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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: Cloverfield (1-18-08) » Cloverfield: General / Updates
[Spoilers] Military Oddities
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jamman1
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Zaggs wrote:


Two things. First off if there is no fore knowledge by the military (most likely the quick response is due to short movie length) then wouldn't they think the same as the first news reports, an earthquake? So wouldn't that bring in troops first not air support?
Secondly when in a crisis I imagine that the normal weapons check out procedures kinda go away (seem to have been gone at pearl harbor). Lets face it the procedures are there so as not to lose things and keep track of money. Which basically means answering to congress. LIke someone in congress is going to criticize lax procedures in case of monster attack.


Yeah, I'm suprised they weren't deputizing citizens and handing out rocket launchers like those bald dudes hand out pamphlets at the airport.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 1:34 pm
Last edited by jamman1 on Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Zaggs
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 		One thing that struck me as weird about the evac. Maybe I missed something. But do people in Manhattan not have pets? I don't recall seeing any animals with the people that were leaving. Maybe they would refuse pets going out on the Hueys, but when they were walking out behind the hummer I dont remember seeing any pets either.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:09 pm
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jamman1
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Zaggs wrote:
One thing that struck me as weird about the evac. Maybe I missed something. But do people in Manhattan not have pets? I don't recall seeing any animals with the people that were leaving. Maybe they would refuse pets going out on the Hueys, but when they were walking out behind the hummer I dont remember seeing any pets either.


Yeah, pets and kids alike seemed to be missing. It must have been "kids take their pets to the out of town relatives" day.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:13 pm
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Nighthawk
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jamman1 wrote:
Animaniac wrote:
jamman1 wrote:
How could they capture it? Is there even a precedent for that sort of thing (of course not, but you know what I mean). Is there anything that the military currently has that could do that? It doesn't even have to be a weapon.


What if the 'hammerdown' was a FAE + plenty of conventional munitions as theorized. Perhaps the sudden loss of air and the hammering finally felled it. Not killing it, but knocking it out. Now the military has a huge monster laying in the middle of the area formerly known as Central Park. It's not moving, the first team sent in to check on it notices its still breathing, one of the soldiers standing near the Greyshot bridge ruins whispers into his com "It's still alive..."

Fast forward, they've managed to keep it unconscious (having failed or been told not to kill it in its sleep) and believe its contained as they try and study it... but since its a baby a) its still growing and their containment has to keep being rebuilt.. (alowing for escape) or b) Mommy finally finds where Jr. is..


I wonder what a containment facility would look like? What would it be made of? It would have to be damn big and strong.


Well, Shea Stadium isn't that far away... It's not like the Mets need it.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:28 pm
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jamman1
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Nighthawk wrote:
jamman1 wrote:
Animaniac wrote:
jamman1 wrote:
How could they capture it? Is there even a precedent for that sort of thing (of course not, but you know what I mean). Is there anything that the military currently has that could do that? It doesn't even have to be a weapon.


What if the 'hammerdown' was a FAE + plenty of conventional munitions as theorized. Perhaps the sudden loss of air and the hammering finally felled it. Not killing it, but knocking it out. Now the military has a huge monster laying in the middle of the area formerly known as Central Park. It's not moving, the first team sent in to check on it notices its still breathing, one of the soldiers standing near the Greyshot bridge ruins whispers into his com "It's still alive..."

Fast forward, they've managed to keep it unconscious (having failed or been told not to kill it in its sleep) and believe its contained as they try and study it... but since its a baby a) its still growing and their containment has to keep being rebuilt.. (alowing for escape) or b) Mommy finally finds where Jr. is..


I wonder what a containment facility would look like? What would it be made of? It would have to be damn big and strong.


Well, Shea Stadium isn't that far away... It's not like the Mets need it.


Ha! Good point, but isn't a big slice of the stadium missing? Also, does it have a roof?

Edit: By "missing" I meant that there isn't really a wall, just scoreboards and a view of the parking lot. Still though, a stadium might be the answer.

