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[NC][Trailhead] Nathan Cade
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LeggusKultain
Boot


Joined: 15 Dec 2007
Posts: 27
Location: Asheville, NC

 		Did anyone else notice if you change the font in the wingdings in the word document it becomes the word "SPACE"---anything to that?

PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 1:36 am
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Macavity
Entrenched


Joined: 25 Jul 2004
Posts: 883
Location: UNSC Comm Relay Station Alpha, West Shokan, NY

 		Right. So, having received that other email from "Canan Death" (the AIII Sii one), I emailed him back.

Here's what I sent:

James T. Lorenzo wrote:
Understood. He shall know nothing.

|I act on instinct, but act with care and act for the future.|

That's three acts, isn't it? But acts from what? Man's life could be three acts - birth, growth, and death - but I doubt it is a man we are dealing with here.

|The more a scene changes, the more the scene stays the same.|

And, I think, two scenes. But scenes from what? The end of the world, or the end of the world as we know it?

Either way, I feel fine. But that may change.

73,

James T. Lorenzo
IFRS Alpha

P.S. - You really ought to listen to some R.E.M., chief. Great music for helping you chill out. 'Course, if you're more into the electronic type of music, well, you couldn't do much better'n Orbital's Halcyon + On + On.

P.P.S. - QSL?


And today, lo and behold, a reply from our friend!

'Canan Death' wrote:
| Act | and| Scene | from | "old" | Bill's | work |
| I | don't | know | the | answer | but | the | question | was | told | to | me | by | a | mocking | Falthis | as |
| What | would | Old | Bill | consider | it | as | if | John | was | Grey |

| Not | much | time | for | music | here |
| Maybe | I | will | make | time |


EDIT:

So, shortly after the last message, I emailed him again, comparing Falthis to a certain corrupt Emperor that we all know and - presumably - love to hate.

His response? A short letter and a file.

Quote:
| I | am | glad |
| patience |



The file was called THUS UP FLOW RELIEF.doc, and the vast majority of it was simply a bunch of Os repeated over and over again. Abouth halfway through, though, was this:

Quote:
BE PATIENT LET PALPATINE FALL THEN SPEAK TO ME


I suspect that the filename is an anagram . . .
THUS UP FLOW RELIEF.doc
Description 
doc

 Download 
Filename  THUS UP FLOW RELIEF.doc 
Filesize  25.5KB 
Downloaded  124 Time(s) 

PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:54 pm
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Sylvia
I Have No Life

Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 2062

 		trying to make sense of this mess
my version
Code:

1 1 6 5 f 8 1 23 26 k 15 3 19 1 18 1 1 21 8 19 95 20 23 41 5 23 88 9
a a f e 6 h a  w z 11  o c  s a  r a a  u h  s ie  t  w da e  w hh i


9 12 12 1 20 14 19 20 20 12 11 9 16 15 19 20 3 5 18 85 19 7 5 519 8 5 4 5 1 1 14 20 2 5 13 5 18 19 19
i  l  l a  t  n  s  t  t  l  k i  p  o  s  t c e  r he  s g e eai h e d e a a  n  t b e  m e  r  s  s
                                                              e s

If you noticed on the bmp images, the 88 9 that ends challenge1.bmp also begins challenge2.bmp and were in the same location in there respective lines. That being the case, I assumed that was the point where the two bmp images should be overlapped and therefore used only one set, not both, which would have given an extra hh i.

due to the 519 there are two version I will put them here for easy coping:
the numbers six (6) and eleven (11) are in green. the different possibilities for 519 are in red; eai or es.
version 1 wrote:
a a f e 6 h a w z 11 o c s a r a a u h s ie t w da e w hh i i l l a t n s t t l k i p o s t c e r he s g e eai h e d e a a n t b e m e r s s

version 2 wrote:
a a f e 6 h a w z 11 o c s a r a a u h s ie t w da e w hh i i l l a t n s t t l k i p o s t c e r he s g e es h e d e a a n t b e m e r s s


PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 1:56 am
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nilradical
Boot

Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 36

 		Your analysis/decoding looks good to me so far Sylvia, although I have to agree the whole thing still seems a bit of a mess. I've been fiddling with basically the same numbers/letters translation, except I was thinking the numbers >26 might be mod 26 instead, i.e. 95 = q rather than ie. (I also thought briefly about a substitution cipher/frequency analysis, but it seems like a stretch...) Meh, there seem to be so many ways to convert letters to numbers and back, it makes attempting to de-scramble whatever letters and numbers we get out of it fairly daunting (especially when distracted by other projects/life/holidays/etc... Smile ).

