unforum

[AngriBuddhist]

Let's assume that this game is not as rigidly planned out as I
and a great many others believe. Imagine that the PMs left
hooks in their own design for branching plot points that could
be taken depending on the actions of the community or even
an individual. If the capture of the SP was only an option that
was open to us (and not prescripted) then a solution must have
also come along with it. They would not allow us to move the
game in this direction if it only led to a dead end.

In this case it really doesn't matter to the community which
path we take. If an individual takes action (PM condoned in
weephun's case) based on his own desires, the game still
moves forward and we react to it.

We had the clues right in front of us. Verified "crew" members
told us that they were questioned about SP. They didn't follow
the PMs lead. Weephun refused to tell us what happened and
honestly told us that he was told to keep it quiet.

Some put the pieces together and sent emails to SP to warn
her that a trap was about to be sprung. At this point, if the
PMs did not want to follow this course of action (and felt that
they actually needed to justify their own) they could have
stood down. They did NOT.

The PMs have planted many seeds in the past of this ARG,
here's a few:

1. SP states that the Queen wants to put her back into the coffin.
2. When asking us to email location/times, she begs us to really
be there so she doesn't get caught eavesdropping on the Queen.
3. The Peridita story.
4. The growing relationship with the Flea sets him up as a new
potential ally.
5. We still don't know who the SP is and by coincidence this new
twist requires us to come up with her name.

Additionally, as in any good role-playing game, establishment of
a setting comes before the allowance of devience. You first lay
a foundation before allowing players to effect the outcome. Once
it's in place, actual role-playing is then possible. You do not want
your players leaving the tavern before they overhear the story
of the legendary treasure.

This was the first chance in this entire ARG that it seemed that
a choice could be made. Now, I understand that some believe
that a different path would have been preferable but consider
that it most likely only seemed that way. On the other hand,
if a choice was really possible why not make one?

As for the disclosure of information, yes, this is [META] land and
this choice could have been discussed here and probably would
have been for an excessive amount of time. Weephun made a
decision though and the PMs (through Melissa) asked him to not
reveal it. The PMs designed this game. They run it and if they
gave me an ingame reason to not reveal a piece of information
to any of you, I WOULD COMPLY.

They prompt us all the time and we comply.
The "crew" was prompted and weephun complied.

Of all the people here, I would say that he would probably like
to see the SP freed more than anyone. Not simply because it's
a new puzzle to be solved but because of all the unwarranted
guilt trips that you psuedo-intellectuals are placing on him. You
feel right in your actions because you can justify them so eloquently.

Quite honesty, you and the others who are behaving like this
make me sick. It says quite alot about your selfcentered,
jealous souls. Obviously you are all wicked, nasty people so
believe me when I say that if there is a Hell, and I go there,
I fully expect you to be there waiting to throw fiery excrement
at me.

[Flidget Jerome]

Re: Thoughts of a Game Enthusiast

[thebruce]

look, it comes down to roleplaying an addition attitude... in-game and out-of-game, for each of us...

out of game: let's further the game! good on ya to all the crew!
in-game: (eg) how could you betray us and get the princess captured?!

personally, my in-game attitude is simply: ok, weephun's gotta now really be on Melissa's A-list - I wonder how much he can get out of her in the future... I know he's one of us, and not really her crew, so I'm trusting that he won't betray us and will keep up his role of a 'spy'...

now in a sense, weephun (et al) are playing double-roles... in-game, AND a fake crew member... *I*, as a player, need to be able to distinguish my own attitudes between in-game and out-of-game, or it just ruins it for everybody...

[IMnotGarbage]

I like how my post was analyzed by the bruce when it didnt need to be. So if information is suppose to be kept secret then how did this explode into someone having/or not having secret information. If someone had secret information about the game, and wasnt to tell anybody then none of our posts would be here. If we go by what you say bruce, which is if someone has info that was to be secret then why would we be left out. Thats a good point to an extent. Now what im saying is if someone has info to be kept secret then why would this person say i have valuable info but i wont tell you guys. What im saying is if i were a verified crew member, i wouldnt say i know the ending to the game and then say i cant tell you. Your saying thats alright though. If someone has info you either need to go all out or not at all. Dont tease me with Melissa told me the what is going to happen at the end of this game but i cant tell you. And im not saying that what i just said happend or is going to happen.

Secondly dont analyze my post with your opinions. Analyze them with facts.

[vortech]

[thebruce]

one more thing to say, then I'm done with this topic too...

