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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!) » The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!): General/Updates
[SPEC] Do latest wavs prove Covie involved in ILB?
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Daddy
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Joined: 24 Sep 2004
Posts: 66

 		[SPEC] Do latest wavs prove Covie involved in ILB?
Doesn't the fact that Durga copies herself in the recipe 8 wavs prove there's some Covie connection here? Many (including myself) have specced that PF is Covie but haven't had anything concrete to support this belief. But the fact that Durga, a human-made smart AI, performs a function only possible by a Covie AI (per First Strike) seems to solidify this spec.

Also, the fact that the artifact--a super signaling beacon of apparent Forerunner origin, just happened to be floating in deep Covie space for us to pick up and bring home makes me raise an eyebrow. Now, when you consider that the aforementioned AI with the Covie copying ability played a major role in setting off a signal that can lead the Covies to Earth it makes me believe more and more that this whole thing was set up by the enemy.

I think all of us crew--plus Jan, Jersey and the rest of them have all been pawns in a plan that ultimately sets the stage for what happens on NOV 9--when we will get a chance to redeem ourselves. Wink

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:22 am
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THe_Smakus
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 		II disagree with your first point, cannot argue for or against the second, and strongly believe in the third. Laughing

I don't think Mel's actions on the most recent wavs are the same as Cortana's from the last Halo book. Since this is an important plot point to said book, i'll use the spoiler tags just to be safe.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
When Cortana copied herself in First Strike, she was making a flawed duplicate so she could be in two places at once. When Durga "copied" herself into the Chawla Base computer grid, she was merely occupying more than once space as the same whole, much like "wetting the system" all over again. She did not duplicate herself; it seems more like a transmission/transaction by my understanding.


As far as your second paragraph, it makes sense, but it no more or less valid than the argument of the "Flea" being Standish's spy ware. Both arguments have a great volume of at least circumstantial evidence, but i don't think the truth will be fully revealed until the end of the game.

I certainly agree with your final assertion, but i think we might have different concepts of what is to come.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:41 am
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Daddy
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Joined: 24 Sep 2004
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THe_Smakus wrote:
II disagree with your first point, cannot argue for or against the second, and strongly believe in the third. Laughing

I don't think Mel's actions on the most recent wavs are the same as Cortana's from the last Halo book. Since this is an important plot point to said book, i'll use the spoiler tags just to be safe.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
When Cortana copied herself in First Strike, she was making a flawed duplicate so she could be in two places at once. When Durga "copied" herself into the Chawla Base computer grid, she was merely occupying more than once space as the same whole, much like "wetting the system" all over again. She did not duplicate herself; it seems more like a transmission/transaction by my understanding.



I think "bug_out" makes it clear that Durga is in two places at once:

Kamal: Ok... ok so here's the thing - we have to get back to a transmission shed and open the ports again.
Jersey: What?!
Kamal: She copies herself in, and we close the ports. She's got to copy her new self back out, after this update.
Jan: Outside, same Durga. Inside, crazy one. You want to let the crazy one-- (cough)
Kamal: At least herself inside stuff inside, includes Yasmine -- My sister![/b]

I could be interperting that wrong, but it definitely sounds to me like Durga made a copy of herself and is not just "multi-tasking" from one environment as smart AI's are adept at doing.

Also "roomy_fast_cold" includes this dialogue:

Jersey: Yeah yeah, opening port 42--
Durga: Ok boys, I'm in, mobile, and copying my primary data structure. (bing) Copy complete.

I'm pushing this cuz I think it's important to establishing a link to the Covenant and their 'control' over the events since July...[/b]

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:04 am
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Nova
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 		Small note, there's an error in the bolded part of your transcript (I saw the same error on thebruce's site, which is where I assume you got it from):

It's 'outside, sane Durga', not 'same Durga'.

There's a few other iffy bits in there too, but since the bold part is the bit under discussion I thought I'd point that particular one out. Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:11 am
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Daddy
Boot

Joined: 24 Sep 2004
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 		Thanks Nova--yea, got that from thebruce. Even with the correction from same to sane it still fits the aim of my point. Accuracy is important though... Very Happy

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:16 am
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Incitatus
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 		Well, the covenant involvment (in ILB in general) Was proven via various refferences.

Now we still know too little to decide who or what the Pious Flea is. It very well may be covy.

