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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!) » The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!): General/Updates
[SPEC] Durga & the Navy Sentinels?
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Zedix
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Joined: 26 Jul 2004
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I'm pretty sure there's also an 'x' sound in it.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 2:59 pm
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Karmic
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Regardless of what the <whatever> is in 'reinitializing with the <whatever> package.' I think 'Durga' is referring to Genie. Durga blasted Genie, and Jersey is taking steps to try to recover her. The <whatever> is just another meaningless future buzzword.


The Luggage wrote:
1. Knows a lot of technical hacking terms.

What terms, and how do we judge that they're 'technical' in a society where AI's are common?

The Luggage wrote:
2. Is used to coming in contact with unsavoury programs.

How do you figure this? Jersey first believes 'Durga' is pornographic spam. Receiving unwanted email traffic doesn't make anyone more technically savvy today. It's reasonable to the same is true in the future.

The Luggage wrote:
3. Knows a lot about hacking protection.

What does he know about hacking protection? If you're referring to the 'packetgunner' comment, I'd say that the jargon is meaningless as we can't accurately judge its 'technical' level while lacking the context.

The Luggage wrote:
4. Has a security program, that can keep two nazy sentinels at bay.

Two things about this one. Genie (assumed to be the security bot) being a good firewall doesn't necessarily mean that Jersey was a hacker. Also, you've made the assumption that the sentinels were being stopped by Genie. Perhaps they weren't? Maybe they had been chasing Durga, and would have gotten through, but Durga, being a far superior AI, was able to turn them away easily.


I can't say for certain that Jersey wasn't a hacker of some sort, but, I don't think it can really be proven that he definitely was. So, lacking facts, we're left with impressions.

More than anything, the scene strikes me as just some kid suprised to find that after booting up his home system, its possessed by a superior, amnesiac AI. (Nothing too hacker-ish about that?)

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 3:36 pm
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Ghost77
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The Luggage wrote:
CoffeeJedi wrote:
The Luggage wrote:
meetingpeopleiseasy wrote:
I dont neccesarily think Jersey is a hacker. I think he is just a kid with a computer.


Oh come on...

'Don't try reinitialsing the system with a lolitic package."

Not the sort of stuff the average computer user would know.


i disagree... Lolita, from the controversial novel... is just a child
"lolitic" would indicate that the anti-spyware/virus removal program that Jersey was trying to run was amateur, simple.... he's no hacker (unless she was just mocking him)



I'm going to have to go with meetingpeople here. Lolitic is an engilish term, not a computer term. I think your 4 points are off here:

1. Knows a lot of technical hacking terms.
Haven't heard any hacking terminology out of Jersey yet - lolitic is a descriptive word, not slang (assuming we are transcribing it right). Plus, the computer says it, not Jersey.
2. Is used to coming in contact with unsavoury programs.
He specifically refers to the new AI as "spam" - and runs an anti-spam program to delete it. I don't think that's unusual.
3. Knows a lot about hacking protection.
Can you give us some quotes on this one? It sounded like he was at least a knowledgable computer user, but that doesn't make him a hacker.
4. Has a security program, that can keep two nazy sentinels at bay.
This was unintentional - it was the viral AI that kept the 2 sentinels out, nothing that Jersey did. In fact, it's likely that those 2 navy sentinels had been watching Jersey for at least a little while before the AI showed up, and thus that Jersey did not have a security program that could even detect the sentinels.

I think there's no solid evidence that Jersey is a hacker. Look at all the things that his new AI could do that he didn't think were possible. He talks about the Admiral protections as if he heard about it in the news or is speculating. Kamal sounds much more confident and experienced with this stuff.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 3:44 pm
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johnny5
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Re: [SPEC] Durga & the Navy Sentinels?

Karmic wrote:
Quote:
source: jersey.wav
Jersey: You're a Navy sentinel, arent you?
Durga: No, there were two of them trying to get past your security bot, though.


What is the significance of the Navy sentinel AIs? What were they after?

Possibilities:
  1. It was completely random occurrence, the Sentinels were trying to invade Jersey's system with no specific intent, and the lines just serve to demonstrate that 'Durga' is a bad-ass AI not to be messed with.
  2. The Sentinels targetted Jersey (or his father?) for some reason.
  3. The Sentinels were actually after the 'Durga' AI, trying to continue their pusuit of her into Morelli's system.


