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 Forum index » Diversions » Perplex City Puzzle Cards » PXC: Silver Puzzle Cards
Silver #231 Cast Adrift 2
Moderators: AnthraX101, bagsbee, BrianEnigma, cassandra, Giskard, lhall, Mikeyj, myf, poozle, RobMagus, xnbomb
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Author Message
kian
Boot

Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 24

The recursive solver approach is a great idea. Mine was finding many solutions, but it's very useful to have the entire problem space mapped out.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Aren't those funny looking islands on the card?

Quote (from ahdok):
I tried looking at the cast adrift to get some clues, but that one was just "which island do all the boats visit" so it didn't help muchly.

Are you sure it doesn't help?


PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:03 pm
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Hunting4Treasure
Unfettered


Joined: 06 Aug 2005
Posts: 385
Location: Tampa Bay Area, FL USA

Well, even with an error, one person (kian) has now managed to solve this card! Shocked

*edit*
I guess I was still thinking and typing, as you were posting... Well done! Wink
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2006 11:05 pm
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arnezami
Veteran


Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 136

kian wrote:
The recursive solver approach is a great idea. Mine was finding many solutions, but it's very useful to have the entire problem space mapped out.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Aren't those funny looking islands on the card?

Quote (from ahdok):
I tried looking at the cast adrift to get some clues, but that one was just "which island do all the boats visit" so it didn't help muchly.

Are you sure it doesn't help?

Congratulations! And you're welcome btw Wink. It seems the card/website has been fixed already. I wonder if it simply accepts all 367 possible solutions now. Or that your solution is quite unique. Maybe others can simply try.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Hmmm. There are dozens of solutions where an island is visited by all boats. It looks like Island 16 is a little different (as far as I can tell with the scan) but there are several solutions where island 16 is visited by all boats. So do you believe those two things (multiple visits+shape) are essential to the solution? How many solutions did you try after the apparent fix on the perplex website? Could you please clarify a bit.

Solutions where all boats visit island 16 (with odd shaped map no rotation):

24 3 13 26 16 6 17 25 18
18 16 6 17 19 7 23 2 11
3 9 20 19 25 16 6 20 9
3 22 10 24 9 20 2 6 16
18 4 14 19 25 3 12 6 16


Thanks

arnezami

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:45 am
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kian
Boot

Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 24

arnezami wrote:
Congratulations! And you're welcome btw . It seems the card/website has been fixed already. I wonder if it simply accepts all 367 possible solutions now. Or that your solution is quite unique. Maybe others can simply try.

Let me first say that I fully appreciate the unfiction forums. Some of these cards definitely require a collaborative effort, and unfiction does an outstanding job. You are awesome! I'm just glad I finally have something to contribute. Very Happy

I think the answer is quite unique, and I suspect the "error" on the card may just have to do with the wording.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Yes, the funny shape of island 16 is not enough to narrow things down entirely. I never did like the odd map shape idea very much.

I don't know if they did anything to the website other than adding the note. A few days ago I tried one answer (twice, because I thought I might've made a typo when it came up as incorrect). More recently, I only tried one answer.


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:12 am
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oliverkeers13
Entrenched


Joined: 23 May 2005
Posts: 917
Location: London, UK

Could you elaborate? What's the shape of the grid? Where does 16 come into play?
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 8:29 am
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kian
Boot

Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 24

Ok. Apparently, I need to be a little more specific. Forgive me, I'm still trying to get the hang of this and I didn't want to give too much away. But I guess that's what the Spoiler style is for...


Spoiler (Rollover to View):
The fact that island 16 looks different on the card eventually led to the conclusion that all ships must visit that island.

The number 16 is also special, in that it is a perfect square. So, I figured the world map would also be a perfect (4x4) square.

The fact that the card has a note about an error let me to think that the wording was wrong, and that it should say that each ship should not visit an island more than once.


Hope that clears it up.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 10:58 am
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Rifflesby
Boot


Joined: 15 Apr 2006
Posts: 23
Location: Mesa, AZ

Do the boats actually enter the square the island is in, or do they "deflect" off of them? In other words, if a boat approaches an island from the east, and then goes north, will it travel north from the square the island is in, or from the square just to the east of the island?

