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 Forum index » Chaotic Fiction » Marble Hornets
[VIDEO] Entry #87
Moderators: Giskard, JKatkina, Zarggg
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Blackout_2014
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Joined: 22 Jun 2014
Posts: 109
Marble Hornets wrote:
I mean, Alex saw the operator take Jay, himself, and a few others who returned. He should have known Jessica was still alive.

It's the biggest plot hole in the series that is just going to be ignored

I love that the concensus is that mostly everyone was unsatisfied with the ending and they ignored that fact on the posdcast. I don't blame them for it, but it would be kind of neat to hear their reaction to the feedback


Hell I would just like to know why they returned. I know we were given a glimpse of it when Tim went to the operator verse, but it was never given a point.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 8:39 pm
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lonsumtravlr
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Joined: 23 Mar 2014
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Viden wrote:
Oh GOD no, you misunderstood what I was saying. I wasn't comparing Troy's director skills to anything. I was using an analogy to explain different peoples perspectives, albeit to an extreme. The Michael Bay effect is when people are impressed by effects and shock value rather than depth and substance. I mean I dislike the ending but it wasn't nearly THAT bad.

And that's a fair argument. Perhaps I was being too black and white about the whole thing. My apologies.


Well, there are no apologies necessary. I just don't want to be stereotyped as being a simple-minded fanboy about MH because I still love the series overall despite its flaws (which tended to accumulate in Season Three, reasons aside). They could have done a better job working that ending in. (I think Entry #76 is still the weakest link in the series, because even as an IG, in-series forgery it has some presentation issues.)

Though, for the record, except for a handful of entries in Season Three that I think were superlative (I've said time and again that Entry #64 is one of the greatest things ever filmed, and Entry #72 is pretty close, and Entry #69 captured much of the essence of what made Entry #64 so great without an explicit appearance of TO or of Hoody--and the entries in the 50's really set up what could have been [and in several instances was] some killer web series--and Entry #86, yes, breathless after that) and for the more expressionistic style that I really dig (and which I really think offers more clues than any of us realizes--I think a lot of the stuff that people are quibbling over or lamenting the purported lack of are actually in the composition of many of the entries), I do like the older entries better. Season One was tough to top, and much of Season Two yet did (Entry #51 still spooks the hell out of me, even with the desensitization). But Season Three was inconsistent.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 11:53 pm
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Dacad
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Joined: 25 Oct 2013
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 		Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 11:58 pm
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lonsumtravlr
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Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.


The symbol is the most problematic aspect you mention, I think. It woulda been nice to have just a little more suggestion about what it was, whether it was used to influence others to do what TO (for lack of a better term and hence the quotes) "wanted" or was apotropaic and turned TO away (Entries #13 and #56 seem to indicate the former) or was some sort of communication (as Entries #21 and #60.5 seem to suggest), and if so, by whom and for whom? Again, I'm fine with there not being a ton of back story, and I certainly didn't want TO explained away. But a little more mythology (especially when you had the weird drawing of the guy with no face and the abandoned cameras in the closing antique store and the hospital and Rosswood Park) would have done a ton.

Still, I'm satisfied with the ending, and even like it somewhat. I don't love it, but I don't know what more they coulda done.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 12:07 am
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The Totem
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Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 12:28 am
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Lithp
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Viden wrote:
Well you have to admit most people aren't going to look at it as critically as we are, nor did most people intensely follow it since it first began.

I'd argue (and assume as I don't have statistical evidence) the average and casual viewer of Marble Hornets thought the ending was okay and just left it at that. Accepting everything they heard/saw and not questioning a lot.

The people who followed Marble Hornets more closely are going to be more dissatisfied as we had more stake in things and look at things a little more closely.

The people who thought that the ending was satisfying more than likely liked the older stuff better, as the ending followed more that style. Completely ambiguous and no explanation what so ever. And they are okay with not knowing anything and just enjoyed the moments that it had. Kind of like the Michael Bay effect. It makes absolutely no goddamn sense but hey it looks cool.

So overall, it really just depends on what you prefer, how deep you wanna look into it, and how much stake did you have in the series. Majority wins at the end of the day, so trosephim will probably only recognise that the ending was viewed as average and leave it at that. As much as I'd like there to be more outrage in the community, in simply isn't there.


I am aware that this forum is not a truly random sample, but it's pretty large, & you more-or-less have to use the internet in the 1st place in order to follow Marble Hornets, so I assume inferences made here are pretty accurate.

