unforum

[veebee]

What constitutes a really good, juicy Secret?

[Nighthawk]

My LGL endgame didn't have a big secret: Joshua got away, Catherine died and there was much rejoicing.

[Lunsford]

I believe that a game that holds my interest all the way through (and doesn't implode) consitutes a good game. I like it when games have constant updates and a believable storyline. Also, ones that give you things to do throughout. The ending could just be a wrap-up of whatever events the game provided you with....

What type of ending is good to you veebee?

[highwind767]

Well it all depends on what the players are trying to do I guess. Are they trying to uncover the secret, or keep it hidden from someone? Obviously players would end up happy if they're successful in their task.

As for a secret, well that would depend on context as well. It'll depend on what the secrets about, and how big it is. Choose one depending on different factors.

In summary, just make sure that it's in the right context. Personally, I think the best ones would be those that would best suit you and your story veebee.
I wonder if I've even said anything useful in this post or just been vague and confusing. Ah well, hopefully it'll be of some use to you.

[veebee]

Thanks guys!
@ highwind: Yep, they are trying to uncover a very old secret, but won't know that that is what they have to do straight away, there will be other stuff to work out first! However, I kinda want to make the players feel they are privileged to know what the secret it.

@ Lunsford: I am expecting to be working on this for about two years before launch, so hopefully it won't implode! There will be regular "tasks" for players to complete throughout, hopefully ones that will mean they really have to share info they receive to work out their next move. What endings do I like? You are right, ones that are believable and most importantly, ones that tie up the threads of the tale and don't leave you asking "Yeah, but whatever happened to....?) Although if it goes well, one little loose end can be a good thing! Thanks for making me think about whai I would like, it is easy to lose sight of that when wondering how to please the masses!

@Nighthawk: I don't know if I can do that sort of thing now, as I have started work on the history that makes up the back-story, but I will bear it in mind if I get stuck!

Thanks again, still happy to hear anyones thoughts on this!

[faeryqueen21]

Wow, two years in the making. Make sure to send me that trailhead!

Also, just make sure the secret follows and makes sense within the story. If your story is about vampires the whole time, don't make the secret that aliens landed in Egypt thousands of years ago. Unless of course the aliens ARE the vampires. That would make sense.
Drop subtle clues throughout the game that will only make sense once the secret has been revealed. Then everyone can have a big, "Ah ha!" moment when it all comes together.

[Nighthawk]

[Lunsford]

WOW.. 2 years??!! Make sure I get that trailhead as well...

[veebee]

Thanks again!
@faeryqueen, thank for the tip about dropping in hint/clues that only make sense at the end. Good one!

Two years? Yep. Mainly because I want to get it right, and I don't want to put something out there that is rushed and unfinished. Plus it means I can have websites and blogs etc set up well in advance to give a believable backstory for that truly TINAG feel!!

I'm sure I will have lots more questions to ask along the way.....

[thegreatpablo]

Well, for me (feel free to take this or leave it), the satisfaction of endgame in what I would consider to be a good game revolves more around the characters than the plot itself. Sure, the plot could have a really cool and amazing twist, but if I'm not invested and/or care about the characters, then it means very little.

[Rekidk]

[DAN BROWN SPOILERS AHEAD]



Honestly--and I can't believe I'm saying this--you might want to look to Dan Brown's books for inspiration. As much as I dislike his lack of solid research, his recycling of plots, and his general butchering of English, the guy does spin a pretty good yarn.

You'll note that his "big secrets" tend to be Earth-shattering revelations: Jesus fathered a child with Mary Magdalene, the Pope fell in love and had a child, an ancient secret society's true mission was far more sinister than previously believed, politicians faked alien citings to win an election, etc.

It has to be big, something that affects not only yesterday but also today and the future.

[veebee]

Thanks again!
@Rekidk: I actually have "bit like Dan Brown but NOT" written at the beginning of my notes. I can't believe I just admitted that!
@Pablo: I agree. You have to want to invest in the characters or you lose interest in playing. I intend for the characters to be very believable, each one with a different personality so that most people should (hopefully) identify with a least one of them on some level. I'm trying to give them not just character, but distinct personalities. Another reason to spend 2 years in development!

[Silent|away]

I understand that I may be considered a hypocrtical person after PMing a game with tons of secrets and creating another game that has secrets galroe...

The difference is that my 'secrets' aren't really secrets. They usually get 'revealed' halfway through the story, only to provide players a grasp with what is going on, and it is more as 'curveballs' as opposed to something actively hidden. Actually knowing these secrets won't help you out in beating the game.

Let be honest, here. An ARG usually use the platforms of real life. If you find a message hidden in the source of a website, you found out the secret already. So I don't feel pressured to add any more secrets, as the players already know more than the average civilian. And, I don't believe a game should rely on any ancient secret at all. I don't think we should need that crutch, altough I think other people are big fans of twists, so maybe I shouldn't complain.

What we need more is more work on the endgame in general to allow players to sastifactorally defeat the end boss...or allow players to do anything they want in general. Players could have the standard great code-battle match between the End Boss and you. Or players could try something more subtle, like decieving/convicing the End Boss to the rightfulness of your cause. Or seeing both the Good Guys and the End Boss as evil, and work against both sides, to seize power for themselves.

I believe granting players ownership of the ending makes them say, "That was really worth it". Ego gratification is just plain cool.

[AtionSong]

Something that I think is important about building up to the reveal of a "secret" is just that - a build up. If you watch "Lost", they do an incredible job of this. The technique that is so effective is that they will spend two, three, or even more episodes with a big unknown hanging over all interaction, one that is often brought up, and the plot revolves around. Because of this, when the secret is revealed, it has a huge impact. The revealing of a secret simply at a random point with no build-up, foreshadowing, or other tension-building mechanism will lose its importance.

[madamimadam]

I constantly have a story going in my mind, and the secret is awesome

however, I agree with ationsong. The best part about a secret is trying to find out what it is. Just make sure it goes against whatever the player was thinking the whole time, even if it means planting tons of red herrings. You need an element of surprise.
And if you can't think of a good secret, the best thing might just be to hold off on your fic until you come up with one. Just think about it all the time; if you have the basic talent, you're bound to come up with something.