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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Art of the Heist » The Art of the Heist: Puzzles
[ Please - Do We Have It Now? ] The Evil Cube
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Page 12 of 15 [213 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15  Next
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xnbomb
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Joined: 13 Oct 2003
Posts: 660
Location: J302B S8JDC

Progress

We are a little closer to understanding the cube, in terms of being able to account for all the letters as being a part of some identifiable pattern. This follows on from the ROT work that Ehsan and others have been doing for the last little while. What Ehsan found is that there is a 'Virgil' word for each layer appears in virtually every ROT you can do on that layer. I've explored this more fully and found that it is very nearly true for all 20 layers. There are only a handful of ROTs that are applied that do not result in finding that word in the appropriate layer in the cardinal directions (I did not look in diagonals of the layers):

# - Word - Found - {Unused ROTs}
1 - VANGOGH - 37 - {V}
2 - VERMEER - 32 - {none}
3 - ELGRECO - 29 - {none}
4 - COROT - 54 - {none}
5 - NIETZSCHE - 20 {FMNOQWXY}
6 - RABELAIS - 29 - {PRU}
7 - TORMENT - 36 - {none}
8 - HIDEKO - 46 - {none}
9 - CUBISM - 39 - {none}
10 - SOPHISM - 37 - {none]
11 - CHEAT - 54 - {none}
12 - ZORRO - 48 - {none}
13 - DEMISE - 47 - {none}
14 - GRIEF - 55 - {none}
15 - BURROW - 41 - {none}
16 - DEMONS - 44 - {none}
17 - FORGER - 38 - {none}
18 - DEFRAUD - 34 - {none}
19 - ARTISTRY - 27 - {OP}
20 - MUDDLE - 32 - {none}

Now what is really exciting about this is the number of these common ROTed words that can found. In many cases, they make up the majority of the letters in a layer, leaving not too many other characters. I've had an in depth look at layer 12 (for a few reasons including GateKeeper's interest in a strange repeating pattern which turns out to be the ROTed ZORROs, the fact that the absentee U from INFATUATION should have been on this page, and the fact that Virgil's last Rant was entitled Still King, and you can see both those words on this layer), and here's what I have found:

When you eliminate the ZORRO characters and the characters that are part of other non-ROTed words, there aren't many characters left. In particular, there are little clusters that include the letters in KING, some solo letter K's, and 2 other characters I have yet to account for (the cluster of five in the middle does ROT to a 'Virgil' word ... see below). See the attached scan of layer 12 done by hand to see what I mean (and BTW, my circling of both SOPHISM and MOUNTEBANK each fall a little short Rolling Eyes ). I suspect other layers may show similar tendencies: This is approaching an indication of how the cube was constructed, because it can account for the presence of many/all letters.

I've subsequently wrote code to find all the ROTed versions of the common words, and have made images of those words' locations on each layer (one example attached as a .gif, all of them in the attached .zip). I can also put them out in some kind of text file if people want to use them as in input to other programs, although I think the analysis that follows on from these might be most easily done by hand and eye.

The interesting thing here is that once you eliminate the ROTed word characters, the characters that were used for something else stand out quite easily, and this may help us find ROTed words we have not seen before by identifying letters that don't seem to be used for anything else. For example, the cluster of five unused letters near the middle of my scan which I had marked as unknown (JLMLT) ROTs to YABAI, another 'Virgil' word. (EDIT: There is a word like this in every layer that can be found using the proper ROT as Rowan describes below)

Things to do: Use the combination of common ROT words, words that are not ROTed and other systematic tendencies per layer to identify remaining letters and see if they are used in another ROTed word, etc. Look in the diagonals. See if the leftover letters (if there are any) or uncommon ROTed words have some tendency that leads somewhere. Have a good look at the layers where a ROT was unused in the cardinal directions: Was it used in a diagonal, or is there some other reason the common word is absent from that layer using that ROT?

