unforum

[SuperJerms]

Known Commodities

[Diandra]

Re: Known Commodities

[GuyP]

The more you manage to persuade players it's going to be awesome, the better it's likely to become, because there'll be more players and more of a buzz. Part of the reason that certain games like The Beast were so successful was the fact they evidently had strong corporate backing, hence were likely to be good, so everyone piled in to play. A good old self-fullfilling prophecy can go a long way.

I agree that a rabbit hole can be one of the best parts. If you make the initial batch of sites big, impressive and intricate, it's definitely reassuring and exciting to would-be players. Plus much, much better than:

a) mysteriously posting the trailhead on UF
b) having KOOKY, WEIRD i.m conversations with people

I feel with S&S it's been umming-and-aahing all along, and I'm not even sure it was originally intended to be an ARG until we came along and they thought it seemed like 'quite a good idea' but ultimately the Big Corporation element has just meant they've lacked agility, which is an awful shame as some of their ideas have been really excellent. I feel bad when people moan about it because I want them to learn their lessons and come back and do another, better one!

Post-mortem? Death by Committee.

One way to offer that assurance that a project is going to live up to expectations is by creating a sense that it's planned out, even if the players don't have a clue. Take a thriller novel, they often start with disparate storylines but are all woven together in the end. In a way, the less sense it makes at the beginning, the more I feel it's likely that the PM's have put a lot of thought into how it will all make sense by the end.

Or riff off the 0/777 bar from ILB - that was a simple, clear (although not tremendously imaginative) way of showing that there was plenty more to come. 777 lots of 'more', in fact.

Basically I'm trying to get a sense of who's behind the game: is it original? does it scale? (i.e: if there's much interaction this obviously isn't intended for a bit audience) is there sufficient quality i might associate with professional work? does the rabbithole suggest there's money behind it? Etc etc. Diandra's right, though: there's no guarantees. Production values could be misleading, yeah, or the meta-site could be overhyping it, or it could be big pretending to be small, or small pretending to big, or or or... don't worry so much!

[MageSteff]

Re: Known Commodities

[Alzheimers]

As someone who tried to go the "independent in every sense of the word" route, let me tell you it's not as easy as you would think to draw an audience. In fact, in a community that's waiting on the edge of it's seats for TNBT to launch, drawing players can be neigh impossible. Here are some tips that I've learned from my personal experience:

First, you need to draw players in. Admittedly, I had no pre-launch advertising and dropped the rabbithole in probably the worst way possible (in chat). After a week of running though, I had built up a decent player base. Not all games are as fortunate -- the old maxim of "if you build it, they will come," doesn't hold for ARGs. "If you hype it, then build it well, they will come," is much more appropriate.

Second, you need to keep drawing players back in to your universe. Once you've established how your game will be run and how the puzzles are going to be integrated into the framework of the game, you'll lose some of those initial players. Hey, it happens -- not everyone's as open minded about what kind of games they'll play. Also, while there might be high initial interest in a new game, responsibilities and other real life inconveniences will naturally draw the less dedicated away. This is where I think the dread "Interaction" plays a large part. Keeping in touch with players fosters the notion that your characters are real and are depending on the player's actions to accomplish their mission/survive/etc. If players feel responsible for the outcome of events, then they're much more likely to not abandon their "friends in need." However, not all players want to interact with in-game characters so intimately. Providing sufficient means to interact with the world (read: lots of puzzles) is another important draw to keeping an audience.

Finally, you need to be consistent but not predictable when telling your story. Your plotline shouldn't deviate from the canon of the universe you've built; but if it becomes easy to predict, then players will post their spec and lose interest when they're right. Here's a little known secret: Players like to be wrong. The hell, you say? If players can predict B from A, they'll be able to see C and D and all the way down to Z, which means that for them the game is over. If they're expecting D and you give them Q, the unpredictability suddenly becomes fascinating. Just remember that you have to stay consistent with your universe!

Of course, there are also the "unsung" heroes of popular games: luck and timing. Launching a game in the midst of a hightly anticipated event will only bring you pain. Rumors of big projects launching did have an impact on our audience, but I can't blame the players for that. No matter how much it hurts, you can't take it personally when you see posts like "I don't want to get more involved...I'm saving myself for Game X." Sure, losing a prospective fan can be dissapointing, but if you let it affect the quality of your game you'll only lose more fans in the long run.