[ariock]

[IMnotGarbage]

Bruce the questions i ask are retorical, and forgive me if i mispelled that word, so i dont know why you are answering them. Secondly i didnt answer your opinions with opinions i simply said if something were to happen then i would want to know, which would be a fact.

[Ranger D]

Ariock, you bring up an excellent point comaring this game to KOTOR and Counter-Strike. But there is one fundamental difference between those role-playing games, and this one: did we have any say whatsoever with the SP getting captured?

In KOTOR, you know that your actions affect what sort of jedi you become, heck it's on the box. In CS, yeah if you kill your teammates, well...that's pretty much common sense. The big question is if this plot point was set in stone or if the PMs decided to take what weephun told Melissa and ran with it. Depending on that answer, I would have different reactions to what weephun did.

a). If the SP was pre-destined to be emprisoned, and it would've been whoever answered the phone, then I would say yay for the surprise.

b). But if the PMs just decided to go with the flow and lock her away as a RESULT of what weephun said, then I would have to be pretty hard on weephun. The SP really hasn't done anything yet, and I think it was premature to lock her away before we can get more info out of her.

I'm with Ariock on why we are playing the game. This thing crash landed on Dana's server and then threatened her life. I like Halo and know more than my fair share of Bungie lore, but I feel that we need to sit back and ask, "ok what is the main goal here?"

My point is to say that, in most games, we know the rules. But here it seems, even the rules are an unknown. It basically boils down to "did we have the choice?" Ultimately I hope that this was pre-destined, and that the game will get better because of it. I am puting my trust in the PMs that their goal is to make a game that is fun and enjoyable (and to promote Halo 2). I would hate to think that this is some giant ARG experiment and the PMs did this just to see what happened. I'm afraid we may have to wait until the end of the game to find out

Ranger D

EDIT-spelling

[vortech]

[AngriBuddhist]

I also agree with you, Ariok, on why we are playing this game.
Agreement ends there however.

I've seen the "facts" that you've spewn and heard the opinions you've
lobbed. And, no, I haven't missed your point. I just think it's a ridiculous
one. I don't think that you are stupid based on your disagreement with
me. My opinion of your stupidity is based solely on your selfish actions.

You can insult someone's character because they had the audacity to
make a decision without consulting you first.
You state that something is "fact" because you believe it to be.
You have only addressed the portions of our posts that you have some
eloquent defense for where we have replied to your entire posts with
entire posts of our own, addressing each ridiculous point you make.
You seem to believe that if someone doesn't agree with you that they
are to stupid to get your point.

Your point is a mean and spitefull one and no matter how logically
you present it, I dearly hope that no one will agree with you.

Respond or rant all you would like to this, I'm done.

[Oea]

Look, here's the problem

There's people here who've been 'playing' ILB much longer than SOME of the 'crew members' and have done more work.

Seeing someone with a late august join date that happened to get lucky and do a live call right when you've been answering payphones, solving puzzles, doing things like a MADMAN is more than a bit frustrating. Then seeing that these 'crew' members are withholding juicy game-critical information (what else could be there?) makes people (understandably) a little upset and vengeful.

I'm not seeing it's right to feel that way, it's just the way things are.

I think the PMs need to address this issue and think of something that ALL the players can participate in at once, not just a select few, as this way will inevitably BREED hate. The design is a good one, but poorly implemented . Maybe make the 'crew' circulating, dropping/adding members each week (Maybe we'll see that) Or something else.

Right now, and I'm sure there's a lot of people with me, I feel like I'm watching a football game where my team just sacked our own QB.

[ironchefmike]

[AngriBuddhist]

Sure, I have been here since late July and would have loved to have
gotten a live call at one of the 4 axons I got on Tuesday. Or the 3 I got
the week before. Or possibly one of 5 I'll get 2 days from now.
Yes, I'm a bit jealous of the ones that did but I will not try to take
any of their enjoyment from them.

The PMs told us to not hack the ladybee777 email- we complied
The PMs realized that the first axon to be cancelled would have
caused some "legal" problems. By cancelling it, they told us that
it wasn't imperitive to go to those lengths- we complied.
The PMs told weephun to not tell us what happened during his
conversation and gave him a mission- he complied.

They know what they are doing. Any and all information has been
released. Even if the capture of SP could have been avoided it
was too late at that point and waiting 3 days to find out about it
is nothing compaired to the initial wait we had running up to Aug.
24th. The wait actually enhanced the information we received.

I don't think that the PMs were clueless to the fact that this would
cause an uproar. In fact, how could they not know? It is then
either an exceptable outcome for them or a desired one. Either
way, it's a brilliant twist that unfortunately made a target out of
their pawn.

[krystyn]