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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: Perplex City » PXC: General/Updates
[UPDATE] Path of Least Time 3 May 2006
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Kirjava
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Joined: 19 Apr 2005
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Location: Oxford, UK

[UPDATE] Path of Least Time 3 May 2006

Quote:
All About Ceretin Six
Wednesday, May 3 2006, 02:31 PM

My one enduring memory of neuroscience lectures at the Academy is of relaxation. I have this odd problem where I always fall asleep during lectures, and when they're held in dark halls with comfortable seats - as the neuro ones were - it doesn't matter how interesting or important the material is, I'll just nod off. I imagine that a lot of you will say that this is perfectly normal behaviour for a student who stays up late on the key every night, but I fell asleep every lecture. Not for the entire length, but at least for a few minutes, without fail. It's gotten a bit better lately, but there's still the occasional time when I'll suddenly jerk awake during a CRT meeting and see Sente glaring at me.

The reason why I bring this up is because I've been reading through the Ceretin 6 paper that Anna got from Oistin, and been trying to figure out what it means, like the rest of you. Reading a scientific paper is an art, a bit like reading a poem crossed with a physics equation; they adhere to a style that has no reason, and contain golden nuggets of information that are almost deliberately hidden amid complex nonsense. Maybe it's more like reading entrails, I don't know.

The introduction is the usual self-congratulatory waffle from Cognivia scientists, referencing all of their own work, and as usual they talk up the successes of Ceretin 6 while glossing over the problems. There are two big problems. The first is that they still haven't been able to figure out overdose protection.

When cognitive enhancers were made available on general release - in other words, not just as prescriptions from doctors - a number of people predictably tried to overdose in an effort to get 'more enhancement'. Luckily no-one died as a result, but some people did become seriously ill. Nowadays, pretty much all of Cognivia's products are made so that it's impossible to overdose on them - you can take as many pills of Ceretin as you want, but it won't kill you. It might give you a headache, but nothing worse, because they've added molecules that gradually render the drug ineffective the higher its concentration.

The problem is that as Ceretin has become more complex in its effects, it's become harder to give it overdose protection in a way that works reliably for everyone. It's a bit of a double-bind for Cognivia. Anyway, the fact that Ceretin 6 doesn't have overdose protection means that it could conceivably be used to kill someone, if you gave them enough pills (or a really concentrated pill). Definitely worrying.

The second problem is that there is an outlier in the results for the Ceretin 6 tests. What's an outlier? Well, all of the people who were given the Ceretin 6 had fairly similar performance increases - they all performed about 40% better in an intelligence test compared to people who hadn't been given the drug - except for one person. That person did consistently worse at the intelligence test than the rest of the Ceretin 6 group. So much worse they they don't even seem to be part of the same group - they're an outlier.

You can see this on figure 1 of the paper. The interesting thing is that the outlier's performance, who was given the pseudonym 'HG' by the researchers, closely mimicked that of people given Ceretin 5. If you just looked at the graph, the conclusion would be that this outlier 'HG' didn't taken any Ceretin 6 at all, they just took Ceretin 5. That's probably what the researchers thought, but according to the caption, the blood chemistry data from HG was inconclusive - it didn't show that HG wasn't taking Ceretin 6.

There's a fairly obvious theory here that involves someone getting themselves on the Ceretin 6 test, hoarding the pills they were given and slipping them to Cymbalisty. At the moment, it's just a theory. The question is whether we can prove if it's true.

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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 10:50 am
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European Chris
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It's like a confusing four page thread made simple!
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 11:00 am
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psyche
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As ever, my money's on the evil duo, Miranda and Jason.

That aside. How do we prove HG nicked the stuff? Is there ay way to get our hands on a list of participants in the trials? I know they're anonymous, but would there be a central record anywhere? What do you medical science people think?

PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 11:15 am
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duckiemonster
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There's probably a record.

What's bugging me at the moment is how HG knew she/he'd been given ceretin 6 when it was a blinded trial. If they were taking it for several days before hand, we could reason that they'd got their ceretin tested by *whoever* and knew it was version 6... but it looks like they were only given one dose. This points to an inside plant. The one dose thing also points to someone manufacturing a copy of the drug; even though the ceretin 6 overdose threshold is low, one dose wouldn't do it, even in someone whose brain was as pickled as Cymballisty's.

