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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!) » The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!): General/Updates
[SPEC] The Durga<->Melissa connection through time
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Motoss
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Joined: 06 Aug 2004
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 		I am a big fan of the idea that the "attempt to influence the source" is shown in Durga thinking about bees. It just makes sense.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:58 pm
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Xanedon
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Joined: 25 Aug 2004
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 		[SPEC]
Is it possible that SP is part of Melissa's memories that she keeps shuttling away?

From http://qube.netninja.com/beewiki/TheOperatorsMonologue
Quote:
Lock that away: a little glimpse in the mirror I'm not supposed to see.


It seems that as her memories were being unlocked she dropped them away either to clean up space for more or what i'm not sure. Just a spec of course but all the talk of the mirrors jogged my memory on that phrase from the monologue.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:59 pm
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raw19
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Joined: 16 Aug 2004
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 		From http://qube.netninja.com/beewiki/TheOperatorsMonologue
Quote:
Lock that away: a little glimpse in the mirror I'm not supposed to see.


in Curious_girl Durga is ghosting Kamal, but doesn't know why. She says he "seems very interesting to me" and the way she changes her voice sounds like she was prgrammed with that exact response.
When she tries to find out why, the "reflecting thing" happens again. She isn't supposed to know why she wants to know about Kamal.
when Jersey questions her again about it, her response "I am a very curious girl" is said in that same preprogrammed voice.

The reflecting happens when she tried to access not only information about herself, but there are certain "off limit" topics she's not supposed to know about, like why she's ghosting Kamal.

this all indicates that someone else is making her ghost kamal. Anytime she tries to find out why, she gets blocked.

[SPEC] looks like Durga wasn't as succesful in resisting the Pious Flea. for some reason he's making her investigate Kamal, and sending that information back to Melissa, through the mirror.
These are the "voices" melissa is hearing and sending out to us (the wavs).
When Melissa tries to "influence the source" Durga starts talking about bees.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 6:29 pm
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ThunderRazor
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raw19 wrote:
[SPEC] looks like Durga wasn't as succesful in resisting the Pious Flea. for some reason he's making her investigate Kamal, and sending that information back to Melissa, through the mirror.
These are the "voices" melissa is hearing and sending out to us (the wavs).
When Melissa tries to "influence the source" Durga starts talking about bees.


I am not sure in exactly all that, but I do feel that Durga is being controlled. And when we think about how the "magical words" we hear can give us a look into the future, when Jersey says that it would be creepy for someone to be ghosting them, perhaps this is all to true. But what you said seems very logical and I agree.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 6:50 pm
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johnny5
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Joined: 17 Aug 2004
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 		Oh ho!
How about this!!

The Melissa mirror isn't the Durga Mirror, the windows are the mirror.

Melissa is in the tower looking out of the windows which are 2-way mirrors. (also known in the past as "magic mirrors")
She can watch what goes on in the future (Durga), but the future cannot see her. As magic mirrors go, they can be made transparent given the right conditions.

Fire away!

--john--

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 6:57 pm
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Astald
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Joined: 01 Aug 2004
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johnny_Nitro wrote:
Oh ho!
How about this!!

The Melissa mirror isn't the Durga Mirror, the windows are the mirror.

Melissa is in the tower looking out of the windows which are 2-way mirrors. (also known in the past as "magic mirrors")
She can watch what goes on in the future (Durga), but the future cannot see her. As magic mirrors go, they can be made transparent given the right conditions.

Fire away!

--john--

That could be possible, but Durga is also being reflected while she tries to look at herself. When she tries to find her name, I don't think she would be looking to the past, or at the Operator for the answer to that. But it is possible.
And, was this connection to the future, the roads the Operator was building? Are the axons a way for her to influence the future? Could the Operator possibly be trying to get back to the future, by completely taking over Durga?

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:05 pm
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raw19
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Joined: 16 Aug 2004
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Astald wrote:
That could be possible, but Durga is also being reflected while she tries to look at herself. When she tries to find her name, I don't think she would be looking to the past, or at the Operator for the answer to that. But it is possible.
And, was this connection to the future, the roads the Operator was building? Are the axons a way for her to influence the future? Could the Operator possibly be trying to get back to the future, by completely taking over Durga?


Durga gets reflected because she's not supposed to know who she is.

