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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: MetaCortechs » MetaCortechs: Puzzles
[PUZZLE] The SILVIA Files
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Pierre
Boot

Joined: 13 Oct 2003
Posts: 17
Location: Brazil

 		My "interpretation" was based on what I read at the site most ppl are using, the Lady Shyra one...

I'll try to find the patches on nasa.gov and see what I can do...

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 6:31 pm
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...
Veteran

Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 72

 		Well, i did read tarrot in the past like 6 month ago but there is a difficulty with this picture... i still don't know if those card are reversed or not. The meaning of those card will change on that fact....

I still will try to get something with what those card seems to be.... I'm actually working on that...

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 6:31 pm
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Pierre
Boot

Joined: 13 Oct 2003
Posts: 17
Location: Brazil

 		If I may help, ... I believe that at least the Prince of Spades is in the upright position. Not sure about the Queen or the Nine, but the Devil also seemed to be upright...

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 6:53 pm
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Veteran

Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 72

 		Let's resume this, we got in order:

01 - Nine of Wands
02 - Devil (upright)
03 - Wheel of fortune (it is a possibility)
04 - Prince of Swords (upright)
05 - Queen of Cups
06 -
07 -
08 - Priestess
09 -
10 -
11 -
12 -
13 -
14 -
15 -

looking closer at the picture... some of the card are darker then the other... we probably need to concentrate on those... So we end with the

01 - Nine of Wands
02 - Devil (upright)
03 - Wheel of fortune (it is a possibility)
04 - Prince of Swords (upright)
05 - Queen of Cups
06 -
07 -


Errr... this way to place those card are relative to a question... I will know the nature of the question in a few min and probably the client also...

as for the second and third card well it goes with the first one, it will tell more about the person asking the question and is nature...

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 7:11 pm
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Marl64
Unfettered


Joined: 04 Oct 2003
Posts: 456
Location: Prisoner of Zion

 		This spoon-bending, table lifting tealeaf reading action is giving me a headache.

So how about a short musical interlude?

Code:

"The problem is all inside your head", she said to me
The answer is easy if you take it logically
I'd like to help you in your struggle to be free
There must be fifty ways to leave your lover

She said it's really not my habit to intrude
Furthermore, I hope my meaning won't be lost or misconstrued
But I'll repeat myself at the risk of being crude
There must be fifty ways to leave your lover
Fifty ways to leave your lover

Just slip out the back, Jack
Make a new plan, Stan
You don't need to be coy, Roy
Just get yourself free
Hop on the bus, Gus
You don't need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, Lee
And get yourself free

Just slip out the back, Jack
Make a new plan, Stan
You don't need to be coy, Roy
Just get yourself free
Hop on the bus, Gus
You don't need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, Lee
And get yourself free

She said it grieves me so to see you in such pain
I wish there was something I could do to make you smile again
I said I appreciate that and would you please explain
About the fifty ways

She said why don't we both just sleep on it tonight
And I believe in the morning you'll begin to see the light
And then she kissed me and I realized she probably was right
There must be fifty ways to leave your lover
Fifty ways to leave your lover

Just slip out the back, Jack
Make a new plan, Stan
You don't need to be coy, Roy
Just get yourself free
Hop on the bus, Gus
You don't need to discuss much
Just drop off the key, Lee
And get yourself free

{repeat chorus ad nauseum}

Fifty Ways to Leave Your Lover
Simon and Garfunkel

Inspired by http://www.little-boxes.net/stairs/stairs/stairs/silvia.txt
_________________
Marl
(There is no spoon, oh wait, there it is)

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 9:21 pm
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xnbomb
Unfettered


Joined: 13 Oct 2003
Posts: 660
Location: J302B S8JDC

 		Cards are upright
I'm quite sure all the cards are facing the same way, in what we're calling the upright position. Check out the following image, putting the original graffle image (contrast improved a little to make the cards easier to see) and a perspective view of the cards above and below:





So, this means they are all upright with respect to the person on the far side of the table (people have mentioned elbows ...). The question is, on which side of the table is the reader, and on which side is the person whose fortune is being read? Alternatively, is there only one person at the table (on the far side) setting out a spread for his or her self?

