But I digress. One of the parables in the book is "Ragnarok." Borges had a dream where he met an old friend years ago and then someone shouted, "The Gods! The Gods!" First, the people applaused their arrival as they entered the main lecture hall. Until someone realized that just maybe the gods can not talk. The people realized that these gods no longer were godly but degenerate.
"Suddenly we sensed that they were playing their last card, that they were cunning, ignorant and cruel like old beasts of prey and that, if we let ourselves be overcome by fear or pity, they would finally destroy us," Borges wrote.
"We took our heavy revolvers (all of a sudden there were revolvers in the dream) and joyfully killed the Gods," he ended the story.

Some parallels to our seventh story - labyrinths, dreams, a final battle?

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 10:04 am
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veebee
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 		I see your point AndyAndyO!

I think the actual story called The Mirror of Ink is about, wait for it... Two brothers, one of whom is a Wizard. The other brother uses the mirror, has the Wizard put to death, then looks into the mirror again and sees his own death, and then dies at the shock of seeing himself die. Or something like that. Set in Egypt I think...

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 10:53 am
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Faustus
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Joined: 17 Apr 2008
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 		I go away clubbing for one night and day and it all kicks off. Ah well, at least I'm free on the 8th!

In terms of names I think both the brothers will be doctors... it would be a bit of a gyp now if it turned out that all the "dr" kloos turned out to be red herring and they were just pseudonyms, I think the real one of the pair might even be a doctor of the medical type, after all he does live near harley street, although that could be a coincidence.

The only thing being near harley street makes me think of in terms of famous evil doctors is Dr Moriarty, because Sherlock lived on Baker Street. But that's such a weak link I don't think there's any point persuing it, no matter how much I would love it if one of the doctors turned out to be Moriarty.

Having said they're both doctors I think we can safely rule out that they're Dr Dee or Dr Doom, because these are the names we're given as not being their real names, which makes me a bit skeptical of the John Dee/devil idea. Although that does put me on to the thought, perhaps they could be Dr Faustus and Mephistopheles? doubt it though, since mephistopheles isn't a Dr, Dr faustus isn't real and they're not brothers Smile

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 11:30 am
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Cabbage
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 		Do we know that Dr. John Dee isn't one of the true names? Alice has told us that Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum aren't right.

Marsh-Ayre said:
Quote:
I have a shrewd idea who my enemy is – or rather my enemies – and the fact that one of 'em's supposed to have been dead for 400 years and the other's supposed to be fictional just makes them more dangerous in my book.


This could confirm that one of 'em's John Dee and that we need to find out the other one's true name. I'm still researching around this idea; we know that John Dee was (in)famous for his "Conversations with Angels" and Enochian magic.

What about this as a true name:

Quote:
Samael

Samael (also Sammael) is an important archangel in Talmudic and post-Talmudic lore, as well as Christian tradition and demonology, a figure who is accuser, seducer, and destroyer. He has been regarded as (both good and) evil. In rabbinic lore he is identified as the chief of Satan's and the (bad) Angel of Death. In the Secrets of Enoch (Enoch II) he is a prince of demons and a magician. ... Samael is usually considered to be the true angelic name of Satan.


(Above is from Wikipedia)


EDIT: Having looked more and more into this, I am surprised that we haven't had any codes or ciphers (or have we?). Dee was a spy and a master of letters - have just downloaded an Enochian alphabet font from http://www.schuelers.com/enochian/fonts.htm, in case we need it this week!
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PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 12:26 pm
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veebee
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 		I suspect we will know all when we have finished running around London to find the book. I think our job was to work out what the book was, which you did. The next live event will give us more!

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2008 7:50 pm
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doublecross
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Location: London, UK

 		Having checked a few bookshops yesterday for the book, I have drawn a blank, but my google searching has yielded two plot summaries at
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=os_3_pqts6IC&pg=PA47&lpg=PA47&source=web&ots=Clo_GAvCxq&sig=1GtVfMKs9qkjev-MGNztYk42g7Q&hl=en#PPA47,M1 and http://www.newyorker.com/archive/1972/01/01/1972_01_01_025_TNY_CARDS_000301997


This yields three possibilities:
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Yaqub the Ailing
The Man in the Mask (sound familiar) who turns out to be YtA anyway and
The wizard Abd-er-Rahman Al-Masmudi


I'd plump for the second.
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 12:09 pm
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veebee
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 		I'd go for the wizard, because he had a brother in that tale....

And he was a Wizard.

PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 12:41 pm
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Cabbage
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Joined: 22 May 2006
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Quote:
Re: real names for the brothers. Have hidden them in a book


Does this mean that the names are supposed to be names from a story in the book that we have identified? And do the names alluded to above fit the criteria of "one of 'em's supposed to have been dead for 400 years" and "the other's supposed to be fictional"? It sounds like the brother and the wizard above are both fictional to me. I haven't read it, though and as our library only had the Aleph by Borges in the original Spanish, I couldn't check into this any further... Sad

I had interpreted "hidden them in a book" to mean that there would be another crumpled note within the book, once it has been found, wherever it may be Question


[OOG]Also, really hope that there is a large puzzle solving element to the live event so that those of us not in London can join in![/OOG]


PS Yay - we've done 1000 posts!


EDIT Has anyone looked into the significance of May 8th?

All I could find so far was that it is the day of the Apparition of Saint Michael - Samael's arch-enemy!

I know I'm probably going to turn out to be wrong, but it's a strange coincidence anyway.
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 2:28 pm
Last edited by Cabbage on Mon May 05, 2008 7:42 am; edited 4 times in total
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veebee
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 		I have been looking at May 8th, because it was bugging me. I haven't really found anything significant though. Sad

So you have probably hit on the most likely there, Cabbage!

PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 5:42 pm
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Cabbage
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Look out Hattie!
Alice in Treacle and Ink wrote:
He says that Dr Dee and Dr Doom are working towards a date and time - 8pm on the 8th of May, a time at which, apparently, Dr Dee's powers are especially strong. (Apparently that was a day when he did a lot of his prognosticating?).


The more times I read this, the more it sounds like a clue thrown out for us to find out more. And then I found this:

1583 May 8 John Dee and Edward Kelley are foretold by the Angel Uriel of the death of the Queen of Scots.

http://www.elizabethan-era.org.uk/john-dee.htm

* gulps *
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PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 8:47 am
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veebee
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 		Well done Cabbage. I've even read that page too Embarassed

PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 9:27 am
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Faustus
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Joined: 17 Apr 2008
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 		Surprised those dastards. In that case would that make their true names john dee and edward kelley? or john dee and someone fictional...

I only hope thomas can stop them...

PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 9:30 am
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