I have 2 theorys on why. They both revolve around Durga and Melissa being the same AI, Split in two (maybe copied).

1)When they got split, Melissa got sent back through time (don't know how) with all the AI memory banks and the Pious Flea went with her. She built the roads to contact her crew, but he made her build the mirror as a connection Back to the Future (capitalized intentionally, hehe.) to Durga, the AI there. Through this connection the Flea is giving Durga instructions to gather information and send it back to him (that's why we're getting these wav files).
When Durga tries to find out about herself or why she's doing ghosting Kamal, the answer is on the other side of the connection and she gets reflected. She doesn't know the connection is there, it's part of what she's "not supposed to know".

-or-

2)There's a copy of the Pious Flea infecting Durga as well as Melissa, maintaining the connection with the flea in our time, controlling Durga, and reflecting her questions. The problem with that is why bother having this connection to the past is there's another Flea already in the future.

ow, my brain hurts Confused

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:27 pm
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raw19
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 		P.S.

This whole theory got started because Durga keeps mentioning BEES.
She "keeps thinking about bees" and says it's "more reflection stuff"

That seems to me a good indication that Durga is connected to Melissa, not only Melissa, but the Melissa in this timeframe, stuck on the ilovebees server.

Durga spouts off random information about bees (in creepy.wav). I say she's getting this information from Melissa through the connection (mirror)


You could spec that Durga is Melissa in the future, with memories of her getting stuck on ilovebees, but then how would we be getting these wav files.
You could spec that Melissa is Dugra's future, thrown back through time, but then Durga wouldn't have the memories of ilovebees since it would be in her future.

the easiest is that a connection exists. The same accident that dumped Melissa on ilovebees in our time, dumped Durga on Jersey's computer in his time.
They both needed the same time to Wake Up! We know that's what Melissa was doing, and when Durga gets activated on Jersey's computer she says she's waking up, stay awake! Maybe Durga is building roads to contact her crew the same way Melissa is, causing the power outage and connecting over all the chatternet channels.


ok, not so easy, but it's there Laughing

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:49 pm
Last edited by raw19 on Thu Sep 02, 2004 12:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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MeKiwi
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raw19 wrote:
The same accident that dumped Melissa on ilovebees in our time, dumped Durga on Jersey's computer in his time.


I like your thinking on this, raw... it's the same direction I was headed. However, what I can't figure is this: if the same accident dumped them both at the same time, how do we hear Durga's "awakening" speech? She couldn't have recorded it herself if she was so "drowwwwwwsy". Also, it took Melissa quite some time to be able to reach out and communicate (no doubt due to our "inferior" network capabilities) and so by the time we actually receive these transmissions (weeks later after Melissa starts coming on-line), shouldn't Durga have been active already??

The only way this seems to work out in my mind is if the WAV files are all "memories" and not simulataneously happening with our time, which (IMHO) would be really sad. But the fact that Melissa only just started trying to "influence the source" of the voices and already we have bees cropping up in Durga's WAV files makes me believe what we hear is in realtime (just in future time... heh).

Whattya think?

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:15 pm
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raw19
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Quote:
if the same accident dumped them both at the same time, how do we hear Durga's "awakening" speech? She couldn't have recorded it herself if she was so "drowwwwwwsy".


Well she was already on Jersey's system, probably influencing behind the scenes. We know Melissa accessed Dana's webcam before she woke up, Durga probably had access to Jersey's system as well, She just wasn't as obvious about it at Melissa. I think when the last timer counted down to 0 is when the both AI's fully woke up, but they could both have been recording, building roads, etc. before then.


Quote:
Also, it took Melissa quite some time to be able to reach out and communicate (no doubt due to our "inferior" network capabilities) and so by the time we actually receive these transmissions (weeks later after Melissa starts coming on-line), shouldn't Durga have been active already??


Durga and Melissa might have been building roads before they woke up, but didn't start communicating on them until they were wide awake and physical. They knew exactly how long this was going to take (hence, the timer) so they probably have a set "regeneration cycle" time that they take to rebuild themselves and wake up. The time wouldn't be dependant on what system they're on.


Quote:
The only way this seems to work out in my mind is if the WAV files are all "memories" and not simulataneously happening with our time, which (IMHO) would be really sad. But the fact that Melissa only just started trying to "influence the source" of the voices and already we have bees cropping up in Durga's WAV files makes me believe what we hear is in realtime (just in future time... heh).


