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 Forum index » Chaotic Fiction » Marble Hornets
[OT] Season III Off-Topic Thread
Moderators: Giskard, JKatkina, Zarggg
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Jordan
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Joined: 19 Oct 2011
Posts: 845

I think we can all agree that particular fan fiction and fan art which depicts the characters in various sexual situations is a bit creepy, but as someone who is gay, I'm more then a bit peeved when people declare that Jay, Tim, Jessica, etc are clearly canocially straight.

The problem is: they aren't. To an extent, Jay and Tim are given a motivation and a bit of a back story, but are still very much blank slates for the audience to project themselves onto as the narrative progress and we view the narrative through the camera. This may or may not have been a concious move by Troseph, but given that neither Jay or Tim are shown to be in a relationship and we never see, might have been part of Troseph's plan to enable members of the audience to project themselves onto the protraganists, including people who are clearly not heterosexual.

And I don't get why people say they are clearly canocially straight, either. Not all gay men act particularly effeminate (not that there's anything WRONG with being effentive) and it's just sterotyping and heteronormative assumptions that this fandom could do without in places.

Not saying everyone is like this, it's a very small minority, but bah, it's annoying.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:18 am
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twistedpuppet
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Why are we even discussing the sexual preferences of the characters? It has never been discussed in the narrative. It's not important to the plot.

I don't see any reason to project any kind of sexuality onto the characters because sex, in general, has no relevance to the story. So, if sex has no relevance to the story, it would stand to reason, that sexual preferences have no relevance either.

The only time any kind of boy/girl relationship type thing ever comes up in the entirety of the Marble Hornets universe is in the story of the student film Alex was working on. The main character moved back home to try to win back his old girlfriend. That is the absolute only time and it didn't have anything to do with sex either. It was lovey-dovey stuff.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 5:56 am
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Jordan
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Joined: 19 Oct 2011
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twistedpuppet wrote:
Why are we even discussing the sexual preferences of the characters? It has never been discussed in the narrative. It's not important to the plot.

I don't see any reason to project any kind of sexuality onto the characters because sex, in general, has no relevance to the story. So, if sex has no relevance to the story, it would stand to reason, that sexual preferences have no relevance either.

The only time any kind of boy/girl relationship type thing ever comes up in the entirety of the Marble Hornets universe is in the story of the student film Alex was working on. The main character moved back home to try to win back his old girlfriend. That is the absolute only time and it didn't have anything to do with sex either. It was lovey-dovey stuff.


Heh, sorry, should have made myself clearer Smile

What I meant to say is that Jay, as the original protraganist, although given a back story and motivation, isn't a particularly detailed protragnist and that I believe was a concious critical choice on the behalf of Troseph. Most of Hornets is seen through the lens of the camera, and by having a character who isn't particularly detailed, the audience can project themselves onto Jay and his experiences.

Troseph may have decided to not define Jay (and maybe even Tim's) sexuality so that all of their viewers could project themselves onto Jay more readily then they might do so if Jay was a straight protragnist.

It's not a big thing, but if it's a concious decision by Troseph, I think it's a VERY clever decision, as they haven't assumed a heteronormative viewpoint which other creators might have done and really stopped to think about how immersive they could make the series for their viewers .

(Not begrudigingly if they didn't, that shit's kind of ingrained in the best of people)

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 7:34 am
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twistedpuppet
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Well, sexuality is not series canon, so, I don't know why people are pushing hard for one way or the other. Besides, when a 8 foot tall eldritch abomination is chasing you where ever you go, who has time to think about the opposite sex, the same sex, or that poodle down the street? :V

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:33 am
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onetruepurple
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Joined: 07 Jan 2011
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twistedpuppet wrote:
that poodle down the street

oh my aren't you funny and edgy and wacky xDDDDd

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:45 am
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Ztakk
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Joined: 09 Jan 2013
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TheOperator wrote:
Ztakk wrote:
TheOperator wrote:
Ztakk wrote:
TheOperator wrote:
It's studio-produced, therefore could easily get screwed up. It's already pretty crap that the people at comic con got to see a clip before anyone else.


