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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: General » ARG: Silver Ladder
[UPDATE] silverladder.com week 2: 18/11/07 - 24/11/07
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Author Message
Dak
Guest


 		I sent this

Quote:
I admit that I am very critical of not only art, but other people and their way of expression. But, to not critize would mean that the art,fashions, and people would not change.

Because in the end change in these areas is made to try to reverse opinion.

Artists may change their art in order to be seen as better.

Musicians may change their styles in the same way.

So critizism is a constructive force not destructive.


No doubt he'll prove me wrong though.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 8:22 pm
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Valrik
Boot


Joined: 16 Nov 2007
Posts: 65

 		I emailed 2D saying that I don't feel comfortable criticizing art and posted a snippet from the IRC:

Quote:
(2:41:40 AM) Valrik: Because who are we to critique art?
(2:41:45 AM) Valrik: It's ART!
(2:41:59 AM) xxxx: he said criticize
(2:42:03 AM) xxxx: not critique
(2:42:04 AM) xxxxxxx: There's a difference between "critique"
(2:42:09 AM) xxxxxxx: and "criticize"
(2:42:15 AM) xxxxxxx: critique is constructive
(2:42:20 AM) xxxxxxx: criticize is "omg this sux"


2D responded:
Quote:
Michael,

Do people really think I've asked them to criticize?

2D


I said:
Quote:

Some people are opting for shutting up. Others are just sending you something they've created, which I'm sure you're seeing in your inbox.

I think I was just feeling the desperate need to contribute and unsure of what to do because I try not to criticize things because I have a strong dislike for critics. Those who can, do. Those who can't, criticize.


2D Replied:
Quote:
Mostly it was about shutting up.


So there you have it.

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:04 pm
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JaeDom
Decorated


Joined: 10 Sep 2007
Posts: 227
Location: SouCal

 		HAHAHAHAH. freakin 2D. watch, you got it! mwahahaha.


So maybe he was just saying, SHUT UP about judging others? perhaps. Laughing

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:23 pm
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analogwatch
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Hazel Park, MI

 		Re: 2d's reply
Coffeebean wrote:
a.watch.....I am not sure how to take your response. SHUT UP? You can not honestly say that you have looked at a piece of art, whether it be a picture, a song, a sculpture and said "I like that" or "I don't like that". To say you would never criticize art would be almost impossible and to just say shut up, would be pointless.
I said many things to 2D in my email, some of which I'd rather not share.

I never said I wasn't without criticism -- I just *try* not to criticize, because then I feel obligated to attempt to outdo, and I know in my heart I cannot. I draw, but I don't feel like I'm talented or anything.

Besides, I'd already shared art with the Two of Diamonds.
_________________
i'm a lurker. srsly.
played: brent ambroise, silverladder

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 10:44 pm
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Coffeebean
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Jun 2007
Posts: 626

 		did you get a reply?

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 11:12 pm
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Sythys
Veteran


Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 126

 		The message I got from the video was "Put up or shut up!" and I know I can't do any better than those guys who get paid to make video, audio, vocalize, etc.... So I sent this

Quote:
I understand your message perfectly.


My grandmother would preach to me when I was a child that..."If you can't say nothin' good, don't say nothin' at all". I've really tried to live by
that mantra. I haven't always succeeded, but I have tried.

Which leads into the scripture my grandmother and mother would show me, and I keep close to my heart.

James 3:1-10


Your Friend,
Sythys


This was the reply I got...
Quote:
I like that. I'm using that verse in a bulletin, lest the passengers think
I am criticizing them.

2D


Which is when I found the bulletin on MS.
_________________
"I'm all jacked up on Mountain Dew... Woo Hoo!" Texasranger - Talladega Nights

PostPosted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 11:28 pm
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doublecross
Unfettered


Joined: 25 Jul 2005
Posts: 588
Location: London, UK

 		I'm actually a little disappointed that 2d revealed how to find the username and password so soon - within hours of the website update. I suppose that there wouldn't have been much carrying out of assignments if we hadn't got in for days, though.

I e-mailed 2d with my thoughts and also an image I made a year or so ago - quite appropriate, as it turns out. It was actually quite fun creating it - going to the butchers to buy a heart, etc., and demonstrated to me the gulf between having an idea and carrying it out.
all.jpg
 Description   Aces
 Filesize   275.72KB
 Viewed   106 Time(s)

all.jpg
_________________
xx

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:26 am
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analogwatch
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Hazel Park, MI
Coffeebean wrote:
did you get a reply?
I'm going to assume you meant me. Surprised
Two of Diamonds wrote:
If everybody produced drawings as insightful as yours, your own drawings would hardly be special. This is exactly my point.

2D


edit: that Mad face plagues me. I always forget it makes a mean face on here. >.<
_________________
i'm a lurker. srsly.
played: brent ambroise, silverladder

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:40 am
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satims
Decorated


Joined: 21 Sep 2007
Posts: 275

 		I have sent 2D multiple emails on various subjects and I never get a reply. I wonder if I upset him somehow or maybe I am just paranoid.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:23 am
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Horatio
Greenhorn

Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 7

 		My Response
I decided to write the Two of Diamonds tonight:

Quote:
I must take exception to the sentiment exhibited in your assignment.
Certainly criticism should spur the generation of new art (as it has
since its inception), but criticism should never necessitate the
critic to engage in the generation of art. The function of criticism
is to mediate the disconnect between the artist and the layman -- to
make accessible the rather intimidating realm of art to the "common"
person.