Also, even if I could make a proper poll that includes less devoted followers, there's no guarantee that it would push the results in the trio's favor. The casual viewers may be just less interested in general, or they may be less inclined to forgive problems with the ending.

Also, I personally didn't see the resemblance to Season 1 until you said that. My reaction up until now is that it's more what I'd come to expect from Season 3. A long intro with awkward jump cuts that I'm not sure why Tim's filming, a futile attempt to jump scare me with distortion, & no explanations. The only thing that mildly surprised me was Jessica still being alive, & in classic Season 3 style, that was 1 answer to a question that I never even asked that raised half a dozen new queries.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:13 am
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Viden
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Lithp wrote:
Also, I personally didn't see the resemblance to Season 1 until you said that. My reaction up until now is that it's more what I'd come to expect from Season 3. A long intro with awkward jump cuts that I'm not sure why Tim's filming, a futile attempt to jump scare me with distortion, & no explanations. The only thing that mildly surprised me was Jessica still being alive, & in classic Season 3 style, that was 1 answer to a question that I never even asked that raised half a dozen new queries.


That's surprising! I kept feeling the exact same way anytime they "answered" a question. Everytime I was like "Oh, okay, I guess that's cool." Honestly I feel that problem is stemmed from building up on the wrong thing. For example, Hoody was built up to an extreme degree in Season 3 only for us to have one old video of Brain wearing the same hoodie and no explanation what so ever. Just, yeah it's the same hoodie. He did the thing. Let's move on.

Same with Jessica. It built up to a video of her getting taken by the Operator. That progressed the story, created motivation (or de-motivation for that matter), and allowed us to shift focus. Only for them to be like "Yeah that wasn't real. Jessica was here the whole time lol."

Things that were built up had little to no pay off and the things that we thought had resolution ended up being relevant still. Making things very conflicted in my opinion.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:51 am
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Lithp
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 		Pretty accurate. Something I kept saying in the Unanswered Questions thread was, "Don't build it up if it doesn't matter."

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 2:05 am
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Viden
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Joined: 07 Mar 2014
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Striker wrote:
Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).


Because nothing was expanded on your best bet is to take everything very literally and not look to deep into anything, although that's not very fun or interesting in my opinion it'll have to do.

The Operator symbol is just that, a symbol. It symbolises anything relating to the operator and has no special significance or powers.

The doll is just a doll. Again, simply represents the operator and has no special significance or power.

The pills as we seen help you retain your composure and consciousness when you are around the operator, but does not prevent his appearance, make you invulnerable to him, or make you immune to his effects (albeit it is safe to say it dampens them to a certain degree).

The biggest question about the pills would be about Tim's Masky state. As nobody else seemed to develop this "state" in the series, we can only assume this it is a part of Tim's long term mental issues and not a part of the Operators influence. And we can also assume this state is maybe a part of Tim's true personality (evidence being working with hoody as Masky - Entry #45) Unfortunately because again, this is never expanded on or explained, we cannot come form any conclusions other than the pills for Tim also work for suppressing his other personality but this isn't significant in anyone else who takes them (Hoody and very briefly Jay)

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 2:25 am
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The Totem
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Joined: 22 Jun 2014
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Viden wrote:
Striker wrote:
Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).


Because nothing was expanded on your best bet is to take everything very literally and not look to deep into anything, although that's not very fun or interesting in my opinion it'll have to do.

The Operator symbol is just that, a symbol. It symbolises anything relating to the operator and has no special significance or powers.

The doll is just a doll. Again, simply represents the operator and has no special significance or power.

The pills as we seen help you retain your composure and consciousness when you are around the operator, but does not prevent his appearance, make you invulnerable to him, or make you immune to his effects (albeit it is safe to say it dampens them to a certain degree).

The biggest question about the pills would be about Tim's Masky state. As nobody else seemed to develop this "state" in the series, we can only assume this it is a part of Tim's long term mental issues and not a part of the Operators influence. And we can also assume this state is maybe a part of Tim's true personality (evidence being working with hoody as Masky - Entry #45) Unfortunately because again, this is never expanded on or explained, we cannot come form any conclusions other than the pills for Tim also work for suppressing his other personality but this isn't significant in anyone else who takes them (Hoody and very briefly Jay)

Well, if the symbol is used to attract the Operator, then it's a pretty shitty attraction because we saw very little distortion and no sign of the Operator at the Red Tower, by Tim's house (excluding Entry #83) or that other place I can't remember.
The doll was found with Tim's medical records, and it looks like it does really nothing to anyone holding it or to the Operator, so I'd thought I'd go with it just being a doll.
Honestly, my question is what drove Alex to obsess over THAT EXACT symbol?
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 3:05 am
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TheJoker
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Joined: 14 May 2013
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Marble Hornets wrote:
I love that the concensus is that mostly everyone was unsatisfied with the ending and they ignored that fact on the posdcast. I don't blame them for it, but it would be kind of neat to hear their reaction to the feedback


Joseph actually responded to some of the negative feedback on the Something Awful thread:

Quote:
The only opinion that matters is troy's mom's. She loves our google show and is really happy that we work at the internet.