I'm personally wavering between A and C. Any other thoughts?


I'm leaning towards "C" myself.

Jersey knows what a "Navy Sentinal" is but it sounds like conjecture. Like he's heard of them but never seen one. Durga gets past the security bot and neutralizes the two Navy sentinals "chasing" her. It seems to fit so well. Jersey seems like just a kid who is getting mixed up in something way out of his league.

--john--

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 3:55 pm
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Macavity
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Actually, Jersey might be a hacker - the kind who runs around the 'Net looking for places with security holes, using them, and dropping off a note saying "I was here, here's how I got in, here's what you can do to fix it." That would explain how he knows that flag-rank military personnel have heavy data security - not just around their records, but their personalo systems as well (hence the reference to packet gunners - most likely a security AI that snags intrusion packets, backtraces them, and attacks the system sending them. This would also explain why Jersey tells Durga not to mess with them - he doesn't want his new friend to get geeked by high-level intrusion countermeasures).

Kamal, though, is definitely a cracker - a hacker who exploits security flaws for his own benefit or that of friends. Case in point: hacking Aiden's chatternet signature and using that plus a link into his home network to spy on him through the thermostats.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 3:58 pm
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ajenteks
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Re: [SPEC] Durga & the Navy Sentinels?

johnny_Nitro wrote:
Jersey seems like just a kid who is getting mixed up in something way out of his league.



I'd have to agree with that assessment. He's using "Durga" for kids stuff, not complicated hacks that a big shot hacker, or up-n-comin' hacker, would be interested in.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 4:00 pm
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The Luggage
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Ghost77 wrote:
The Luggage wrote:
CoffeeJedi wrote:
The Luggage wrote:
meetingpeopleiseasy wrote:
I dont neccesarily think Jersey is a hacker. I think he is just a kid with a computer.


Oh come on...

'Don't try reinitialsing the system with a lolitic package."

Not the sort of stuff the average computer user would know.


i disagree... Lolita, from the controversial novel... is just a child
"lolitic" would indicate that the anti-spyware/virus removal program that Jersey was trying to run was amateur, simple.... he's no hacker (unless she was just mocking him)



I'm going to have to go with meetingpeople here. Lolitic is an engilish term, not a computer term. I think your 4 points are off here:

1. Knows a lot of technical hacking terms.
Haven't heard any hacking terminology out of Jersey yet - lolitic is a descriptive word, not slang (assuming we are transcribing it right). Plus, the computer says it, not Jersey.
2. Is used to coming in contact with unsavoury programs.
He specifically refers to the new AI as "spam" - and runs an anti-spam program to delete it. I don't think that's unusual.
3. Knows a lot about hacking protection.
Can you give us some quotes on this one? It sounded like he was at least a knowledgable computer user, but that doesn't make him a hacker.
4. Has a security program, that can keep two nazy sentinels at bay.
This was unintentional - it was the viral AI that kept the 2 sentinels out, nothing that Jersey did. In fact, it's likely that those 2 navy sentinels had been watching Jersey for at least a little while before the AI showed up, and thus that Jersey did not have a security program that could even detect the sentinels.

I think there's no solid evidence that Jersey is a hacker. Look at all the things that his new AI could do that he didn't think were possible. He talks about the Admiral protections as if he heard about it in the news or is speculating. Kamal sounds much more confident and experienced with this stuff.


1. We aren't transcrbing it correctly.. I've already said that. It's not Lolictic at all.

2. Alright, you've got me there.

3. '"Is it snared?" "Very"' '"Which Admiral?" "Oh no, those guys have packet rings around them"'. He's obviously gone up against them.

4. No. Durga, in Jersey's words, evaporated them. They were trying to get past Jersey's security bot, indicating he's good enough to keep two dumb AI's from hacking into his system.

I don't know why on earth you think Jersey wouldn't be a hacker.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 4:03 pm
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Karmic
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Joined: 26 Aug 2004
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Location: Cincinnati, OH

[ot] in my own thread

After listening to the .wav a dozen more times, I believe 'lolitic' to be a transcription error.