EDITS: Adding links, various corrections, updated layer12.gif image and .zip to include the now found unique ROT words as well
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commonrots2.zip
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 2:44 pm
Last edited by xnbomb on Thu Jun 09, 2005 8:52 pm; edited 6 times in total
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HitsHerMark
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Joined: 22 Aug 2004
Posts: 1521
Location: Austin, TX

GateKeeper wrote:
toongoon wrote:
I haqve been of absolutely no help what-so-ever on this so far....

Is the "Error 202020" a hint to something ROTing?


I don't think so, I think it's just a reference to the cube.. 20chars in each dimensions = 20x20x20 = 202020


Well you know what they say..

"Hindsight is 20X20X20."

... Or something like that. Twisted Evil
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 2:56 pm
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GateKeeper
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Joined: 22 Apr 2005
Posts: 156

Re: Progress

xnbomb wrote:
I've had an in depth look at layer 12 (for a few reasons including GateKeeper's interest in a strange repeating pattern which turns out to be the ROTed ZORROs,


Aha! That definitely explains the peculiar pattern. The repetition in 'zorro' made it quite a bit easier to spot than the ROT'd words on the other layers.

Quote:

Things to do: Use the combination of common ROT words, words that are not ROTed and other systematic tendencies per layer to identify remaining letters and see if they are used in another ROTed word, etc.


Well, I can get started on this for a couple layers. I'm at work now, so I don't have IRC access but should be able to find time to work on a layer or two over the next few hours. If you could provide the images with the rot'd words highlighted that'd save time. Of course, if you think it's faster to just tackle it yourself feel free, and maybe share the unused letters per layer when you get to that stage?

Quote:

Looks in the diagonals. See if the leftover letters (if there are any) or uncommon ROTed words have some tendency that leads somewhere. Have a good look at the layers where a ROT was unused in the cardinal directions: Was it used in a diagonal, or is there some other reason the common word is absent from that layer using that ROT?


Also a good idea, but I'm pretty confident that the ROTs are common enough we're going in the right direction.

At any rate, let me know what I can do to help.. I've really only worked on this thing for a few hours, but it's gotten under my skin and i'm anxious to do whatever I can to help get it solved.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:05 pm
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nivra
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Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 103

we can make a list for each layer of:
1) Common Virgil ROT'd word,
2) Common Virgil Non-rot'd non-linear word,
3) most common letter,
4) all virgil words non-ROT,
5) all virgil words ROT'd,
6) remaining letters.


eg. for Layer 12:
1) ZORRO
2) KING
3) K
4) horizontal: still, pidelko, facility, ruination, expertise, decompile
vertical: oriented, object, sophism, torture, dada, ReleaseDate, nike, MountEbank, hypocrisy, NishaChronicles,
diagonal??: time, doom/mood
5) Yabai
6) B, N, [M, D]

The remaining letters in brackets are included if you don't include the diagonal 4-character words time & doom in the group of words considered crossed-out.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:18 pm
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nivra
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Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 103

Ehsan wrote:

I'm mentioning this because we're on the 10th page of this thread. Does anyone have any ideas on how to better organize the search? Should we lock this one and start with a fresh thread and a summary of everything we found?

...

-frustrated


Might be time to start a wiki on this?

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:20 pm
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rowan
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Joined: 12 Apr 2004
Posts: 1966

I think I figured out what Emile was talking about with the ROTs.

Our problem is, we are counting the wrong way. Instead of thinking that 'able' = 'a' = 1, we should be thinking that 'able' = 'a' = '-1'. Once you do that, Emile's talk about having one of Virgil's favorite words pop out at you is true - and it's not one of those words that repeat throughout the layers.

For example, on the first layer, I noticed that the word 'conspiratoria' showed up on our ROT-25. On the second layer, 'cipher' appeared at ROT-24. On the third, 'imposter' was at ROT-20. The keywords on the ROT-0 of these repectively are 'able' (1), 'bold' (2), and 'fear' (6).