I'm guessing that's not what you were looking for, though...

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 11:04 am
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Viden
Boot


Joined: 07 Mar 2014
Posts: 22
Striker wrote:
Viden wrote:
Striker wrote:
Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).


Because nothing was expanded on your best bet is to take everything very literally and not look to deep into anything, although that's not very fun or interesting in my opinion it'll have to do.

The Operator symbol is just that, a symbol. It symbolises anything relating to the operator and has no special significance or powers.

The doll is just a doll. Again, simply represents the operator and has no special significance or power.

The pills as we seen help you retain your composure and consciousness when you are around the operator, but does not prevent his appearance, make you invulnerable to him, or make you immune to his effects (albeit it is safe to say it dampens them to a certain degree).

The biggest question about the pills would be about Tim's Masky state. As nobody else seemed to develop this "state" in the series, we can only assume this it is a part of Tim's long term mental issues and not a part of the Operators influence. And we can also assume this state is maybe a part of Tim's true personality (evidence being working with hoody as Masky - Entry #45) Unfortunately because again, this is never expanded on or explained, we cannot come form any conclusions other than the pills for Tim also work for suppressing his other personality but this isn't significant in anyone else who takes them (Hoody and very briefly Jay)

Well, if the symbol is used to attract the Operator, then it's a pretty shitty attraction because we saw very little distortion and no sign of the Operator at the Red Tower, by Tim's house (excluding Entry #83) or that other place I can't remember.
The doll was found with Tim's medical records, and it looks like it does really nothing to anyone holding it or to the Operator, so I'd thought I'd go with it just being a doll.
Honestly, my question is what drove Alex to obsess over THAT EXACT symbol?


Because he was obsessed with The Operator. So he was obsessed with the symbol that represented him. There's not much to it I'm afraid.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 1:04 pm
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Inglorion
Boot


Joined: 24 Aug 2013
Posts: 27
Viden wrote:
Striker wrote:
Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).


Because nothing was expanded on your best bet is to take everything very literally and not look to deep into anything, although that's not very fun or interesting in my opinion it'll have to do.

The Operator symbol is just that, a symbol. It symbolises anything relating to the operator and has no special significance or powers.

The doll is just a doll. Again, simply represents the operator and has no special significance or power.

The pills as we seen help you retain your composure and consciousness when you are around the operator, but does not prevent his appearance, make you invulnerable to him, or make you immune to his effects (albeit it is safe to say it dampens them to a certain degree).

The biggest question about the pills would be about Tim's Masky state. As nobody else seemed to develop this "state" in the series, we can only assume this it is a part of Tim's long term mental issues and not a part of the Operators influence. And we can also assume this state is maybe a part of Tim's true personality (evidence being working with hoody as Masky - Entry #45) Unfortunately because again, this is never expanded on or explained, we cannot come form any conclusions other than the pills for Tim also work for suppressing his other personality but this isn't significant in anyone else who takes them (Hoody and very briefly Jay)


Maybe I'm missing something, but what do you mean when you say Tim is the only one to exhibit a Masky-esque state in the series? Isn't Brian another example of this? They both wear signature face-coverings, they both seem to want to conceal their identities from those who would seek to reveal them, they both use Tim's prescription pills and even fight over them, and they both seem incapable of speech, or much rationality for that matter, in this state. I think Brian exhibits almost exactly the same symptoms as Tim.

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 2:51 am
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The Totem
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Joined: 22 Jun 2014
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Inglorion wrote:
Viden wrote:
Striker wrote:
Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).


Because nothing was expanded on your best bet is to take everything very literally and not look to deep into anything, although that's not very fun or interesting in my opinion it'll have to do.

The Operator symbol is just that, a symbol. It symbolises anything relating to the operator and has no special significance or powers.

The doll is just a doll. Again, simply represents the operator and has no special significance or power.