[imbri]

While I agree with much of what you have said, I strongly disagree with this...

[Alzheimers]

I didn't mean to imply that projects that don't get much hype haven't drawn big followings in the past, or can't attract players over time. As much as I wish I was around to experience Alternate Reality Gaming in it's early stages, I really can't compare my observations of the current state of the community with the environment that you launched in.

My comments are based on the impressions that I get from trends I have witnessed in the eight months I've been a member of this community, as well as experiences with setting up my own nickelodeon in the bazaar. These experiences tell me several things:

1) Projects announced early will draw more attention than unannounced launches, at least in the short term and likely overall. The more players involved at the beginning, the less likely you'll run into resistance from those who don't want to jump in midstream.

2) Rumors of and announcements of future projects with "selling points" such as a well known producer or a popular sponsor are likely to reduce the overall attention paid to secret projects launched quietly. I call this the "saving myself" phenomenon, and it implies that players can't or aren't willing to pay attention to more than one project at a time. While I can appreciate those that want to really get involved in a highly anticipated game, I can't help but feel that something's being lost by not experiencing the unknown adventure. But it's not up to me -- it's up to the individual, and this is seemingly the attitude of a good number of them.

3) Projects that involve a sponsored tie-in are more likely to draw the mainstream crowd, who will (expecting the same experience) will be less likely to join an independent project later on. The result is that these projects look "Bigger" while making the independent projects look "Smaller" in comparison. While I don't agree that the size of the following indicates the quality of the game, (I prefer to gauge a game based on player reaction) others may feel differently. Who wants to play a game noone else is playing?

The bottom line is, based on these three observations, I conclude that it is important, if not necessary, that a game build up some momentum before launch. While I'm sure all of us dream of finding that diamond in the rough--that tiny rabbithole that becomes a mainstream phenomenon--the bottom line is that without early interest most projects will not get the attention they deserve.

[imbri]

I suppose that you and I are coming at this from two very different angles. I don't believe in creating a game for the current unfiction crowd. Sure, it's great if they get involved in it, but I wouldn't actively market a game for them. It's not that I don't like or respect the current crowd, because I really do. It's not that I wouldn't want them to experience my works and that I wouldn't be hurt when some of my favorite players didn't get to enjoy the experience (which I was with Mu). It's just that I believe that there's far more that can be done when looking outside the existing crowd who, as you point out, often want things to fit a certain format and, as we've seen a number of times, are unwilling to move out of their 'arg comfort zone'. So, not only does this lead to formulaic experiences but it does little to expand the genre.

Back when we were creating MU, we did nothing to draw in the attention of those on UF & ARGN. In two of my other projects, there's been absolutely no involvement from the UF crowd. This is partially by design and partially because UF isn't the intended audience. This allows me, as a PM, to expand my experiences and attempt new and different things.

With MU, it would have been extremely easy to captivate the existing community and build hype & excitement. Not only were Space & Steve on the dev team, but the majority of the team had a strong PM reputation based on the work with Lockjaw. Sure, we could have increased our initial numbers and, perhaps, spread further on the internet. However, we chose a different approach and, in doing so, brought a number of new people into the community, some of whom have remained active and others who just check in on occasion. When all was said and done, those that were around UF/ARGN prior to the launch were just a blip of our total player base and a large number of them didn't even play, prefering to play Acheron and whatnot. So, by looking outside of the community, we didn't have to compete for attention with experiences that launched within the community. Sure, we had the "ease" of having the matrix as a backdrop, however I do believe that it is possible to get an audience outside of the community.

I don't begrudge those, like you, that look for an audience within the current community, but I do wish that more would challenge themselves to look beyond and to work on bringing new players into the fold. As an added bonus, they'll be seen as new, exciting, and innovative by those that have never seen an ARG before and they won't have to compete with any number of other games going on within the community or the jaded player types that are so fearful of getting involved in something that will implode.

- brooke

[Alzheimers]

[imbri]

[Liqidcrack]

My 2 hundtreths of 2 cents

[Alzheimers]

[Alzheimers]

Re: My 2 hundtreths of 2 cents

[imbri]

I'm late for school, so I don't have much time, but let me ask you to clarify a few things, if you would, so that I could respond in earnest when I return.

[Alzheimers]