I think we have to take something from the fact that the cards go to the far edge of the table, and presumably there is a person sitting there. It looks like the person sitting there dealt them, and dealt them all upright with respect to his or her self. I know many systems of tarot reading distinguish between which direction a card is facing and what it then means in context.

I think we can take from the image that the person who dealt the spread and is reading it is on the far side of the table. The chance of randomly dealing 7 cards all in the same direction 1 in 128 (2^7 Very Happy), pretty unlikely. So I think its reasonable to decide direction doesn't matter here.

I don't know that we necessarily need to read the spread solely as a tarot reading. The numerological possibilities alone suggest that all sorts of other information could be in here. The moon with the 3 on it over the 03 card in the layout seems likely to be more than a coincidence. And just because the Wheel of Fortune (which I am very sure is the card below the moon) is hard to see doesn't mean we should discount it.

(EDIT: Moved image to attachment)
mycards.jpg
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mycards.jpg
_________________
My location is a little tricky, but sooner or later, you'll get the knack.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 10:36 pm
Last edited by xnbomb on Wed Nov 26, 2003 7:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Marl64
Unfettered


Joined: 04 Oct 2003
Posts: 456
Location: Prisoner of Zion

 		While you've all been staring at the graffle pic, has anyone else seen the faint face in the bottom left.

Looks like a scuba diver.
_________________
Marl
(There is no spoon, oh wait, there it is)

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 11:28 pm
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Erwos
Guest


 		First, I'm not very convinced of this Hebrew connection. Beth is a rather common name, and I'm not aware _at all_ of a Tarot-Judaism connection.

However, the _Egyptian_ connection seems a little more firm. Is there a moon god of some sort? It could be useful.

As for the PRJ picture - good catch. I also noticed this about a week ago, and mailed one of the sites, but didn't have time to follow up. It's almost certainly _not_ lettering - I'm not an expert, but I threw it under The Gimp, and did some enhancement, and it was still squiggles. I just can't see how it would say "Phillip K Gairden, Editor".

Best guess at this point is some sort of odd language - one that I don't know.

-Erwos

PostPosted: Mon Oct 13, 2003 11:37 pm
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Azathoth666
Unfettered

Joined: 09 Oct 2003
Posts: 321
Location: OZ-tralia

 		Nice work xnbomb, that clears things up really well. Unfortunately, my knowledge of tarot begins and ends here, so I'm going to have to ride it out for a bit.

Although, seeing the cards spread out like that I'm no longer entirely convinced it's Tarot... maybe its Magic the Gathering? Or Pokemon?

I'll bet the Architect is a sucker for Pokemon...

Laughing

I've been distracted by the MLO metadex issue, but have we looked at the top of the picture, just to the right of the moon? Looks (at first glance)to be something off the edge of the desk...
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We don't stop playing because we grow old.
We grow old because we stop playing.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 12:34 am
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Veteran

Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 72

 		Well you just pick up what i was gonig to say... This seems to be someone putting the last card. That position is the 15 one so the reader is there. Thats a confirmation of what we need. As for the hebrew well don't know...

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 12:40 am
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xnbomb
Unfettered


Joined: 13 Oct 2003
Posts: 660
Location: J302B S8JDC
Erwos wrote:
First, I'm not very convinced of this Hebrew connection. Beth is a rather common name, and I'm not aware _at all_ of a Tarot-Judaism connection.


Well, some tarot decks have Hebrew letters appearing on the cards. The Crowley deck (which notably is the one pictured ... point for you!) does away with those and astrological signs on the cards, sticking only to the image itself and a roman numeral. The deck I have on hand is called the Great Esoteric Tarot, and you can see some samples here:

http://www.themysticeye.com/pics/esoterico.htm

In particular, the major arcana each have a Hebrew letter associated with them ... conveniently there are 22 major arcana and letters in the Hebrew alphabet (if you include only 'root letters'). Furthermore, those major arcana are often associated with a letter that conveniently is the first letter of the card's name in Hebrew: Easy examples that come to mind are Death having mem for mavet, the Devil having samech for satan. This explains their positions in the order of major arcana (Death being 13th and mem being the 13th letter, the Devil being 15th and samech being the 15th letter). Refer to this site, that does a nice job of showing the relationships in the context of the Tarot of Marseilles, which is a very early Tarot, well before Crowley:

http://www.spiritone.com/~filipas/Masquerade/Essays/alpha.html

Here's a quote from http://www.psyche.com/psyche/tarot/RevivedTarot/ that explains further:

Quote:
The Tarot (the Major Arcana) is a symbolic summary of the inner meanings of the twenty-two letters of the Hebrew alphabet. In traditional understanding, which appears to be based on the speculations of Victorian Englishmen who did their best to ignore the Jewish sources, seven Tarot major trumps are misattributed to their corresponding Hebrew letters.


The most recent reinventors of the tarot worked hard to avoid the implication of a Hebraic origin, because it was rather unfashionable at that time
http://www.psyche.com/psyche/tarot/RevivedTarot/index3.html:

Quote:
Synopsis: The Tarot images are derived from the astrological-formative symbolism of the Sepher Yetsira. The planetary correspondences were "encoded" to minimize the appearance of Jewish alphabetic influence and escape the ethnic-cleansing censors and religious psychopaths active at the time. Later occult researchers mistook the finger for the moon and justified the inherited Tarot sequence


The Tarot and Kaballah are quite linked. I first became aware of this when I bought a book entitled the Qabalistic Tarot (see http://www.geocities.com/parrott-tarot/wang.html). The general idea in this text is that there is some linkage between the major arcana and the various sephirot, specifically pathways that link them (see http://www.telp.com/tarot/tree.htm for an example). 22 cards and 22 paths ... a bit more than a coincidence. I should note that this ties in nicely with recent discussions elsewhere on the forum of labyrinths and the structure of King Solomon's Temple, which was designed to reflect the structure of the universe, just like 22 major arcana or the 22 links between sephirot.

The suggestion is that the deeper origins of tarot are in ancient Hebrew mysticism. This is not universally accepted, but there is certainly evidence that supports it. I've referenced one site that refers to this idea often http://www.psyche.com/psyche/tarot/index.html, but there are lots of others too (http://www.i-dream-of-wires.org/qtarot.asp for example).

Anyhow, it's an idea that's out there. Yeah, the signficance of beth in this context is indeed a stretch. I'm wondering more about the numerological aspects of the cards, since many of our clue images have symbols designed to pass along a somewhat veiled message, and I have a feeling that the author of the graffle image is unlikely to expect us to interpret the spread as a tarot reader, but rather use it as a means of convey some sort of code.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 12:45 am
Last edited by xnbomb on Tue Oct 14, 2003 1:36 am; edited 1 time in total
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levendus
Boot

Joined: 12 Oct 2003
Posts: 12

 		I forgot to log in earlier. I was guest and I wrote about there only being 3 significant cards maybe.

Isn't anyone else struck by how complex the analysis of tarot card jpg is getting. What other clue, in hindsight, required such extensive esoteric knowledge?

This is not a criticism mind you, just some food for thought.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 1:09 am
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monk
Boot

Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 13

 		SCUBA STEVE
Marl64 wrote:
While you've all been staring at the graffle pic, has anyone else seen the faint face in the bottom left.

Looks like a scuba diver.


Yeah Marl, i was wondering the same thing too. I think the image off of the desk/table is a CCW 90° of an Egyptian face off maybe a statue?!

About Jeacques Custeau at the bottom left, i can see the resemblance, but i got no clue what it is. there's also something at the bottom right that appears to be in the "cloud" layer, but looks to round to be a cloud. it shapes out what looks like a 2D quarter circle, maybe it's on the "scuba diver" layer, but it don't look like no cloud.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 1:32 am
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Fardreamer
Boot

Joined: 13 Oct 2003
Posts: 15
Location: The Massassi Temple

 		Just thought I'd mention that I'm quite knowledgeable in the Hebrew language so if anyone has a question I'd be glad to answer.

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 4:36 am
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Guest
Guest
Fardreamer wrote:
Just thought I'd mention that I'm quite knowledgeable in the Hebrew language so if anyone has a question I'd be glad to answer.


I am from Israel, so I speak Hebrew better then you... BTW, how do you know Hebrew?

PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2003 6:18 am
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