Also, it does seem accurate that the gov. would use a civilian structure like a stadium.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 2:54 pm
Last edited by jamman1 on Sun Jan 27, 2008 4:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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konamouse
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 		Good point about the pets. I remember commenting to konashark that we didn't see the usual "no animals were harmed in the making of this film" disclaimer.
You didn't see kids either.

Guess on their budget it was easier to avoid the animals & the children (and it's easier to NOT work with them). Wink

jamman1 - typically we recommend "editing" your previous post to avoid double/triple posting (and you can edit your quotes to avoid overnesting which can cause people to skip your point of view at the very bottom).
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:32 pm
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jlocke23
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 		I think ground troops would definitely be there first. Air strikes are fine except there are millions of civilians that would be in harms way. The strikes they did have were very limited until the end.

What shocked me was the lack of cops. The closest military bases are Ft Hamilton in Brooklyn and Ft Dix in Jersey and would take about an hour to get there (the marines are even further out). The NYPD swat and counter-terrorism units are outfitted much like the military and would be the first on the scene, yet the only cop I remember seeing was the one directing people on the bridge.

The NYPD would be considered the 8th largest military force and yet, there was 1 cop in all of Manhattan?

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 12:32 am
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OliMango
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jlocke23 wrote:
I think ground troops would definitely be there first. Air strikes are fine except there are millions of civilians that would be in harms way. The strikes they did have were very limited until the end.

What shocked me was the lack of cops. The closest military bases are Ft Hamilton in Brooklyn and Ft Dix in Jersey and would take about an hour to get there (the marines are even further out). The NYPD swat and counter-terrorism units are outfitted much like the military and would be the first on the scene, yet the only cop I remember seeing was the one directing people on the bridge.

The NYPD would be considered the 8th largest military force and yet, there was 1 cop in all of Manhattan?


They all died because they had no armor.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 12:37 am
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Zaggs
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OliMango wrote:
jlocke23 wrote:
I think ground troops would definitely be there first. Air strikes are fine except there are millions of civilians that would be in harms way. The strikes they did have were very limited until the end.

What shocked me was the lack of cops. The closest military bases are Ft Hamilton in Brooklyn and Ft Dix in Jersey and would take about an hour to get there (the marines are even further out). The NYPD swat and counter-terrorism units are outfitted much like the military and would be the first on the scene, yet the only cop I remember seeing was the one directing people on the bridge.

The NYPD would be considered the 8th largest military force and yet, there was 1 cop in all of Manhattan?


They all died because they had no armor.


Naw they lived. They just went all New Orleans PD when MGP took out the donut shop.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:18 am
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The Professor
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 		What I wonder is what role the navy played, once they actually got pictures of this thing they probably sent every ship from Brunswick to Hampton Roads to intercept. But really, I'm not sure how many ships arrived there before operation Hammerdown, the closest naval station would be Earle Naval Weapons Station and that's only 47 miles south of New York City so it's they probably had some ships there. The closest air force base is McGuire AFB in Jersey, but it would make sense that they probably commandeered JFK for a while. The closest army facilities would be Fort Drum and Westpoint, although it's just an academy so I'm not sure how useful that would be. However, Fort Dix is adjacent to McGuire so I'm certain that they would be arriving in JFK as well.

Considering the fact that they very well could have been ships in the river at the time, that could have very well contributed to the evacuation and streamlined how quickly they got out of there. That would also mean that operation Hammerdown consisted of naval bombardment as well as air strikes.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 8:13 pm
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The Stray
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 		Two Cents
Air Force
Well. As always, I try to take into account the fact that this is a movie, also what I would do as writer and also that it's fun to question things anyway...

I can say that we would never (ever) "let go" of an entire American city 7-8 hours into an attack (Not no monster attack anyway... and this is America not Japan. Somehow with Godzilla it always seemed to come to that didn't it?) I agree that the idea of nuclear action on American soil is ridiculous.