And I'm still not sure how to make use of our Shakespearean old bill/john as grey hint. What would Old Bill consider it as if John was Grey? Hrm. I guess we could just start pulling out words from the scramble, and see if something looks interesting/relevant... Out of curiousity, are there any references to the numbers 6 and 11 in any of the plays/scenes we've looked at so far?

Another silly thought-- I very much doubt we could actually argue this, but didn't the rules of the game say that the puzzles had to use only one cipher/riddle/puzzle? This seems to be a cipher and a word scramble, so... against the rules? Meh, i suppose the whole thing counts as a single 'puzzle', even if it is a scramble, a cipher, and a riddle.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 3:10 am
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Sylvia
I Have No Life

Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 2062

 		as you can tell i'm up late working on this
if mod 26
if we use mod 26, then shouldn't the whole thing be changed and wouldn't 95 mod 26 = 17 be R not Q, because the alphabet for mod 26 looks like this:

Code:
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25
a b c d e f g h i j  k  l  m  n  o  p  q  r  s  t  u  v  w  x  y  z

therefore mod 26 would be:
Code:
1 1 6 5 f 8 1 23 26 k 15 3 19 1 18 1 1 21 8 19 95 20 23 41 5 23 88 9
b b g f 5 i b  x a 10  p d  t b  s b b  v i  t  r  u  x  p f  x  k j

9 12 12 1 20 14 19 20 20 12 11 9 16 15 19 20 3 5 18 85 19 7 5 519 8 5 4 5 1 1 14 20 2 5 13 5 18 19 19
j  m  m b  u o   t  u  u  m  l j  q  p  t  u d f  s  h  t h f  z  i f e f b b  o  u c f  n f  s  t  t

for copy and paste:
Quote:
b b g f 5 i b x a 10 p d t b s b b v i t r u x p f x k j j m m b u o t u u m l j q p t u d f s h t h f z i f e f b b o u c f n f s t t


using mod 26 for only the numbers greater than 26 gives this:
Code:
1 1 6 5 f 8 1 23 26 k 15 3 19 1 18 1 1 21 8 19 95 20 23 41 5 23 88 9
a a f e 6 h a  w z 11  o c  s a  r a a  u h  s  r  t  w  p e  w  k i

9 12 12 1 20 14 19 20 20 12 11 9 16 15 19 20 3 5 18 85 19 7 5 519 8 5 4 5 1 1 14 20 2 5 13 5 18 19 19
i  l  l a  t  n  s  t  t  l  k i  p  o  s  t c e  r  h  s g e  z  h e d e a a  n  t b e  m e  r  s  s

which gives this for easy copying:
Quote:
a a f e 6 h a w z 11 o c s a r a a u h s r t w p e w k i i l l a t n s t t l k i p o s t c e r h s g e z h e d e a a n t b e m e r s s

Using mod 26 as per nilradical's example above where 95 mod 26 = 17 = Q:
Code:
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26
a b c d e f g h i  j  k  l  m  n  o  p  q  r  s  t  u  v  w  x  y  z

would give this:
Code:
1 1 6 5 f 8 1 23 26 k 15 3 19 1 18 1 1 21 8 19 95 20 23 41 5 23 88 9
a a f e 6 h a  w z 11  o c  s a  r a a  u h  s  q  t  w  o e  w  j i

9 12 12 1 20 14 19 20 20 12 11 9 16 15 19 20 3 5 18 85 19 7 5 519 8 5 4 5 1 1 14 20 2 5 13 5 18 19 19
i  l  l a  t  n  s  t  t  l  k i  p  o  s  t c e  r  g  s g e  y  h e d e a a  n  t b e  m e  r  s  s

again, for easy copying:
Quote:
a a f e 6 h a w z 11 o c s a r a a u h s q t w o e w j i i l l a t n s t t l k i p o s t c e r g s g e y h e d e a a n t b e m e r s s