How is that crap? That happens with stuff....all the time?


Happening all the time doesn't make it good. I don't see why the people at comic con are more deserving of a preview than people who can't make it. I'm not wishing I got to see it, since I don't have high hopes for this movie, I just think it was a bad move. But the type of thing I expected from the start with this.


You really don't understand why they show it do you? It's not because people that go to Comic-Con are "more deserving" it's just really badass advertising. It works like this: You show a short preview to a few hundred people at Comic-Con, the BIGGEST and MOST WELL-KNOWN geek gathering in the United States. A chunk of those few hundred seeing the preview are members of the press, who will then spread around whether or not what they saw was good. Saying it's pretty crappy and that it's not good people at Comic-Con get a preview before anyone else is like saying it's crappy that people at E3 get to play video game demos before anyone else. It's one of the reasons the gathering exists.


I understand, I just don't agree with it. Advertising isn't a good excuse to short change other fans. I think this is about as far as this debate can go without going in circles.


I don't see how it's short-changing anyone. You're really crying it's unfair like a kid who's mad another kid from a different family got a better toy.

As for the sexual orientation thing, again why is it an issue. I highly doubt it was some "conscious effort" in Trospehim's part so that the viewers could project themselves on the protagonists....if that were the case then the genders of the protagonists would be hidden as well. Sexuality plays no part in the series so why the hell would it matter if people thought of them as gay, straight, pansexual, whatever. It bears no significance on the story whatsoever. There are only 2 times where we're shown of any relationship at all IG, and that's Alex's Marble Hornets as Twisted said, and Alex's relationship with Amy (and even THAT doesn't constitute he's straight). In the end the character's sexuality doesn't fucking matter in the slightest.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:05 pm
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TheOperator
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Ztakk wrote:
I don't see how it's short-changing anyone. You're really crying it's unfair like a kid who's mad another kid from a different family got a better toy.


Obviously because those people saw it before anyone else. But like I said, I don't care for the movie, so I'm not personally affected. And I also said this is as far as the debate can go, if you're hurling insults now, I think that proves it has indeed reached a close.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:21 pm
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Master of Octopi
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Joined: 05 Sep 2013
Posts: 115

Ztakk wrote:


As for the sexual orientation thing, again why is it an issue. I highly doubt it was some "conscious effort" in Trospehim's part so that the viewers could project themselves on the protagonists....if that were the case then the genders of the protagonists would be hidden as well. Sexuality plays no part in the series so why the hell would it matter if people thought of them as gay, straight, pansexual, whatever. It bears no significance on the story whatsoever. There are only 2 times where we're shown of any relationship at all IG, and that's Alex's Marble Hornets as Twisted said, and Alex's relationship with Amy (and even THAT doesn't constitute he's straight). In the end the character's sexuality doesn't fucking matter in the slightest.


Agreed. I think the only real deliberate choice was to eliminate romance as a motivation for the majority of the characters, especially the two true protagonists, Jay and Tim (assuming you trust Tim and such). Interestingly, they inverted the Damsel in Distress trope with Alex; the twisted, unhinged, possibly insane antagonist continually claims to want to find and save his girlfriend, who might actually be the one actively working against his other motives if she's Hoody. Then a subversion with Jay wanting to save Jessica, an ally with no evidence of romance (other than proximity and gender) who was either killed or worse the second she went missing, meaning actually saving her is either impossible or astronomically difficult.

Anyway, I think they just wanted to avoid making "Taken" with eldritch horrors. Although I probably would see that movie.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:27 pm
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ZargggModerator
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Joined: 23 Dec 2010
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IMHO, the characters' sexual preferences are ultimately irrelevant to the series except for Alex's, for whom we know he is at least interested in women (or pretending to for Amy's sake).

I understand the desire for more positive portrayals of non-heterosexual preferences and relationships in fiction (and am all for it, myself), however this is a horror story, not a romance story.

