Return to Unfiction unforum
 a.r.g.b.b 
FAQ FAQ   Search Search 
 
Welcome!
New users, PLEASE read these forum guidelines. New posters, SEARCH before posting and read these rules before posting your killer new campaign. New players may also wish to peruse the ARG Player Tutorial.

All users must abide by the Terms of Service.
Website Restoration Project
This archiving project is a collaboration between Unfiction and Sean Stacey (SpaceBass), Brian Enigma (BrianEnigma), and Laura E. Hall (lehall) with
the Center for Immersive Arts.
Announcements
This is a static snapshot of the
Unfiction forums, as of
July 23, 2017.
This site is intended as an archive to chronicle the history of Alternate Reality Games.
  

The time now is Tue Nov 12, 2024 10:12 pm
All times are UTC - 4 (DST in action)		 View posts in this forum since last visit
View unanswered posts in this forum
Calendar
 Forum index » Diversions » Perplex City Puzzle Cards » PXC: Silver Puzzle Cards
[Puzzle] Silver #238 Riemann
Moderators: AnthraX101, bagsbee, BrianEnigma, cassandra, Giskard, lhall, Mikeyj, myf, poozle, RobMagus, xnbomb
View previous topicView next topic
Page 35 of 47 [697 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, ..., 45, 46, 47  Next
Author Message
donstobbart
Veteran


Joined: 20 Nov 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Cumbria
Emptynuke wrote:
]why is the hardest thing in the world only worth 60 points? when easier ones like arctic are worth like 64????


This is one of the reasons I don't think we have to solve mathematics greatest puzzle. Also as mentioned before, there must be a correct answer in the MC site to give us the correct answer screen. I really don't think a company that is selling us something, is going to alienate us by giving us a question that is impossible to answer. That seems like bad business to me. Selling us a game we can never finish???? Just because we don't know the answer does not mean there isn't one.

Just don't ask me what the answer is, because I really don't have a clue.
_________________
“Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned.”
Hindu Prince Gautama Siddharta

PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 10:55 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
hairysocks
Boot


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 38
Location: Exeter, Devon, England

 		Ok. I have had a reply back from MC regarding the need to use a proofreading markup language.

Here's my original email:

Quote:
Does the solution to this card include the use of a proofreading
markup language such as PRML?


and here's their reply:

Quote:
Hello Rob,

Thanks for your email.

There is no need to use a proofreading markup language to solve this
card.
You simply need to solve the Riemann hypothesis.

Regards,

Perplex City Customer Services


It says solve the Riemann hypothesis.
_________________
"You never can tell with Heffalumps"

PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 2:31 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
echidna
Decorated

Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 288
Location: Notts, UK
Quote:

You simply need to solve the Riemann hypothesis.


Simply! Simply solve mathematics' most difficult puzzle! Shocked
Well, if that's true, then Mind Candy have clearly turned evil and probably stole the Cube themselves. Evil or Very Mad

PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 2:42 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
poozleModerator
Entrenched

Joined: 15 Aug 2005
Posts: 1090

 		Can someone who has received the solve email back from them reply to it and ask what do you mean by solve it, can you give an example (or something along those lines) try and find out whats going on. Just a quick try.

PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:35 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
hairysocks
Boot


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 38
Location: Exeter, Devon, England

 		Right. I have now asked if a mathematical formula needs to be entered to solve the card. They were very helpful with their last answer - it cleared up the whole proofreading markup language question - so maybe they can help clear up the question of whether we need to enter a formula - because if we do then how? Do we use a maths markup language?
_________________
"You never can tell with Heffalumps"

PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:40 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Guin
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 400
Location: Antartica
hairysocks wrote:
Right. I have now asked if a mathematical formula needs to be entered to solve the card.


I am also replying to my original email too.

In the mean time de Branges has kinly replied to my email:

Quote:
Dear Tim,
The current manuscript of forty pages is available from my webpage. I type
http://www.math.purdue.edu/~branges/
Only part one containing the proof is complete. A second part containing the principal examples and applications of the Riemann hypothesis will presumably be completed in the course of the summer. The second part is important for explaining is not just a method of estimating the number of primes with a given bound. It is an underlying theme in mathematical analysis whose origins are found in the eighteenth century. The apology for the proof of the Riemann hypothesis, which again is incomplete, completes the explanation of the same theme. The proposed proof of the Riemann hypothesis has been presented in seminars here for the last three semesters and is in near final form.
It will not however be submitted for publication until I feel the encouragement of colleagues. This could happen as a result of Victor Katznelson from the Weizmann Institute during the fall semester.
Note also my course notes on complex analysis which are helpful in preparing for the methods used in the proof.
Yours sincerely,
Louis de Branges


so to summarise he has not submitted the paper yet.

His papers are here http://www.math.purdue.edu/~branges/site//Papers

Its very nice of him to reply to me though I am quite chuffed

[EDIT] my email to MC:

Quote:
Many thanks for your recent email explaining that to solve card #238 I need to solve the Riemann Hypothesis. As this is the case I am assuming that the answer you seek will be in the form of a mathematical equation. Am I correct in this assumption?