We could even stretch things a little further and make our own alphabet rule for mod 27. for example:
Code:
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26
. a b c d e f g h i  j  k  l  m  n  o  p  q  r  s  t  u  v  w  x  y  z

which would give us this:
Code:
1 1 6 5 f 8 1 23 26 k 15 3 19 1 18 1 1 21 8 19 95 20 23 41 5 23 88 9
a a f e 6 h a  w z 11  o c  s a  r a a  u h  s  n  t  w  n e  w  g i

9 12 12 1 20 14 19 20 20 12 11 9 16 15 19 20 3 5 18 85 19 7 5 519 8 5 4 5 1 1 14 20 2 5 13 5 18 19 19
i  l  l a  t  n  s  t  t  l  k i  p  o  s  t c e  r  d  s g e  f  h e d e a a  n  t b e  m e  r  s  s

and for copying:
Quote:
a a f e 6 h a w z 11 o c s a r a a u h s n t w n e w g i i l l a t n s t t l k i p o s t c e r d s g e f h e d e a a n t b e m e r s s


The numbers we have that are greater than 26 are: 41, 85, 88, 95, 519
Code:

 41 mod 26 = 15    and    41 mod 27 = 14
 85 mod 26 =  7    and    85 mod 27 =  4
 88 mod 26 = 10    and    88 mod 27 =  7
 95 mod 26 = 17    and    95 mod 27 = 14
519 mod 26 = 25    and   519 mod 27 =  6


So, I just successfully succeeded in making everything more confusing. SORRY!

A side note:
Considering that the issue of time has been brought up and we seem to agree that "Old Bill" is William Shakespeare, I wonder if the message has something to do with the Twelfth Night which happens to be January 6.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:38 am
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EMTFIRE
Boot

Joined: 06 Jun 2007
Posts: 68
Location: Westminster, MD

 		Hello all
New player
Good morning, all. Trying to get involved and recieved the following email this morning.

Quote:
| This | mail | no | longer | safe |
| Seek | out | the | Angels |



I'm assuming that somewhere in this thread there is a reference to a new email addy. I am looking for it. But figured I would ask for help while looking.
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"Maybe he's just an idiot. Historically, that's been the case"

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:10 am
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Darren Knight
Unfettered


Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Parsippany, New Jersey
Quote:
BE PATIENT LET PALPATINE FALL THEN SPEAK TO ME

Does this have any relevance or is Nathan waiting for us to lose the riddle competition?

And are we still doing this?
Quote:
| font | to | numbers | for | letters | letters | for | numbers | to | scramble |


I hate the holidays for ARGs Sad, ill still be here but i wont be talking much for another day or two, of course ill be around around 5EST to send the message...if someone could have the answer for me that would be great. and if we dont have an answer could someone send me what i should be sending.
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Completed: ::Red Monday::

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 11:56 am
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jjocke
Decorated


Joined: 30 Oct 2007
Posts: 164

 		Good Bye Metatron++
It will be interesting to see how the PuppetMaster reacts if we do not get the answer. Goodbye Metatron, you will be a hunted man.

Anyways, I was thinking the numbers>26 and the letters may just be spaces to indicate the sentence structure (although the Canaan Message may debunk that)

Quote:
| font | to | numbers | for | letters | letters | for | numbers | to | scramble |


That would give us

---- ---- -------- -- -- - ---------- --- ------ --- ---------------

Just a thought...

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 12:56 pm
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nilradical
Boot

Joined: 10 Dec 2007
Posts: 36

 		Hehe, thanks for organizing my random ramblings, Sylvia-- and don't worry, it's not so confusing... It's just that there are too friggin' many easy ways to convert the letters to numbers and back! Smile Anyhow, I should have clarified my earlier post (my turn to be confusing)-- like you said, I was using z as 26/my zero representative, and then just letting numbers >26 be their usual representative mod 26 (i.e. 95 mod 26 = 17).