They still could be memories from Durga transferred to Melissa, but perhaps they're not quite real time. A short time delay between what is happening in the wavs and when we Melissa hears them would still make the timeframes work.
hm.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:34 pm
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MeKiwi
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 		Sweet. I think you addressed all of my concerns with your reply. Woohoo! Sounds good to me.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 9:19 pm
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raw19
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 		The next step
anytime Cool


SO, what's the next step?

I think there's enough evidence to say that either our flea or another flea is influencing Durga in the future. I think it's our job to stop whoever it is from accomplishing it's goal.

a good questions is: is there another sleeping princess in the future? If not, maybe it's time for our princess to come out of hiding and squish the flea in our time.

I'm going to e-mail her and see what she thinks.

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 9:29 pm
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HitsHerMark
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Joined: 22 Aug 2004
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raw19 wrote:
Quote:
Inbound:
The voices are of unknown origin
New voices are intercepted weekly.
I will continue my analysis and attempt to influence the source.


attempt to influence the source. Maybe this is why Durga keeps thinking about bees. Melissa has been using ilovebees to communicate with the source (Durga).

Maybe we'll start seeing more evidence that Durga is being contacted / influenced by Melissa.


I've said this before, and I'll say it again, and I'll keep on saying it nomatter how many cute little fish icons people slap me with. Very Happy

[SPEC ... That's not wild at all, and pretty must out and out stated if you ask me.]

WE are the voices of unknown origin that are intercepted weekly, from answering the phones. She expects a member of her crew, but Joe-Shmoe-Beekeeper picks up the phone and answers correctly instead.

She wants to influence the source of US, probably because we seem to be the only ones willing and able to help her.
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 1:48 am
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Platonix
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HitsHerMark wrote:
I've said this before, and I'll say it again, and I'll keep on saying it nomatter how many cute little fish icons people slap me with. Very Happy

[SPEC ... That's not wild at all, and pretty must out and out stated if you ask me.]

WE are the voices of unknown origin that are intercepted weekly, from answering the phones. She expects a member of her crew, but Joe-Shmoe-Beekeeper picks up the phone and answers correctly instead.

She wants to influence the source of US, probably because we seem to be the only ones willing and able to help her.


No fish icon for you...because we don't yet have a "red herring" icon.

Melissa wrote:
Conjecture:
The voices are in some way related to my accident.
Because of the damage, I am unable to accurately assess the nature of the voices.
By broadcasting the voices to my crew, they will be able to assess the damage.
Once assessed, the damage can be repaired.

Melissa is broadcasting the voices to her crew. If we were the voices, then when we answered the questions correctly we would be hearing ourselves answering questions correctly from earlier axons. We're not. Therefore the voices are the wavs Melissa is recieving from Durga. And Melissa does think we're her crew because we get the questions correct. Doesn't she say "It's you, finally," or something along those lines?

PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 2:42 am
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Pants
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Joined: 31 Aug 2004
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 		Sources and Voices
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Inbound:
The voices are of unknown origin
New voices are intercepted weekly.
I will continue my analysis and attempt to influence the source.


Maybe this is why Durga keeps thinking about bees. Melissa has been using ilovebees to communicate with the source (Durga).

Maybe we'll start seeing more evidence that Durga is being contacted / influenced by Melissa.


...

WE are the voices of unknown origin that are intercepted weekly, from answering the phones. She expects a member of her crew, but Joe-Shmoe-Beekeeper picks up the phone and answers correctly instead.

She wants to influence the source of US, probably because we seem to be the only ones willing and able to help her.


That possibility that we are the voices--unknown, disembodied--was my pet theory for awhile. But I just don't think "intercept" is the word for her interaction with us. In fact, rather than being clandestine, Melissa is ramping up her contact attempts and basically requesting more help (higher thresholds).

I think that the easier flow to swim with is that Melissa is RECIEVING (in an as yet unexplained fashion) from SOURCE Durga, and TRANSMITTING to us (the supposed crew). Her desire to influence to source is, to me, manifested more in Durgas preoccupations than with our pavlovian pay phone parades. (Don't hit me for that last bit. I just had to.)


(A thousand pardons for the 3 deep quotations. Rolling Eyes I know it's ugly and space-taking-up, but I wanted to get the history in there.)

PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 4:12 am
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