unforum

[dronetek]

[QUESTION] SPOILERWas it a nuke or some kind of bombardment?

[Euchre]

I would think a small scale nuclear device is what it might have taken to knock out MGP, but they really hadn't hit with the big nasty bombs yet when we were watching. The camera's magnetic media should've been EMP'd or melted. The fireballs tend to suggest that they carpet bombed NYC with more potent ordinance than they had previously tried.

As for "God help us" - anyone with any sense of humanity and empathy would say that when they knew hundreds and probably thousands of innocent civilians were about to be sacrificed like that. Some of the soldiers themselves may have also been in the line of fire, unable to evac before the strike. I think they'd say that for themselves too.

[ftperson]

Re: Was it a nuke or some kind of bombardment?

[unclear]

I think the stealth bomber run was the last attempt to kill it before the final blow (possibly a nuke). As far as the "god help us" line, I agree.. whether it's a nuke or not, they are attacking their own city, filled with their own people.

[Transparent Blue]

Re: Was it a nuke or some kind of bombardment?

[geis]

Was NOT a nuke.

One a nuke will not have a fireball that close.

Two even a small nuke would destroy NY completely

Three i realize this is a movie but for christ sake do you really think that they would nuke our own soil

Four there are plenty of high explosives that would do the job other then a "nuke"

Five you all watch too many movies if you think that a nuke is the military's best answer

annnnd Six, a nuke would take out all electronics in the area. kinda retarded thing to do if your military was in postion in that area dont you think....

[dronetek]

[geis]

[spaceventure]

[nicodemoscain]

You know, I have yet to see the movie, but already I am saying that I doubt it could have been a nuke. Would our government really give up within 7 hours of being attacked by this thing to drop nuclear bombs on top of our biggest city? Really. I also know a little about nuclear bombs and their effects on electronics and I am one of those that believe in the concept of not being able to see the video if we did. But that's just my opinion.

My theory? They pulled a G.I.Joe. (Showing my comic book geekiness now.) They went and grabbed every bomb they could muster, more firepower than anything this country has ever seen, and called in one of the biggest air strikes in the history of our country without having all of the nasty radioactive fallout. Basically, it is enough explosive power to equal a nuke...but not a nuke. (I'm a cheese-head, what can I say? It's a theory.)

In all honesty, though...It is a movie and the easiest explanation for the common movie goer is to call it a nuke. I don't know. We'll see, I suppose. I'm sure there will be after attack news reports that will surface and we may find out the truth...I hope.

[longhorn07065]

the movie shows proof of no nuke
why
if there was a nuke there would be no story
no handy cam would survive a nuclear attack of any kind
it would be too contaminated or be vaporized
if there was a nuke there wouldnt be the movie
and that would be counterdicting everything this movie
was ever about

[unicron supreme]

[eblkheart]

I'm a first time poster and just have been reading up on Cloverfield in regards clues and such. However, the statements on damage and EMP are false from nuclear weapons (if used in the film). So with my credentials and knowledge of nuclear weapons on usage (and delivery of said weapon), effects and hardening of equipment against EMP thanks to the US Air Force in my younger years I can actually talk about this in detail.

It was pointed out that a bomb this close, there would be no fireball that would affect them. That is incorrect. From ignition of the bomb there is a massive fireball that forms with in .001 after detonation. When we dropped the bomb on Hiroshima, we bombed a prison camp, which was only 500feet or less. People who did survive, for that short time (which died of radiation poisoning later), reported massive fireball blast and had multiple thermal burns because of the said fireball. There will always be fireballs. Anything else is wrong. Period.

It was mentioned that even a small device would level NYC entirely. Well I would argue that if it was a 500ton or 1KT to even a 50KT burst, that would be incorrect. Even a 10-15KT nuke would put a nice hole in the city, but it certainly the city wouldn't be leveled. Flash fires would be a different thing, but again it would depend on the size. For Example: a 20KT blast (and your 10 miles away) would release its full energy in 2 seconds, the blast wave would last up to 4-5 miles and there you may get a breeze from the blast, but there wouldn't be any structure damage or even blown out glass windows. Obviously, we have bigger bombs ranging from small to 375KT to bigger possible (at least on the ICBMs). Note, I obtained this information from a "computer" used by the federal government that has been used since the late 1950's to this day for a quick reference and calculations. The links you provided are very general at best, and even then on the damaging would go along with what I have said but even then it depends on conditions and the like.

It was also said that our military equipment or any equipment wouldn't survive an EMP blast. With what I know, and most of it is still classified to this day, most of it would be operational if they near the blast. Flying machines would be a different story, unless hardened (for example, the Looking Glass planes and the like). Here's the thing about EMP, it depends on the strength of the bomb, distance and most of all, if it was a ground burst of an aerial burst. Air Bursts, around 44,100 feet create massive EMP to knock out unhardened equipment. Like in the movies "The Day After" and "Threads", they showed a high altitude burst but no physical damage except knocking out electronics that aren't protected. Most military sites (military warfare type vehicles) are protected from this as I have seen and worked on it firsthand. Ground bursts are a different animal when it comes to EMP. When there is a ground burst, most of the EMP is absorbed by the environment and is quickly grounded. There will be some, but not as bad as air burst, which I had described. There was a simulation last year that I read of terrorist nuclear blast, ground burst around 10-20K, going off in the docks of LA (and btw, LA wasn't wiped out, far from it). Within a 72 hour period, most emergency electronics and phone systems were up and running. Some communications were back up and running in less than 12 hours. So take that as you will.

If they used a nuke, which more than likely they did considering the radio traffic (even though it was unsecured and talking about in the open about operations), the only general thing I noticed that was wrong was the blinding flash of the nuke before the initial blast wave. Even small ones have a flash. Watch most Nevada or Southern Pacific blast tests, you will see this. Everything else was almost right on (I don't know if they would have a medical triage unit so close though). But I don't think there will be warning or even thoughts of using it, and if they did, I don't think they would tell everyone just yet like they did in the film. If it came down to it, they may only have 15 minutes to evacuate everyone. But then again, people would die in the blast, including troops. But in a situation like that, we really don't know what would happen. It is the Commander in Chief to authorize a nuclear release, no one else. And if nuke was to be used, it would probably be a release from a boomer or surface navel boat out in the Atlantic.

There was speculation that a B-2 could have delivered the weapon (since it was used in the film), but the last time I heard, those were fitted for only conventional bombs due to treaties. I don't know if they can be fitted with nuclear weapons so quickly, if Whiteman AFB, where the B-2's are stationed, has them in their stockpile at the said base. They did at one time since they were an ICBM base also, which it is no longer.

As for reality (compared to what is possibly show in the film), I have no idea what would happen and what the officers above us, and the Commander in Chief, would do in this situation. I don't know if SIOP would dictate anything on this. But we don't know what would be used, how it would be used if we were ever in something like this. Any arguing or speculation on this would be nearly pointless since this is a f-i-c-t-i-o-n-a-l movie.

As for the camera and why they were able to get the footage from this... well this is a movie... you never know since this is Hollywood.

[daisho]

[rjharris1960]

Nuke Manhattan?? Are you kidding?? I don't think that the military would be stupid enough to contaminate the most expensive plot of land in on earth. The army guy said that they were going to "level" Manhattan. My guess is that they used carpet bombing along with several "daisy-cutter" bombs. Still, I seriously doubt if the monster was killed. I don't even think that Rob was killed. They need him for the sequel where he can explain the role that his employer had in waking the monster.