I've emailed Kurt to ask if he knows of any way we can get info out of cognivia.
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PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 12:05 pm
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Tintintin
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I think some sort of complicity within Cognivia has to be presumed, as the lack of overdose protection in C6 would, I guess, not exactly be common knowledge?

Forgive me if this question has been comprehensively answered elsewhere, but has it been established whether Cymbalisty's cause of death was due to overdose or a fatal reaction between different generations of Ceretin? I have read much speculation on both, but at any rate, there's no way you would either (a) try to commit suicide or (b) try to kill someone and make it look like a suicide with this drug without having extensive knowledge of what effects it would have and what dosage would be lethal.

After all, up until this generation of Ceretin that hasn't even left a test environment yet, all Cymbalisty would have got for popping a bucketload of the stuff would have been a headache. I therefore speculate, at the very least, that someone at Cognivia has leaked information (whether purposefully or otherwise) that C6 has this lack of protection before the trial, giving HG the chance to purloin the sample and either mass-produce it or slip it straight to Cymbalisty.

Hmmm... actually, do we know precisely when the preliminary trial was? The paper is dated April, but if there was sufficient time between HG stealing the sample and Cymbalisty's death, perhaps it could have been analysed and/or synthesised in the interim.

(edit for clarity)

PostPosted: Wed May 03, 2006 1:23 pm
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Tintintin
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Possible coincidence - initial interpretation of the London Eye morse code message contained the word 'outlier'...

Quote:
So all in all, we have...

"N O T S E T F T A T AT E T M U S T M T H E O ? L I E R I 6 T O U T L I E R T E V C Y H O E R N S T S E I N K L I ? W S T H T S T L A N N M S U S E E H P Y D U S E E E N W H G N O A N U E U U A S E E U U E E"


PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 10:52 am
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ArcySparky
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And there appears to be a 6 there as well... You know as in G6 Ceretin?

~Arconceagainmanagestostatetheblindinglyobvious...

PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:07 am
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European Chris
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However there is also a 'cyhoerstseinkli' there as well so it's all swings, roundabouts and mouldy bananas.

~chrisisdoingthisfornoparticularreason...
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:09 am
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ArcySparky
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*sigh* I guess.

Well if I had been down in london I would have been much better at recording... kinda... well. Probably not.

*wishes it knew morse code*

~Arcsaysyou'reatotallcopyelephant...

PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:16 am
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European Chris
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Actually you couldn't have done much worse than anyone else who was there. Particularly the people who didn't want to stand close to the edge because it was too high. Rolling Eyes

~christhinksthislittlebitofthemessageismorefunthanitoriginallylooked...
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:27 am
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duckiemonster
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I'm still envious of you lot wot got flashed.

duckiehasaheadacheandyou'remakingitworseknockitoffplease Razz
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:40 am
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European Chris
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~christhinksthatduckieshouldn'tlookatArcy'shairthenordrinksomuch. Wink
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:44 am
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ArcySparky
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I so hope they bring a PCAG Tournament to Edinburgh...

*crosses fingers*

And even if they flash over Prince's Street Gardens and you can only see it from Scot's monument, I shall overcome my fear of heights and record, dammit!

Anyway, I got a little off topic. How long does it take Kurt to write a blog about his plans? I've got some serious procrastonation to be catching up with and he's making me delay it even further.

~ArcsuggestssomeAsprinormaybeacoupleIbuprofein... (At least untill they release Ceretin 5 over here Razz)

PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 11:48 am
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Juxta
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Juxta sends out for an extra sized helping of space bars, and a copy of "Why it's just wrong to write in the third person constantly: The Self Help Guide" and will distribute them appropriately, possibly with a clip round the ear too

J
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PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 12:21 pm
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Tintintin
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European Chris wrote:
However there is also a 'cyhoerstseinkli' there as well so it's all swings, roundabouts and mouldy bananas.


That bit's, er, the chemical make-up of the rogue molecule in C6. Or something.

PostPosted: Thu May 04, 2006 12:32 pm
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