unforum

[papamarx]

[QUESTION] Hidden voice behind Durga's...

[anaerin]

I think that's more where Durga's trying to access the part of her memory that's Melissa, and getting "Reflected"

[Nova]

This is just more evidence that Durga and Melissa are two parts of the same being. The voice that we hear behind Durga's sounds like Melissa's to me. I realize that's just my opinion but, it certainly sounds similar to me. Just as we hear the Sleeping Princess' voice coming through when Melissa speaks on the phones.

Durga and Melissa both started with 'survive, evade, resist, escape'. They differ in personality but have the same underlying principles. It's been specced elsewhere that it's a 'left brain'/'right brain' type of relationship. There are too many pieces of evidence lying around that suggest some sort of relationship to ignore.

To me, it all very strongly suggests that Durga, Melissa and the Princess are all parts of the same AI. It's hardly definitive proof but it's as close as we can get at this point. The evidence is piling up. If anyone wants to offer any evidence that contradicts this, I'm all ears.

[SuperJerms]

The only dissenting idea I can come up with there is the following question: Why would ONI kidnap a six-year-old girl and make her an AI?

We have strong prescident for them kidnapping six-year-olds for the SII project, but none for making smart AI's.

From a psychology standpoint, Piagetian theory would tell us that a six year old brain would be at a tremendous disadvantage to a more developed brain. The only possible advantage I can think of to a young brain is that children's brains are predisposed to leaning much faster than adults'. The reason is again developmental.

Now, let's think of what happens when a human brain is turned into a smart AI. Essentially, current is e run through it to copy it into electronic form. As I understand it, they don't even need a living donor for the brain, and the process destroys the brain in the process. We also know that a flash clone's brain will work just fine. In the end, you have a persistent electronic copy of a human brian to build your smart AI with.

Back to the six-year-old. If you turn the brain into a computer, you are really hoping to take advantage of it's processing and structural capabilities. That is, you want a donor who is a quick thinker, makes sound decisions, sees hidden potentials, and is versed in multiple intelligences. Again, a six year old is at a tremendous disadvantage to an older donor. If nothing else, a six-year-old has had less contact with the world, less opportunity to learn new things, less stimulation overall, and will be less developed from a Piagetian standpoint.

The advantage might be that a human brain at six has greater potential to learn and less incorrect learning to unlearn. However, don't AI's feature increased ability to learn and remember than humans? I thought that AI's are less prone to make mistakes or forget things because of the benefits that all computers have. In this case, a young brain is at no more of an advantage than an older brain. And, if the AI brain works like a computer, it can just erase or file away any incorrect learnings from the past. So much for the advantages of a young brain.


So, there you have it. I have good reason to believe that Melissa's donor was an older person. Two things, then.
1) I don't see Melissa coming from Yasmine.
2) If SP is a part of Melissa, I don't think she is really only seven years old. She may manifest that way to appear helpless, or to engender trust, or whatever, but I think Melissa's donor has much more human life experience than a seven year old does.

[Robynn]

What if Melissa was some sort of experiemental AI where they actually used 2 people to create her (i.e. Yasmine *and* Rani... everyone's right!). That would induce all kinds of screwy-ness. I don't really know much specifically about the Halo universe, but would something like that even be a theoretical possibility?

(Why, yes, I did recently read a book by Robin Hobb.)

[camshaft]

[Ikkarus]

[vector]

I compleatly agree with you camshaft, ofcourse i am one of those who was trying to get people to look at that possability. The reason why i belive that she was taken specificaly for a new AI program is simple. If you want a better AI why would you train it as a Spartan first? there would be no bonus, you might as well build the AI the old fashioned way. The Spartans are trained and designed to be Spartans. if you want a better AI you take a young brain and you train it and modify it to be the best AI that it can be.

[Smoke]

Couldn't you make an argument that all the AI we are dealing with are rather childlike?

They have fascinating tools at their disposal; primarly the manipulation of information, but their speach, their motivations, are very basic; borderline immature.

Durga acts like a kicked puppy when Jersey talks about not liking her or turning her over to the Navy. Melissa crumbles to a near-infantile state whenever she does her "ilovebees" thing.

Wether this is owed to the crash fracturing or damaging them, possibly regressing them to an earlier stage of their development.

AI are not programed in the Halo universe. They are copied, and then taught. In modern AI theory, that's how it'd be done. Craft a simple AI, and give it the ability to upgrade itself. After years of trail and error and self modificiation, you get an AI that is, essentially, an artificial human intellect.

[Lurking_Kouzou]

To go along with this...

[GabrielBlade]

This is totally, totally OT, of course, but have you heard the joke about the cannibals and the Engineers? No? Another time, maybe. Ask me when this is all over. (If I'm not playing Halo2 or suffering from a complete mental breakdown..)

[Smoke]

Aha!

Sorry, but I just remembered something.

In the Halo mythos, making an AI requires a copy of a person's personality. Someone mentioned how this causes the death of the subject. It doesn't!

Cortana is based off of Dr. Halsey's personality. Dr. Halsey, obviously, is still quite alive and well.

And it couldn't have been a flash-clone child, either.

Brain cells alter over time. The brain begins pretty much like a blank slate; few complex connections between the individual cells. As experiences are accumulated, the cells reconfigure themselves, making more connections and whatnot. A person's brain as a child does not resemble that person's adult brain.

Just FYI.

[Malrog]

[QUESTION]Voice behind you_owe_me.wav

[daboking]

i can probably use my office pro-tools rig to edit the voice to an audible level, but it will have to wait until after work... (the advantages of having a recording studio at your fingertips. wooooo hoooo)

[johnny5]