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 11:28 am
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arnezami
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Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 136

kian wrote:
Ok. Apparently, I need to be a little more specific. Forgive me, I'm still trying to get the hang of this and I didn't want to give too much away. But I guess that's what the Spoiler style is for...


Spoiler (Rollover to View):
The fact that island 16 looks different on the card eventually led to the conclusion that all ships must visit that island.

The number 16 is also special, in that it is a perfect square. So, I figured the world map would also be a perfect (4x4) square.

The fact that the card has a note about an error let me to think that the wording was wrong, and that it should say that each ship should not visit an island more than once.


Hope that clears it up.


Just found it Smile (before reading these last "hints" btw).

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Seems I was very close Wink. Especially since I already added the column in the excel file to check if boats didn't visit an island twice. I had already seen this resulted in 18 hits with a 4x4 map. But I was a bit too focused on the odd shaped map and wasn't aware of the funny shape of island 16. But I'm glad I helped solving this silver card.

I'm still wondering what the website fix precisely entailed. Since they couldn't change the wording on the cards how did they intend to fix it? By allowing other answers? Or was it just by not counting failed attempts.

Anyway. Great job!


Thanks for sharing.

arnezami

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 11:30 am
Last edited by arnezami on Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:45 pm; edited 6 times in total
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Stratman
Veteran

Joined: 03 Feb 2006
Posts: 81
Location: Kettering UK

Congratulations kian and arnezami.
Well done on those solvers.
I wish I had the skills to produce one myself.
Smile
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 12:03 pm
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xorsyst
Greenhorn


Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 5

Cheers

Cheers for the excellent approach to the solver. And cheers for working out what the extra restrictions are that reduce the search space.

It's a shame the card wasn't clear enough about the rules on this one - I might have got first solve otherwise Sad

Oh well, it's the first (and likely last) card I've got in the top 10 on Smile

X

PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:25 pm
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arnezami
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Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 136

Thanks for the grats. It was a lot of fun designing and creating the solver! Smile

And its satisfying to see it actually work. In the end it only takes about 1 hour to generate all the 1300+ solutions for the 4x4 map. I wonder if the creators expected/anticipated that possibility...

cya,

arnezami

PS. I've attached an excel-file showing there really is only one solution to this puzzle (given the found criteria of course).
CastAdrift2_only_one_solution.zip
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Filename  CastAdrift2_only_one_solution.zip 
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 1:49 pm
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Guin
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 400
Location: Antartica

That explains a lot:

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
I worked on the same principle building a family tree in Excel. Wonder if this is why there is a proof readers job advertised on the MC site?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 3:52 pm
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ramsfan
Decorated

Joined: 07 Sep 2005
Posts: 232
Location: holmfirth, yorks

You're amazing. It's only now that I understand what you were doing. Previously I couldn't even understand the logic, let alone the programming. While I can understand logically why you chose the correct approach, I'm amazed you did, and annoyed I spent so long barking up the wrong tree (or is it path - a 70s disco in Barnsley fries the brain temporarily). This joins the list of cards which have made me feel ever so humble, by which I mean the solutions and solvers.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2006 10:35 pm
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arnezami
Veteran


Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 136

When analyzing the correct solution I found another "hint" that hasn't been noticed yet.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
When you look at the sailing directions of the boats its interesting each boat path has a "duplicate direction" in it. That is: the same direction is sailed to twice.

A: S NE W SE W W NE S
B: N E S NW W S S E N
C: W S SE S W N SW E SW W N N SE
D: N SW SE N NW E N E N SW N N

Whats really interesting is that if you look at the correct solution we found it becomes clear island 16 is visited exactly when either the first or the second of these two directions is sailed to!

A: S NE W SE W W NE S
B: N E S NW W S S E N
C: W S SE S W N SW E SW W N N SE
D: N SW SE N NW E N E N SW N N

So this looks like another hint...

Thought that was a nice touch from the creators Smile.

arnezami

PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2006 7:57 am
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pheebs
Guest


i downloaded your excel file arnezami, but i'm a little confused by it (call it not being mathematically inclined, or what you will). Can I ask which is the one and only solution?
good job on that though!

PostPosted: Wed Apr 26, 2006 6:47 pm
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