The pills as we seen help you retain your composure and consciousness when you are around the operator, but does not prevent his appearance, make you invulnerable to him, or make you immune to his effects (albeit it is safe to say it dampens them to a certain degree).

The biggest question about the pills would be about Tim's Masky state. As nobody else seemed to develop this "state" in the series, we can only assume this it is a part of Tim's long term mental issues and not a part of the Operators influence. And we can also assume this state is maybe a part of Tim's true personality (evidence being working with hoody as Masky - Entry #45) Unfortunately because again, this is never expanded on or explained, we cannot come form any conclusions other than the pills for Tim also work for suppressing his other personality but this isn't significant in anyone else who takes them (Hoody and very briefly Jay)


Maybe I'm missing something, but what do you mean when you say Tim is the only one to exhibit a Masky-esque state in the series? Isn't Brian another example of this? They both wear signature face-coverings, they both seem to want to conceal their identities from those who would seek to reveal them, they both use Tim's prescription pills and even fight over them, and they both seem incapable of speech, or much rationality for that matter, in this state. I think Brian exhibits almost exactly the same symptoms as Tim.

The differences between Tim and Brian is that Tim's alternate, insane personality is just that, a personality. Brian on the other hand has never switched out of "Masky-mode", suggesting that this isn't a Masky-esque state, but he has literally lost all sanity. Plus, the pills actually do seem to work for Masky, but not for Hoody. And Hoody doesn't emit that technological-interference Masky is known for.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 3:32 am
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lonsumtravlr
Entrenched

Joined: 23 Mar 2014
Posts: 1009
Location: The Great Continent of New England
Striker wrote:
Inglorion wrote:
Viden wrote:
Striker wrote:
Dacad wrote:
Now that I've had a while to mull it over, I am..... satisfied with the ending. Sure, there's more I wanted, but most of my big questions were answered. I can guess what the Ark is well enough on my own, I never wanted to know what the Operator is (that would destroy it). I would have preferred to have some information about the doll, the pills, and the symbol, but otherwise, I'm satisfied. I suspect I'm in the minority here, but that's how I feel.

I think I'm with the small amount of people who think it was just symbol of the Operator's lack of eyes or something Alex used to show where he was filming Marble Hornets. The doll, I'm with the people who think it's just something Tim had when he was still mentally unstable, the pills are shown to be some kind of seizure-preventing pills (suggesting that the Operator and Masky emit some kind of radiation or electricity wave that messes with technology).
The pills being a seizure medication also supports my theory that the pills do actually work, but only on Slendersickness and do not stop the Operator from coming near you/teleporting you (as seen in Entry #86).


Because nothing was expanded on your best bet is to take everything very literally and not look to deep into anything, although that's not very fun or interesting in my opinion it'll have to do.

The Operator symbol is just that, a symbol. It symbolises anything relating to the operator and has no special significance or powers.

The doll is just a doll. Again, simply represents the operator and has no special significance or power.

The pills as we seen help you retain your composure and consciousness when you are around the operator, but does not prevent his appearance, make you invulnerable to him, or make you immune to his effects (albeit it is safe to say it dampens them to a certain degree).

The biggest question about the pills would be about Tim's Masky state. As nobody else seemed to develop this "state" in the series, we can only assume this it is a part of Tim's long term mental issues and not a part of the Operators influence. And we can also assume this state is maybe a part of Tim's true personality (evidence being working with hoody as Masky - Entry #45) Unfortunately because again, this is never expanded on or explained, we cannot come form any conclusions other than the pills for Tim also work for suppressing his other personality but this isn't significant in anyone else who takes them (Hoody and very briefly Jay)



But Hoody has caused distortion. His appearance in Entry #41, for example.
Maybe I'm missing something, but what do you mean when you say Tim is the only one to exhibit a Masky-esque state in the series? Isn't Brian another example of this? They both wear signature face-coverings, they both seem to want to conceal their identities from those who would seek to reveal them, they both use Tim's prescription pills and even fight over them, and they both seem incapable of speech, or much rationality for that matter, in this state. I think Brian exhibits almost exactly the same symptoms as Tim.

The differences between Tim and Brian is that Tim's alternate, insane personality is just that, a personality. Brian on the other hand has never switched out of "Masky-mode", suggesting that this isn't a Masky-esque state, but he has literally lost all sanity. Plus, the pills actually do seem to work for Masky, but not for Hoody. And Hoody doesn't emit that technological-interference Masky is known for.


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