Edit: My point is really that unless Trosephim come out and say what the "canonical orientations" are, there are none, except maybe for Alex, but even then there's some wiggle room because we can only say for sure that he has had at least one girlfriend.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:22 pm
Last edited by ZargggModerator on Sat Feb 01, 2014 2:14 am; edited 1 time in total
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Felloffalot
Boot

Joined: 11 Jan 2013
Posts: 34

Oh god, not this shit.

The whole "jay and tim are totally gay for each other xDD" shit is why I find the Marble Hornets tag on Tumblr to be incredibly obnoxious and why I stick to Unfiction when it comes to all things Slenderverse. WHY DOES IT FUCKING MATTER? It's a horror story. Not a romance story. As long as Jay and Tim aren't sucking each other off in a hotel room, the sexuality of anybody in the series is, quite literally, the least important thing anybody could mention, so I don't see why anybody debates about it. It doesn't have much to do with "representation" when people see Jay and Tim as gay, anyway; most of the people who do that are teenage girls who just want to see the two half-decent guys kiss. No matter what, their sexualities just do not matter, but that just seems to be what everybody loves to talk about when it comes to Slenderverse series.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 5:24 pm
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GameGodOfAll
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Joined: 25 Feb 2011
Posts: 705

Ya'll a buncha fools! There is only one sexual orientation in this series that matters! And that is the Operator!

Think about if the Operator had a sex tape.

Or if TTA had a sex tape.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 5:43 pm
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Jordan
Entrenched

Joined: 19 Oct 2011
Posts: 845

Felloffalot wrote:
Oh god, not this shit.

The whole "jay and tim are totally gay for each other xDD" shit is why I find the Marble Hornets tag on Tumblr to be incredibly obnoxious and why I stick to Unfiction when it comes to all things Slenderverse. WHY DOES IT FUCKING MATTER? It's a horror story. Not a romance story. As long as Jay and Tim aren't sucking each other off in a hotel room, the sexuality of anybody in the series is, quite literally, the least important thing anybody could mention, so I don't see why anybody debates about it. It doesn't have much to do with "representation" when people see Jay and Tim as gay, anyway; most of the people who do that are teenage girls who just want to see the two half-decent guys kiss. No matter what, their sexualities just do not matter, but that just seems to be what everybody loves to talk about when it comes to Slenderverse series.


Um, did you even read my post? All I said was that Troseph seem to have left Jay a somewhat undetailed character and that since most of the series is seen first-person through the camera lens, that it makes it easier for the audience to project themselves onto him and his experiences and that they may or may not do the same thing with Tim.

I also said it's possible that they Troseph didn't define what Jay's sexuality was, in order to maintain this sense of immersion and connection with Jay's experiencer for the potential viewer.

I did not say that Jay or Tim were in a relationship or could be (not that I would have anything agaisnt that), just saying that that the creators did not define Jay's sexuality may have been a creative choice on behalf of the creators for viewer immersion.

I can understand how shipping can get irkisome when a story really doesn't focus on romance, yet it's everything EVERYONE TALKS ABOUT, but I really don't get how what I said equates to talking about shipping.

This is my final statement on the subject, but honestly, I don't get why you guys are getting all worked about it.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:32 pm
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Jordan
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Joined: 19 Oct 2011
Posts: 845

On another topic, just out of curiosty to all of the Americans here on this forum:

Would you prefer most of your TV seasons to be shorter - say - thirteen episodes for a tighter narrative for season arcs or do you prefer the twenty-six episode format with side stories along the way?

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 9:13 pm
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twistedpuppet
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Jordan wrote:
On another topic, just out of curiosty to all of the Americans here on this forum:

Would you prefer most of your TV seasons to be shorter - say - thirteen episodes for a tighter narrative for season arcs or do you prefer the twenty-six episode format with side stories along the way?


I would like the seasons to be long enough to tell the story they ware wanting to tell for that season. If that takes 13 episodes, fine. If it takes more, fine on that too.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:07 pm
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device
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Joined: 04 May 2011
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Location: Ferguson

It all depends on the subject matter, really. I seem to prefer the shorter seasons myself. I kind of hate the longer seasons that end up milking a show to f*cking death just because it's popular.

PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 10:10 pm
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