Many thanks,

GuiN


worth a go
_________________
So long and thanks for all the fish! Trout

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:43 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
skenmy
Veteran


Joined: 22 Aug 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Essex, England

 		Did we get any further with looking at the card under a microscope? We have had a few confimed sightings now...
_________________
PerplexCityTrades - Because the puzzle is only just beginning!
045/100

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 5:27 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
 ICQ Number 
 Back to top 
locqust
Unfettered


Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 545
Location: Gloucestershire UK

 		I used a high power magnifiying glass I used for painting miniatures long long ago and there is somat there but the glass wasn't powerful enough to resolve it. Someone suggested I use my telescope but unless they know a way to put the card into orbit.... Very Happy
_________________
"If you'd been listening you would know that nintendos pass through everything." Col. Jack O'Neill

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:59 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
Guin
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 400
Location: Antartica
locqust wrote:
Someone suggested I use my telescope but unless they know a way to put the card into orbit.... Very Happy


I will just mail NASA......

WHich section of the card are we looking at BTW?
_________________
So long and thanks for all the fish! Trout

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 7:18 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
locqust
Unfettered


Joined: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 545
Location: Gloucestershire UK

 		OOO let me know what they say! Laughing

This bit. It was something Don mentioned ages ago. Btw this is a low res scan so don't expect to see anything on it!
riemannexample.jpg
 Description   
 Filesize   125.94KB
 Viewed   138 Time(s)

riemannexample.jpg
_________________
"If you'd been listening you would know that nintendos pass through everything." Col. Jack O'Neill

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 7:32 am
 View user's profile Visit poster's website
 Back to top 
EvilGenius
Decorated


Joined: 04 Mar 2006
Posts: 227
Location: Vancouver

 		Change of heart
In the beginning, like many others, I figured that there must be a solution to this puzzle and that MC must have it to test any submission against. Recently I have been wondering (though surely not the first to do so) if this is true. The puzzles range in difficulty from super-easy to really hard. Why not hypermegaXtreme hard? It's still a fair puzzle even if we don't manage it. Someone likely will one day, why not someone motivated by PXC? Given MC's statement that we need to solve the puzzle, I'm at a loss. I'm certainly not going to solve that off the corner of my desk . . . Does anyone have a direction on this aside from the proofreading theory (that MC has explicitly squashed) ot the blurry gradient idea (many have been all over that since the beginning, including myself, and so far no one has anything). It might be helpful to collate possibilities to organize a response. Unless someone has something, anything, to pursue, we are just spinning our wheel. Maybe we need a new thread to work on the Riemann Hypothesis proper. Any serious math types out there who want to give this a try?

BTW - a mathematical proof like this will not be in the form of an equation. It will be reams of paper with equations interspersed with text. We already know the equation, the proof is an explanation as to why it is true. It will read rather like: "The inductive step in the construction applies to a space H(E) by treating the subspace of functions which have a given zero [equation] as a Hilbert space in the inherited scalar product." And so on. For one I don't know WTF that's about.

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:27 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
EvilGenius
Decorated


Joined: 04 Mar 2006
Posts: 227
Location: Vancouver

 		Hmmm
Anyone else come across this:

"A seminar met three times a week at Purdue University during the fall semester 2004 and again during the spring semester 2005 to discuss the proposed proof of the Riemann hypothesis. When the seminar concluded, Yashowanto Ghosh, who participated as a postdoctoral fellow, was satisfied that all objections had been met and that there is a proof."

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:47 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
hairysocks
Boot


Joined: 09 Jan 2006
Posts: 38
Location: Exeter, Devon, England

 		My reply from MC said we must solve the Riemann Hypothesis, not prove it. There is a difference. In fact I've been thinking that this reply is yet another mistake from MC on this topic because you can't solve a Hypothesis.

Try looking up a definition of "hypothesis" and you'll get something like this:

Quote:
Hypothesis: A tentative proposal made to explain certain observations or facts that requires further investigation to be verified.

(That is one of the results from define:hypothesis in Google).

The only thing that you can attempt to solve on this card is the Riemann Zeta function, for a value of s. I say "attempt" because the result of the function is a sum of an infinite number of terms, something that is clearly impossible to do.
_________________
"You never can tell with Heffalumps"

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 7:24 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
MartinM
Greenhorn

Joined: 06 Feb 2006
Posts: 5
Location: Selwyn, Cambridge
Quote:
I say "attempt" because the result of the function is a sum of an infinite number of terms, something that is clearly impossible to do

Cue remark relating to the dreaded E thread .

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 7:50 pm
 View user's profile MSN Messenger
 Back to top 
poozleModerator
Entrenched

Joined: 15 Aug 2005
Posts: 1090
hairysocks wrote:
My reply from MC said we must solve the Riemann Hypothesis, not prove it. There is a difference. In fact I've been thinking that this reply is yet another mistake from MC on this topic because you can't solve a Hypothesis.

Try looking up a definition of "hypothesis" and you'll get something like this:

Quote:
Hypothesis: A tentative proposal made to explain certain observations or facts that requires further investigation to be verified.

(That is one of the results from define:hypothesis in Google).

The only thing that you can attempt to solve on this card is the Riemann Zeta function, for a value of s. I say "attempt" because the result of the function is a sum of an infinite number of terms, something that is clearly impossible to do.


We went through this a couple of pages back and it actually says solving riemanns is the same as proving it.

PostPosted: Sat Mar 18, 2006 8:57 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 35 of 47 [697 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, ..., 45, 46, 47  Next
View previous topicView next topic
 Forum index » Diversions » Perplex City Puzzle Cards » PXC: Silver Puzzle Cards
Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
You cannot post calendar events in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group