To determine EXACTLY what the pious flea is, it would be best to first descide what Melissa is.
We understand she is an AI, and most likly a part of Durga that got cut off. We need to know when and how.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 9:46 am
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thebruce
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 		bah! well thanks for bringing that to my attention *cough*

yeah, that would be a typo... I never considered him to have said 'same', I heard him say 'sane' too, and it makes sense with crazy... but you know, N and M bring right next to each other... Razz
it's fixed now
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 10:06 am
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Epic1980
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 		Durga's copy doDurga's copy doesn't sound like Cortana's copying.
When Cortana copies herself, it is a full, unique copy of herself. Here, it sounds more like she copied, or moved parts of herself that she would reintegrate with when she the mission was done. I don't have crap to back this up and the quotes from the team don't help at all.
I guess it's the "primary data structures" that makes me think it's unlike Cortana's copying.
esn't sound like Cortana's copying
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 12:44 pm
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Daddy
Boot

Joined: 24 Sep 2004
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Incitatus wrote:
Well, the covenant involvment (in ILB in general) Was proven via various refferences.

Now we still know too little to decide who or what the Pious Flea is. It very well may be covy.

To determine EXACTLY what the pious flea is, it would be best to first descide what Melissa is.
We understand she is an AI, and most likly a part of Durga that got cut off. We need to know when and how.



Actually, I wasn't speaking in general--I was saying that the latest wavs (regarding Durga's copy function) supports some spec that the Covies may have actually set up most of what took place since ILB started. Not that they are merely part of the story since ILB is part of the Haloverse.

This may not indicate that PF is the source of the Covie infiltration but he's a good start.

When: When McKaskill activated the artifact.
How: The artifacts ability to warp space/slipstream and time.

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:01 pm
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Daddy
Boot

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Epic1980 wrote:
Durga's copy doDurga's copy doesn't sound like Cortana's copying.
When Cortana copies herself, it is a full, unique copy of herself. Here, it sounds more like she copied, or moved parts of herself that she would reintegrate with when she the mission was done. I don't have crap to back this up and the quotes from the team don't help at all.
I guess it's the "primary data structures" that makes me think it's unlike Cortana's copying.
esn't sound like Cortana's copying


It actually IS like Cortana's copying--happen to have the book with me today:

From First Strike, pg. 196:
Spoiler (Rollover to View):

"If she could mitigate the risk, she'd copy a portion of herself onto an isolated system in Ascendant Justice. She could always erase this subsystem if anything went wrong."


Also from First Strike, pg. 290:
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
"I discovered a file-duplication algorithm in the Covenant AI.....I might use it to copy portions of my infiltration programming..."


I'd say those sound very similar to what Durga did at Chawla base.

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:34 pm
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Epic1980
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 		Ahh, facts, they always get in the way...
Good job Daddy
Alos, it's hard to refer to you as Daddy... Smile

So, what does this mean:
Simple error by the ILB writers?
Intentionally added to see if we caught it?

It doesn't seem to be a big deal in the audio files like it was in the books. It was a bid decission for Cortana to do it.

I have nothing usefull to say, but you probably figured that by now Razz
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:22 pm
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KwayZeeyT
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 		Could it be that Durga is a newer version AI which has this capability integrated?
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:33 pm
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Daddy
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 		Thanks, and that's not the first time someone mentioned having a problem with calling me Daddy... too late now.

Anyway, I hope it wasn't a mistake by the PM's--that would be a big one.
If it isn't, and I suspect it's not, then we have concrete proof that Durga/Mel is Covie-influenced--which means all of us and the ILB cast--are Covie influenced. We're dirty dammit..

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 2:35 pm
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Necroscope
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KwayZeeyT wrote:
Could it be that Durga is a newer version AI which has this capability integrated?


No, the ILB story line is happening concurrent to end of halo and first strike. Cortana is about as advanced an IA as UNSC has. We are told somewhere in the later wavs that "reports are just coming in from a ship called 'Pillar of Autum'...." I don't think it is plausible think that Durga could have technology that has just been discovered by Cortana.

PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 3:15 pm
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Lurking_Kouzou
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 		there is always the slim chance that UNSC AIs enjoy sharing new technology with each other, and that while Durga doesn't come right out and say it, she interacts with Cortana at some point and "shares" the new copying algorythm.

That is, of course, waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay out there. And the simplest explanation is that either Durga was merely copying some data records that she wanted to the inside of the system, or that the PMs fubared.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 3:27 pm
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