unforum

[BrianEnigma]

[arnezami]

[trevor_jarvis]

Hmm ok I guess this my first posting and probably won't be my last.

Looks like I might be able to possibly help with this one.

The only thing I need is a little help back..

Ok I guess we all are looking kinda at this card being a solve on the solitaire system, so here we go this is my idea..

What we need to do to solve the card.

I'm using this website as a basis for this http://www.schneier.com/solitaire.html

1. Find the phrase to encode/ key or *shuffle* the deck.

I believe this could quite easily and simply be "ifentropywinsoutwardlooksshouldleaveyoucold"

If I could follow the example on schneier' website I might actually be able to create a deck formation myself but either its not clear enough, I'm too tired or my brain just won't accept the method of stacking the cards. If someone could figure out the order of cards and post it that would be great. and if someone could double check even better

please not the initial deck order out of the pack may be relivant, ie the stacking of cards may not be started from tthe standard bridge ACE-KING , CLUBS DIAMONDS HEARTS SPADES JOKERS orientation.

2. Find the 10 letter code to unscramble the code.

Again fromt the example on schneier' website this should be 10 characters long .. possible answers for this would be the 2 sets of 10 heat sensitive letters on each line. (presumably 2 sets of codes to undo?) or could be something like *motor brand* the brand of the pack of cards.

I would expect once the card stacking has been completed this would be easy to to check.

3. nothing much else

I hope this kinda helps.. I have MOST of the last 50+ pages and have come to the same conclusions as the rest of you but unless someone can either explain how to set the deck or actually show me the set deck I can't see me getting much further.

Sorry for typo's its late -- or even early..

Trevor_Jarvis

[UKver2.0]

Re: Assumptions

[themandotcom]

I was thinking... the quote, if entropy wins... i think it could have two meanings, the heat sensitive text and someone working on the inside. Entropy can mean by m-w.com
CHAOS, DISORGANIZATION, RANDOMNESS
so, if disorganization wins, then outward looks leave you cold, outward meaning out of his "circle" so someone working close to Garnet could be the culprut.

[Guin]

[BluesScale]

(puts on trout proof hat)

I have read both post and the wiki and I didn't see this but I may have been stupid.

Maybe we have to make the vanishing letters vanish from the main text block to have a valid message?

Gentlemen, trout away

Blues

[aliendial]

No trout, but it would help if you would do a little of the work instead of throwing out an idea and then ducking. Not the solve, but what is the result of your idea?

[BluesScale]

A valid question. The answer is that I don't know yet but that I will try to find out.

I thought that the idea might be of interest so posted it before working through the options.

[ETA] Doesn't seem to help at all with an unordered deck and there doesn't seem to be a "d" to delete.

Blues.

[Mallerton]

I have been looking at this card for some time now, and have read through the posts. I figured I might as well add on my own views, just to throw them into the melting pot. I apologise in advance if I recap previously mentioned items, feel free to trout me

I feel that the passage on the card, and the image of the pack are 2 separate parts to the same puzzle.

Taking the passage first, there is no mention to the markings on the outside of the pack only to the fact that one of the jokers had been marked with a star. This implies that the pack had been opened, and possibly already shuffled when he looked at the cards. It only says that the cards were new and not that the pack was fresh. It makes out that he decoded the message, using just the phrase "If entropy wins, outward looks should leave you cold." and the ordering of the cards laid out infront of him.

Moving onto the image behind the passage. I beleive this is where the puzzle scribe is giving us the ordering of the deck for the solitaire cypher. And that we should base it first on the initial ordering of a pack of motor brand cards(hence the pack clearly showing the seal), and shuffle them in someway based on the coded message along the edge (most likely minus the heated characters).

From these assumptions I believe the ciphertext is based solely on the "If entropy wins, outward looks should leave you cold.", and the characters "WBBMC ..." are there to show us the pack ordering only.

I know I haven't really said anything new or ground breaking, but felt it would help me to put them down on the forum before ideas started to fall out of my head. I just need to figure out that pack ordering now

[Confused]

Has anyone thought that the cards may not be playing cards but tarot cards ? Despite the box saying casino quality playing cards the star (or pentacle) is a suit in tarot cards and the text does not mention the cards are playing cards, the box may have been a disguise.

Just an idea . . .

[trevor_jarvis]

These cards are real I own a red pack myself the order of the new deck has been posted.

I have asked if anyone actually knows how to use the
encrypting system mentioned so many times before. (and just to note most of the decryption programs are based on the fact that you know the deck order and input through a txt file) I can't figure out how to split/ shuffel the deck myself and have asked for help as I am sure this is the key to it all (to make the deck order), as described the deck shuffle is a long and tedious job to do by hand maybe someone could make a deck ordering program to find the starting order?

It pains me as I think we are so close but noone will say *yes* I can do it.

[echidna]

[trevor_jarvis]

[Stratman]

I will try to clarify as I see it
Deck order...
Only Garnet knows the deck order (and probably the person who gave him the deck)
Garnet may have left a clue to the deck order on the card (Shuffled) - if he did, no-one has figured out what it is yet. Quite a few possibilities have been investigated.
The deck order can be decided by a passkey (a word or phrase or just a series of letters) - the Solitaire program linked below (and many times in the threads) will sort the deck order from the passkey for you. If there is a passkey, no-one has figured out what it is yet. There are many possibilities.
The deck order may be as in a new deck of Motor cards - we know that and it has been posted.
I would advise reading the first thread on this where a lot of good (but unfortunately unsuccessful) work was done.

http://cif.rochester.edu/~la002k/solitaire.htm