Of course, the model of criticism that I've presented has been
historically troubled, particularly by academia, which has claimed the
realms of "expertise" and "authority" for themselves.

Nonetheless, criticism has served in the past to liberate art from
draconic orders of artificers that would seek to control it. Wasn't
Marxism a critique the repressive bindings of unchecked capitalism?
Did it not mobilize millions, and establish entire historical eras?
All of this from a man who was no more capable of drawing a portrait
or painting a landscape than myself.

Of course, as is consistent with the notion you posit, criticism often
is art itself. The Impressionists understood that the human form had
already been perfected in art, and that material reality itself had
been conquered by the photograph. Thus, they created a new art that
stood as a critique of functions of reproduction.

But whatever my disagreement, you'll find me a sport. Attached is an
image inspired to a degree by Beckett. I do not fancy myself an
artist, but your assignment is a fair one.

-- Horatio


To which he or she responded:

Quote:
I fail to see how art needs interpretation - essentially aesthetic
training, if I read you correctly. Mediating the message of art - awfully
bold of the critic to assume the viewer or listener needs him for a valid
experience.

Thanks for writing. Share this with the others.

2D


To which I responded in turn:
Quote:
My point exactly. Criticism (though it has, as I admitted, been appropriated for the purpose of enforcing dogmatic and often institutional ideologies) is the method by which each individual viewer or listener elaborates and communicates their experience (the sharing and exchange of which becomes appreciation).

And I'll be sure to post this tonight. Thank you.

-- H


That's all for now. Ta-ta.

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:48 pm
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unVoice
Veteran


Joined: 30 Oct 2007
Posts: 121
Location: Frederick, MD

 		... I love your name. ♥

PostPosted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:54 pm
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analogwatch
Unfettered


Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 306
Location: Hazel Park, MI

 		I got another email tonight from 2D, unprovoked.

Two of Diamonds wrote:
Subject: Status
Hi Erin,

How's it going out there? It seems that most people didn't want to hear what I said about criticism. Ironic.

2D
11:11
11/18
http://www.silverladder.com

:/ So, I sent one back.
analogwatch wrote:
Well, it's all right. A few people are still ramming their head against your blanks, and I'm thinking I should really be helping.

The thing is, not many people want to hear about criticism because they cannot stand receiving it themselves, or perhaps because they think they are above such simple and true advice. Just my opinion, however.

I produced a bit more art last night, and I still need to scan in my gift for the Two of Spades.

I wonder if I'm clever enough to help with the blanks.

I got another reply not that long ago.
Two of Diamonds wrote:
I can think of two or three blanks that should be easily solved. I'm curious to read what the guesses are. And while Michael Stipe's voice has noticeably aged and lowered since the '80s, there isn't anything from the back catalog he couldn't pull off.

2D

That last sentence in his email reply is a solve, and I have updated the wiki to reflect that. Very Happy I sent a reply, as well...
analogwatch wrote:
... Thank you.

Would you like to see some of our guesses so far?

_________________
i'm a lurker. srsly.
played: brent ambroise, silverladder

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:36 am
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umcookba
Greenhorn

Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 6

 		SPEC darkhall2
A reasonable attempt to fill in the blanks
I don't have conclusive evidence on this but it seems to fit. (I am a bit of a music geek)

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
__Audioslave____ are the real thing, and _____Cornell_ knows it.
Like most solo
albums, ___Carry On______ is a nice thing for the fans to have,
but it's nothing to get ____excited___ about.
There's zero groove on the repetitive ___Euphoria___ _Morning____,
how are we supposed to believe anything else he has to say?
- ____Morello___ lost again and alone in the studio without ___Rage_____
only because the band isn't doing anything. It's nothing to get excited
It's not surprising that ___Zach_ _de_ la_ __Rocha_ has none of what made
an attempt to distance himself from his old band or show everyone that he
can go it alone. But
Fine, outgrown the __old___ ___days___. And like seemingly every
other solo album, it lacks the soul of his popular work. But that's
what made the ____Rage____ what they were. Even the __self__ ___idulgence__ of
the song titles (e.g. "__War_ _Within___ A_ _Breath_") read like weak attempts to
conjure the ___aware_____ self self-importance.
Who are you to tell me to question authority
And that's where the magic happened - even in __Renegades___ - with the
exception of the _Evil_____ _Empire_____, the ___worst_____ album recorded


I don't know if all te blanks are correct but I am rather confident on the general theme. If others have options feel free to tune this up or change completely.

umcookba

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:25 am
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waitress#2
Entrenched


Joined: 02 Apr 2007
Posts: 873

 		I emailed 2d telling him I probably wouldn't have time to complete his assignment and he replied with this -
Quote:
Then from now on, try to think this when hearing music, for example: It's not that this song is worthless, it's just that I don't like it. Alternately, it's not that this song is great, it's just that I like it.
2D

That's easy enough to accomplish. I'm not much of a critic.

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:11 pm
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mgelles
Decorated

Joined: 19 Dec 2006
Posts: 210

 		Are we sure we're supposed to fill in the blanks? I thought the missing words might underscore the apparent meaninglessness of what is said
Michelle
_________________
played Lost Experience, Occular effect, Geist, LGlabs, silverladder
lurking something is coming
playing:The Blackhand Coorporation

PostPosted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 3:56 pm
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