I'm not attached to any particular way of decoding though... I just wish we knew which one to use before attempting to descramble them. Smile I like the twelfth night idea, though I don't remember a John in that play... Still, it's a possibility-- I guess I'll go look up act 3, scene 2...

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 1:56 pm
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jjocke
Decorated


Joined: 30 Oct 2007
Posts: 164

 		An Answer of Sorts
Time is expiring
Well, I have not "solved" the puzzle, but I have created a sentence using all of the letters and numbers from the wingdings and it does include the answer of William Shakespeare

"what old Bill would consider John as Grey?"

THE ONE ANSWER COULD BE WILLIAM SHAKESPEARE AT 11
HE HAD THE STATE AS I WAS THE SIZE 6 BIG CAT

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:30 pm
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Darren Knight
Unfettered


Joined: 28 Jul 2007
Posts: 494
Location: Parsippany, New Jersey

 		Re: An Answer of Sorts
Time is expiring
jjocke wrote:
Well, I have not "solved" the puzzle, but I have created a sentence using all of the letters and numbers from the wingdings and it does include the answer of William Shakespeare

"what old Bill would consider John as Grey?"

THE ONE ANSWER COULD BE WILLIAM SHAKESPEARE AT 11
HE HAD THE STATE AS I WAS THE SIZE 6 BIG CAT


lol, ahould i send that?

IMPORTANT

Guys, since it is taking us to the last second to do this, can someone send email to Bobby. I am going to be in transit so someone volunteer to send the answer, first to volunteer does it. I believe it was 7 CST. Send the message,
Quote:
Enoch told me to send this, presently he is unwell "answer" -Enoch


Sorry I cant be here but my time is gonna free up after i get home. Very Happy
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:47 pm
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Sylvia
I Have No Life

Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 2062

 		Just some thoughts:

from the email Macavity got from Nathan the question is:

Quote:
What would Old Bill consider it as if John was Grey?


the answer from Falthis is:
Quote:
What old Bill would consider John as Grey?

to which the answer is William Shakespeare.

The original question could then be reworded like this:

Quote:
What would William Shakespeare consider it as if John was Grey?
Or like this:
Quote:
If John was Grey, what would William Shakespeare consider it?


Wouldn't the answer be OLD

in other words; If John was Grey then William Shakespeare (Bill) would consider him (John) as Old.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:28 pm
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natas
PHP Ninja


Joined: 06 Oct 2007
Posts: 3177
Location: Northwest Indiana

 		I found a passage that says something about John Grey not being factual but actually referring to someone named richard... I don't know if it's relevant or not, but I'll post a link.. (look at the passage's footnotes about john grey.)
http://tinyurl.com/2uvejt
EDIT: Also, a guy named Syd Walker played a character named "Old Bill" in a comedy movie about shakespeare.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:00 pm
Last edited by natas on Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:09 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Sylvia
I Have No Life

Joined: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 2062

 		more specs
If John was Grey, Bill would consider it as Old.
or
Bill would consider it as Old if John was Grey.

which is unscrambling the original question we got from Nathan omitting the word what.
or

Bill would consider Grey John as Old.
or
Bill would consider John Grey as Old.

which is unscrambling the answer from Falthis. again omitting the word what.

I saw that before about it actually being Sir Richard Grey not Sir John Grey but didn't have a clue how to fit it into everything. But there could actually be something to it. I just don't know.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:07 pm
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southernbitch
Boot


Joined: 16 Nov 2007
Posts: 55

 		Do we have a volunteer to fill in for Enoch (DK) since he isn't available? If no one has volunteered yet, I will do it. We just have to decide on an answer and I will email it to Bobby. Let me know.

I think you all have some great ideas, I just don't know which one to go with. I have always thought that the riddle was actually the question, and the wingdings were a red herring.

I believe 7CST is 8 my time (eastern), but maybe we should send it 7 EST to be safe??

What do you think?

I am going to email BS to check it out with him.
_________________
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Playing: Nathan Cade - What is this Game?
To Live in Fantasy, is the only True way to Live!!!

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:34 pm
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