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Mazian
Unfettered
Joined: 31 Aug 2004 Posts: 529 Location: San Francisco, CA
[META][SPEC] Finding the Assassin / Thin Kinkle backlash [RANT morality="85%"]
Since I'm the person who posted the [PUZZLE/SPEC] Finding Dana , I figured I should post a reversal post.
Although I do not personally SPEC that it was intentional, I think it's a startling contrast when you compare the attitude and actions of Thin Kinkle against an AI without remorse. I further find the comparison startling; that a mere week after we are directed to assist Melissa finding Dana (the Assassin), we are given Wave files that show us just what someone without conscience or remorse would do.
So the question we have to ask ourselves is this:
If we hate Thin Kinkle for what he did to J
2
and Jan, how would we be different from Thin if we turned Dana over to Melissa?
For anyone who disagrees that Melissa would operate without remorse or conscience... for anyone who disagrees that Melissa would be as bad, if not worse, than Thin Kinkle in the handling of Dana I direct you to several key points:
Front page of the ilovebees.com website: "Shockingly excessive force" for "even minor transgressions".
the most recent set of wave files (10/5), specifically fencepost in which Durga tells Jersey "You want nothing left of your enemy but a skull nailed to a fencepost so everybody understands the cost of crossing you. "
There is a connection between Durga and Melissa (and probably one in behavior as well.): They start with the same SERE mantra. Also see hives.html .
While I am not of the opinion that the PMs intended the moral juxtaposition of "Melissa (maybe) finding Dana" with "Thin Kinkle finding Jan and her father," I think that are nonetheless faced with the product of that parallel.
Make your decisions accordingly.
[/RANT]
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2004 4:43 pm
SuperDiamond
Boot
Joined: 26 Jul 2004 Posts: 17
While I agree with most of your points. I do disagree on one thing.
I think the parallels between Thin and Durga/Melissa are exactly what the PMs intended. Last night, I was thinking along the same lines as you are now. It makes a certain literary sense.
Remember, if Jersey hadn't stepped in, that auditor would probably be dead by now. Durga herself said she was "very restrained" in her handling of him. What would she do if not restrained? Would she have the same capacity as Thin? If so, why are we rooting for her? "Everybody hates auditors. I looked it up."
As Dennis Leary says "only the cute animals are protected from slaughter".
As you mentioned, it also makes an interesting comparison to those who are willing to throw Dana to the wolves in the interest of furthering the game.
Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2004 4:57 pm
daboking
Unfettered
Joined: 02 Sep 2004 Posts: 486 Location: 2nd star to the right
superdiamond said:
Quote:
As Dennis Leary says "only the cute animals are protected from slaughter"
So, Dennis would never throw Dana to the wolves.
I am not so sure that this contrast was a mere accident... as rich a story thematically as this is, it seems revenge/justice... not to mention how the cycle keeps growing. For example, things started nice and simple with Jan and Thin (whack whack punch punch blood oozes from thin's face), but we have grown from just a game of moons, to broken arms, to dead fathers... this cyle no doubt will grow with the vengeance Jan will take in next week's story.
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Posted: Wed Oct 06, 2004 4:59 pm
GabrielBlade
Decorated
Joined: 17 Sep 2004 Posts: 202
This just hit me: the reminder on the front page about "Shocking excessive force" for "even minor transgressions."
McKaskill was guilty of treason, from a certain point of view, but Melissa/The Op did nothing to him.
.. somethings majorly changed. (And now I fear someone's going to be bringing me a fishy dinner shortly.. because I feel slow realising this.)
_________________Gabriel Blade::Lord of the Asylum::Emperor of Insanity
---»For Whom the Bell Tolls.. Time Marches On«---
Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 1:52 am
Platonix
Decorated
Joined: 28 Aug 2004 Posts: 174 Location: Keene, New Hampshire
GabrielBlade wrote:
This just hit me: the reminder on the front page about "Shocking excessive force" for "even minor transgressions."
McKaskill was guilty of treason, from a certain point of view, but Melissa/The Op did nothing to him.
.. somethings majorly changed. (And now I fear someone's going to be bringing me a fishy dinner shortly.. because I feel slow realising this.)
Weeeellll...McKaskill is crew. That means he's Mel's buddy. She's got his back, as she said. Plus, the "transgression" was not completed. She intercepted the message. I'd call it likely that Melissa knew McKaskill well enough to know she could get him to talk about his contact.
_________________"I hate quotations. Tell me what you know."
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Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 2:01 am
jellyfish_green
Veteran
Joined: 30 Jul 2004 Posts: 144 Location: Inner Colony of Eire
How 'bout this on a live crew call or two:
"Melissa, I'll tell you where Dana is if you promise not to kill or hurt her . Can we make a deal?"
? taking our cue from Jersey.
Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 4:50 am
HitsHerMark
Unfictologist
Joined: 22 Aug 2004 Posts: 1521 Location: Austin, TX
As we've discovered with what Thin wanted to do with Jan...
There are many things worse then death.
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GirlInFocus
flickr
Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 5:04 am
Malice
Greenhorn
Joined: 03 Oct 2004 Posts: 8 Location: Nashville, TN
What was done to Jan was horrible. Yet even at that, she's gonna get strong from this. Sometimes evil exists for a purpose.
Whether the purpose of darkness is to show how bright the light can become, or make it strong as it tears at it, trying to destroy it. I believe, that in having this happen, we've gained a strong ally. One capable of bending the rules when it will be needed.
Maybe Dana needs proper motivation for something. Who knows, all we can do is wait, and hope that we come to the right decision in the end. If not? That's a bridge best unthought of until it's in sight.
Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 8:43 am
daboking
Unfettered
Joined: 02 Sep 2004 Posts: 486 Location: 2nd star to the right
as I have heard alot growing up... it is the bad news that makes the good news good. I think it is TRUTH that in great evil and darkness, the light of goodness shines brightest.
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Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 9:52 am
Starblade
Veteran
Joined: 24 Sep 2004 Posts: 94
Quote:
"Melissa, I'll tell you where Dana is if you promise not to kill or hurt her. Can we make a deal?"
Frankly, I think that would just irritate her, if just anybody did it.
I'd think one of the higher ranking members of her crew would have to say that, just for her to consider it.
Or, she could think of it as helping the enemy, which is treason. Which is bad.
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Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 4:42 pm
DreamOfTheRood
Unfettered
Joined: 08 Sep 2004 Posts: 714 Location: Indiana
Obviously, we're going to have to figure out a way to get Dana out of this mess. If we're going to do something about it, we have to start by asking her about her primary mission, then eventually getting to Dana somehow.
I think all of this goes back to the Flea.
To add to Mazian's initial post of the connection between literary themes ... if the wave files are taking place in the future concurrently with what's happening in the present, then the connection between literary themes becomes even more obvious.
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Posted: Thu Oct 07, 2004 6:29 pm
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