I thought it was strange that there were so few airstrikes. You would think under the circumstances that there would be attack choppers, jets, bombers, gunships (think molten rounds from transformers). Call of Duty 4, remember the gunship mission? (which was pretty accurate according to actual pilots) Where were THOSE. I can't say to much in the way of other military means but I know we can be anywhere in a very, very short amount of time, like, within an hour, in total force.

I'm only basing this on the fact that the only planes I could make out were the single stealth bomber which, at that point there should have been more, and those jets. In the case of attack helicopters, maybe you could make a case for them being slower than jets or gunships and more of a risk. I don't know much about those as I think they fall under another branch...

Of course, none of these would have actually stopped ATT, but it would have been awesome to watch.

Actually, we were talking about that after the movie and I noted a lack of "military heroes." Not in the general sense but, when the main characters expressed that they intended to go deeper into the city to rescue someone who was trapped nobody offered to go with them. Understandably there were bigger issues at hand, but usually there's that ONE military guy. I thought it was going to be the guy who said "I shouldn't be doing this," and I remember thinking well at least now they have that... oh... oh wait, he's leaving...

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:03 pm
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The Professor
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 		Re: Two Cents
Air Force
The Stray wrote:

I thought it was strange that there were so few airstrikes. You would think under the circumstances that there would be attack choppers, jets, bombers, gunships (think molten rounds from transformers). Call of Duty 4, remember the gunship mission? (which was pretty accurate according to actual pilots) Where were THOSE. I can't say to much in the way of other military means but I know we can be anywhere in a very, very short amount of time, like, within an hour, in total force.

I'm only basing this on the fact that the only planes I could make out were the single stealth bomber which, at that point there should have been more, and those jets. In the case of attack helicopters, maybe you could make a case for them being slower than jets or gunships and more of a risk. I don't know much about those as I think they fall under another branch...



Well we don't really know how much they threw at the MGP, Rob and company were in the tunnels for quite a while. By what we were able to hear in the subway, they were throwing a lot at him. For all we know, they did use a SPECTRE gunship it. The reason we didn't see it could be attributed to its guns running dry or the MGP threw something at it.

As for the the attack helis, I can say that we did see one, albeit a flaming hull of one. When Rob's helicopter was ascending you see a a hulk of twisted, burning metal. Some have construed it as Lily's helicopter or a hummer. But if you look carefully you can see its slender frame and its tail, as well as the rocket pods on either side. Seeing as Lily was evacuated in an unarmed UH-60 and that was clearly an AH-Apache.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 11:22 pm
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HerOdyssey
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Quote:
Was the military portrayed accurately?


When *is* the military portrayed accurately? I'm mean really.

PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:24 am
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starshiptrooper
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 		I just watched Resident Evil Extiction tonight and realized something....

It's just a movie!

Just like Cloverfield. So here's something for all those who say in the same breath "It's just a movie." AND "No way would we EVER nuke an American city, NO MATTER WHAT."

RE 2: Apocalypse was just a movie... a movie where they nuked an American city.

Return of the Living Dead was just a movie... in which they nuked an american city.

Jericho is a TV series about the nuking of many American cities

So, tell me one more time how:

"Cloverfield is only a movie"

AND

"No way would they nuke an American city."
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:32 pm
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guerra001
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starshiptrooper wrote:
I just watched Resident Evil Extiction tonight and realized something....

It's just a movie!

Just like Cloverfield. So here's something for all those who say in the same breath "It's just a movie." AND "No way would we EVER nuke an American city, NO MATTER WHAT."

RE 2: Apocalypse was just a movie... a movie where they nuked an American city.

Return of the Living Dead was just a movie... in which they nuked an american city.

Jericho is a TV series about the nuking of many American cities

So, tell me one more time how:

"Cloverfield is only a movie"

AND

"No way would they nuke an American city."


I agree with you completely starship, its only a movie....although I do have to point out that RE:2 nuked Racoon City...a city that by my counts, doesnt exsist...but other than that your correct...

Hell they nuke american citys in lots of movies and on tv all the time...its like a major plot development point...They even fire bomb London in 28 weeks later
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:35 pm
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