unforum

[vpisteve]

Hmmm.

Historically, the typical ARG player base has been very iceberg-like. The ratio of lurkers vs. active posting/chatting players is usually absolutely huge.

[konamouse]

[mysteryjones]

[krystyn]

I don't have much to add to the discussion, except to say that discounting someone's opinions because somehow their anonymity 'discredits' them in your eyes is only hurting you, as an ARG player/PM who's looking to expand the genre by simply supporting, or creating the games.

line's assertion, however, about a PM's tendency to 'out' themselves as being a product of their 'ego' and loneliness sure does sound like a limited-sample view of the genre. Down with the rules, man! PMs can out themselves or not, or draw that curtain tight, as is their wont. line, I think I have seen evidence of the behavior you describe, but it's not the big picture, it's not the rule, and if you don't know that, then you should dig deeper. Venting your spleen with the patina of authoritative ARG summary is unseemly.

The players will ultimately speak their piece, and the PM can either take those opinions into account, or curse themselves for not marketing their product to a player base that will automagically love everything they do.

[bagsbee]

[dmax]

and it's a kloo!

[Diandra]

[krystyn]

Devil's Advocate: Perhaps that is their online handle, and they're an under-the-radar PM, or one of those players we've been referring to recently as being from the below-the-surface section of the iceberg.

That said, while I understand the desire for context, I think I am a little more sympathetic to the idea of retaining such anonymity in a community where your reputation often precedes you, and not always in a positive manner. I see it less as a cowardly action, and more of a desire to see the opinion stand on its own. Even with a name, what would you have, honestly, except the possibility that you and line might have talked on the phone, much less !nacho'd each other into oblivion on #IRC, or perhaps taken boozy pictures together at an ARGFest? Would a name really give you that much to go on? Is the point of opinion articles really to put a nice face on everything you write? Sunshine and lollipops, my ass!

Having said all that, I still think some of the opinions tend to leak like a sieve from where I'm sitting, but I still find it interesting that someone thinks that because a PM chooses to out themselves, that they are 'lonely,' or need their egos stroked. I'd like to know more - what sort of behavior is line seeing, specifically, that leads them to this conclusion? Is this something future PMs should maybe look at - their overall marketing and image tweaking? Is it worth it - should a PM really care what the players think about them personally?

Do the people who 'completely' agreed with the article feel this way about every instance where the PM reveals themselves, or only one or two particular games?

It'd be nice to dig further in this person's head and come up with some really compelling reasoning/backup, but I think having someone's 'real' name would do you just as much good in that respect as not having one. I'd almost like to see more from line on this topic, perhaps a breakdown of some of the more inflammatory material.

[jamesi]

Diandra, I hate to disagree with pretty much anyone, but this is a little too much for me to have to sit through and keep quiet about.

[addlepated]

I think the problem is that all the people who have been involved in games which have had meta-sites feel attacked by this article. And any PM who has come out to take a bow either before the game starts or after it's over (which is pretty much every PM involved in any game, AFAIK) has been branded lonely, needy, and egotistical. I don't think it's fair to paint everyone with the broad brush that Line used. Although he or she made some other points, I think that people are going to get upset by the derogatory comments.

If Line had someone in particular in mind while writing this article, I wish he or she would have just flat out stated it. Otherwise, everyone who's ever helped out with a game is going to feel accused. While thought-provoking, I think the article could have been written with less accusation and generalization.

[krystyn]

jamesi, excellent thoughts - well-explained, I thought.

And I agree with addlepated that zinger-sting-y little articles like that can tend to cause a bit of hesitation on a PMs part, but I don't take it in such a negative manner. Many times during Lockjaw people'd make fun of my dumb old web designs, and I was sitting right there, lurking in the IRC channel. It made me so mad that I'd work that much harder to stump 'em with plotlines and puzzles, but it taught me early on that there is a foin foin balance between catering to your Adoring Public, and Doing Your Own Thing.

It's like, when you PM, you need a healthy dose of Clue but with the attitude of Field of Dreams. Dangle the shiny things in front of the players, and give them enough to get involved with the story, but learn the fine art of dissecting what part of the negativity you're gonna listen to. Ultimately, you're the one building this thing, and if you have faith in your abilities and in your story, the players will likely fall right down the rabbit hole and never want to come out. Hopefully.

Hearing the veiled and not-so-veiled comments from players for two games, I learned pretty quickly to separate signal from noise. You absolutely can ignore the right bastards, but let me tell you, many of the best lessons I learned in theatre were from the worst actors, and directors.

line's got a hard line to sell, and I feel he/she fell short, but man, this discussion is really cementing a lot of the ideas I have about what it means to be a puppetmaster (for me). I'm certainly not lonely, and somehow I managed to get through Lockjaw even though those meanies were making fun of my designs, so it seems like the ego's fairly intact.

I think it might be interesting to see what further directions line will take her/his opinions in. At the very least, it'll be momentarily amusing.

Now, just watch. line is really a character that leads us down the hole to a new ARG. How so very meta!

[Diandra]

[krystyn]

[konamouse]

I can feel your pain, krystyn.

When I was an aerobics instructor (in a past life), I was disappointed when someone would leave my class. But for every person who didn't like my teaching style, there was always someone who did. It took me a good year or so to figure out that you can't please everyone, so don't try. Do what you do, what you like, how you like, and those who enjoy that style will continue to return and enjoy it with you.

Same idea can be applied to ARG. As a PM do a game in the style you want to play, and those who are interested will play along with you. If they don't like your version, they may lurk (and some will critique) but that is just free publicity. Play/Design YOUR game, and you will have people who like it also. There is no right way or wrong way (like aerobics, there is no one best style of class - as long as you are teaching safe & effectives moves, and the type of class that is advertised). So there will be many different types of ARG developed in the coming years.

/me gets off her little soap box and goes back into the corner.

[jamesi]