The word is like 'levelitics' or something.
  • Begins with an 'L'
  • Four syllables long
  • I think its a 'V' (but it could be a 'B' or 'W'?) beginning the second syllable
  • ends with 'KS', 'CS', or 'X'
Seeing as how it's <whatever> package and I can't think of a word that would really fit, I'm inclined to believe it's technical jargon.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 4:09 pm
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Karmic
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Location: Cincinnati, OH

So what?

So, we've got a few competing theories here. What does each one mean to the story?

Jersey was targetted by the sentinels for being a hacker.
How might Jersey being a hacker or otherwise the target of the sentinels affect how we perceive 'Durga' or the events that follow?

The sentinels were chasing 'Durga'.
Does that mean that 'Durga' is an enemy AI or some sort of threat? Does it mean that she's a damaged (amnesiac) military AI that the sentinels were trying to recover?

The sentinels just serve as a demonstration of Durga's superiority.
If this one is true, we're just wasting our time on this thread, right? Smile
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 4:36 pm
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Smooth Jack
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I actually had a whole different take on this part of the story. The picture in my mind was Jersey as some low-level office or naval administrative person working on his computer system at work. He has a "personal assistant" called genie or jeanie on his system that detects Durga's arrival/awakening. He thinks it's spam of the adult entertainment kind, which he's not interested in. (What teenage hacker kid wouldn't be interested in porn?)

The reason for the navy sentinels trying to access his system could be because he works for the navy and they automatically detected some problem.

It would also explain why Jersey knows about security for admirals and why he would think to ask about whether Durga can get info on them.

I'm just guessing.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:07 pm
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chaotic_mind
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Joined: 03 Aug 2004
Posts: 325
Location: Inside my head, behind the eyes

Well, to add a little to the debate.

Why would Jersey EXPECT Durga to be a Navy Sentinel. It doesn't really prove anything, but I think it shows Jersey has some experience with Naval Sentinels. Perhaps through his father?

Luke P.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:20 pm
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Ghost77
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Karmic, I think it's likely the Sentinels were just spying on Jersey for some as yet unexplained reason. Him being a hacker doesn't seem like a good reason at all, why would you need 2? Why not just arrest him? I think it's more likely him or his family (ie father) is involved in some shady business, possibly Navy related.

I also think it's odd that Jersey isn't freaked out when he thinks Durga's a Navy sentinel. If he was worried about the law, wouldn't he try and escape instead of communicating?

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:27 pm
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nil
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Joined: 11 Aug 2004
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Karmic wrote:

...the scene strikes me as just some kid suprised to find that after booting up his home system, its possessed by a superior, amnesiac AI.


hmmm...sound familiar?

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:28 pm
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Kender
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Joined: 09 Aug 2004
Posts: 264
Location: The Netherlands

base brats

Well, since Jersey, Jan and Dwayne seem to living on a 'base' I guess it's a Navy base and Jersey is using the Navy network to access the Net. That would mean that Navy Sentinels are something he is able to run into quite easily.

The facts that there are a 'special' special forces guy, a 'superhuman' girl and a runaway advanced AI around implies that there is at least *some* Black Project work going on at this base.

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:30 pm
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bfos7215
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Smooth Jack wrote:
I actually had a whole different take on this part of the story. The picture in my mind was Jersey as some low-level office or naval administrative person working on his computer system at work.


Good thought. That would probably mean that he WORKS where Jan works (since she seems to have something to do with the navy), not nececarily lives in the same building as her. But on the other hand, we know that Jan is the "school heartbreaker" at duane's (security guard's son) school. So I would think that Jersey is also a schoolmate of Jan's. That doesn't prove your theory wrong, as she could have two lives (and probably does). Or he even could be working from home.

Back to Luggage's argument though. There's NO proof that he's a "hacker". You can speculate about it, but there's no proof. I'm a software developer and I know plenty about technology, but i'm in no way a hacker.

In fact, as someone else noted, it's almost a weekness that he didn't know about the sentinals. I don't think she killed the sentinals on her way in. I think she "woke up" from her crash into his system, and from the inside, noticed that there were sentinals trying to get in, so she dealt with them.

Brian

PostPosted: Thu Aug 26, 2004 5:32 pm
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