If you use the unfiction rot applet, you'll see that 'conspiratoria' is ROT-1 of 'dpotqjsbupsjb' , 'cipher' is ROT-2 of 'ekrjgt' and 'imposter' is ROT-6 of 'osvuyzkx' - all of which are on the non-roted versions of each layer. So all we need to do now is reverse the direction we were going in, and we should be able to find all of the keywords that Emile was talking about fairly easily.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:36 pm
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johnny5
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Joined: 17 Aug 2004
Posts: 995
Location: Elysian Fields

rowan72 wrote:
I think I figured out what Emile was talking about with the ROTs.

Our problem is, we are counting the wrong way. Instead of thinking that 'able' = 'a' = 1, we should be thinking that 'able' = 'a' = '-1'. Once you do that, Emile's talk about having one of Virgil's favorite words pop out at you is true - and it's not one of those words that repeat throughout the layers.



That makes me feel much better.
I was investigating the idea of reassembling the cube using the ROTted pages, and hoped the keyword would act as a check string to ensure we had the right ROT. This discovery goes a long way to support that since the multiple keyword find destroyed it.

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 3:51 pm
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nivra
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Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 103

Wiki Page is up for the Evil Cube.

xnBomb's technique needs to be done for all the other layers to identify the remaining letters. Also, layers 14 & 19 have mis-match unique word ROT and most common letter.


There's a theory that if all 20 the "most common letters/first word of non-linear/most common word" are unique, then maybe we can re-order the layers using that. But currently we have non-unique "common letters."

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 8:10 pm
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missphinx
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Joined: 02 Oct 2003
Posts: 395

Here's #11 continued from xnbomb's work, with I, IOTA, and Virgil words marked. As far as I can tell, C, L, U, T are not used. Although the L could be part of TOIL and the T part of TENT. Ignore the ZDN, it's part of VELASQUEZ (see evil cube wiki).

Just posting this in case, it may not be at all useful Very Happy
LAYER11s.gif
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 8:20 pm
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nivra
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Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 103

layer13 & 14

Here's layer13: lots of extra characters.

layer14: I'm caught halfway between "WORD" being the most common word, and "WWW" being the most common word. If the former, then there's only 1 instance of "WORD" linearly spelled out, but 4+ instances non-linear.

Also, there's a question of "WOR" in the lower right hand corner that shares a "D" with a neighbor. Do those three get crossed out or included in remaining letters?

Additionally, since layer 13/14 and 20 all use "W", this kills the above theory of ordering layers via common letter(rot-#).
Also, Layer 14, letter "W" indicates rot-22, but keyword "LASTRESORT" appears on rot-5. This is the biggest discrepency.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 8:49 pm
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missphinx
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Joined: 02 Oct 2003
Posts: 395

Okay, layer 4. I got SEC left over.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 9:37 pm
Last edited by missphinx on Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ehsan
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Joined: 09 May 2003
Posts: 992

I'm very happy Very Happy

I see a solve coming up..

PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:01 pm
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missphinx
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Joined: 02 Oct 2003
Posts: 395

Okay. I think the OTE is a mistake (typo?) Maybe it was supposed to be Poet Pontean, or NOTE Pontean... anyway other than that, ESI is left over, as far as I can tell.
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:46 pm
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nivra
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Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 103

layer 2

started by Rowan, then finished by me

There's one interesting area, on row 10:
WSFNFFS, which ROT-1 is VREMEER

looks like a typo by the PM's. I'm not counting those letters.
If it isn't a typo, extra letters to add are: SFFFS

REMAINING LETTERS:
DEEHHILLLROO

[EDIT: GK found AlphaTest (not shown in gif)]
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:59 pm
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GateKeeper
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Joined: 22 Apr 2005
Posts: 156

Here's sheet six.

There's an interesting occurence of 'TIME' in an upside down T just to the left of 'discountenance' If that doesn't count, add 'IME' to the unused letters.

Unused letters: ADULFALDAM
layer06-solve.GIF
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 09, 2005 11:57 pm
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