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ladron121
Kilroy
Joined: 23 Jul 2008 Posts: 1
io9.com ARG Article http://io9.com/5028054/the-argument-against-args
This is one of the most uninformed articles about ARGs I've read. They did zero research, and claim the only ARGs out there are movie tie-ins. Sad really
Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:25 pm
krystyn
I Never Tire of My Own Voice
Joined: 26 Sep 2002 Posts: 3651 Location: Is not Chicago
Zero? I'd be more generous than that.
(fwiw, LCP was for Activision's game, Gun)
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:26 pm
Jas0n
Decorated
Joined: 19 Aug 2006 Posts: 244
I don't believe the article is horrible, but the main point of the article is that the games don't stand alone from their advertised product.
I'd have to contend that the majority of games I have witnessed which were used for advertising did have their own story to them. Especially when you start looking at Dave's games. I personally played Monster Hunter Club which was used to promote the korean film "The Host." The game had little to nothing to do with anything in the movie other than the fact there were monsters. Dave told a great story through his game that completely stood out from the product he was helping to promote. (Thanks Dave - Dee - Michelle - et al)
I love bees existed in the Halo universe, but did not focus on the stories from the games themselves.
Lost experience expands upon the story which is Lost - as did the Batman Dark Knight game - but if the author of the article was basing their opinion on these more popular games (even cloverfield) and not looking into the games which have been played recently but without the feverish pitch of the mass marketed games - they made a forgiveable mistake of looking at the wrong stuff. I'm sure many of us can point them to great games that tell a great story within their own rights.
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:54 pm
enaxor
I Have No Life
Joined: 25 Feb 2003 Posts: 2395
Quote:
But so far, ARGs have few of the benefits of a fandom, such as a friendly community of like-minded people;
I take exception to that comment. We're friendly, aren't we?
The first two games I ever played, weren't tied to any product, movie, or video game. They were Search4e and Chasing The Wish. But even the viral campaigns are fun.
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:53 pm
Jas0n
Decorated
Joined: 19 Aug 2006 Posts: 244
Enaxor - That comment totally confuses me. I had read it once as though we are not friendly and then I reread it and it seemed almost like an attempt to point out that we were friendly...
I have no idea what the actual intention of the statement is, but my guess is that the author intended to say we were friendly - I dunno
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:53 pm
SpaceBass
The BADministrator
Joined: 20 Sep 2002 Posts: 2701 Location: pellucidar
Counterpoint at Orbit Books , which may or may not be an excuse for them to promote a novel called This is Not a Game by Walter Jon Williams , who lists himself as co-writer for Last Call Poker .
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:14 pm
Nighthawk
I Have 100 Cats and Smell of Wee
Joined: 14 Jul 2007 Posts: 4751 Location: Miami, Florida, USA, Earth
Well that's an original title ...
This is a fiction novel... He's writing about US!
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:25 pm
konamouse
Official uF Dietitian
Joined: 02 Dec 2002 Posts: 8010 Location: My own alternate reality
Nighthawk wrote:
This is a fiction novel... He's writing about US!
OMG! I think I want to read this! Sounds intriguing.
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 9:59 pm
krystyn
I Never Tire of My Own Voice
Joined: 26 Sep 2002 Posts: 3651 Location: Is not Chicago
I know , right?
(not that the article mirrored there at Cloudmakers makes any point for this post, it was only used to demonstrate what was stated in the first sentence of it, which is that the phrase originates with The Beast, and is often interpreted in really bizarre and fascinating and curious ways by players and developers in the years since. )
(and by bizarre and fascinating and curious, that can be good, bad, or both!)
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Posted: Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:54 pm
thebruce
Dances With Wikis
Joined: 16 Aug 2004 Posts: 6899 Location: Kitchener, Ontario
Holy crap
This person needs a punchintheface and a kickinthenuts!
IO9, part 2: "The Little ARG That Failed "
dishing it out on args because their 'experiment' failed... at comic con...
snip... (emphasis mine)
Quote:
...ARGs are not grassroots. They are not about community, or word-of-mouth. They really are about saturating the market with brands in order to generate interest in something, just the way old-fashioned advertising is. I don't mean to disparage the cleverness of ARGs — a lot of them are terrifically fun. But the ARGs that get noticed at a media event like Comic-Con are always going to be the ones with lots of resources behind them. To create a "grassroots feeling," you need to have a top-down corporation with wads of cash. So when you play an ARG associated with a commercial property, you are in some sense being deceived. You're being made to feel as if you've discovered something, as if you're part of a community spontaneously coming together to play at something, when in fact you've been targeted by an extremely well-funded marketing campaign...
I think personally the only way their results might be accurate is if they were looking specifically for the same exposure as those massive marketing campaign args, launching at marketing heavy events like Comic Con. That has nothing to do with grassroots. Their launch location, style, and timing was just out of its element, and of course it would be swamped and overwhelmed with massive money-backed campaigns. Their model for the test was flawed and destined for failure...
hey, that happens in the arg genre. If they really wanted to launch and arg, they'd find appropriate and effective ways to launch it. Money really wouldn't be a factor if it's thought out well enough. Whether or not the ARG in question is marketing or just art/grassroots. *sigh*
...deep breath...
io9 really don't like ARGs do they?
Ok, well it's the same author as the 'argument against args' - annalee newitz
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:20 pm
krystyn
I Never Tire of My Own Voice
Joined: 26 Sep 2002 Posts: 3651 Location: Is not Chicago
FWIW, there have been other bloggers in the Gawker Media stable who do seem to play and enjoy ARGs. I've seen other posts from other authors who seem to dig and grok the whole concept, and who take the time to immerse themselves and become part of a community or at least share with their friends.
Ms. Newitz is definitely on a tear!
Rar! Smash ARG! Grr!
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:52 pm
konamouse
Official uF Dietitian
Joined: 02 Dec 2002 Posts: 8010 Location: My own alternate reality
Here is my comment, hope it gets approved for posting.
Quote:
You are mistaken to think that all ARGs are about marketing. Grassroot ARGs don't always need lots of money. May I recommend you do a little read on "Metacortex" http://forums.unfiction.com/forums/index.php?f=202 and "Sammeeeees" http://forums.unfiction.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=17130 before you start generalizations.
And next time you decide to start an ARG, please think about your rabbithole a little more in terms of your characters. If they want help taking down an evil corporation, passing out postcards at Comic Con is not going to reach your target audience.
Hugs! - kona
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:38 pm
Fishjp
Entrenched
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 Posts: 875 Location: Beneath a sky of Blue and a sea of Green.
CRAP! So much for the pitch I was working on for my publisher. I will have to wait till this comes out to make sure the stories are different enough. I really hate when people steal stuff I was going to write...
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 4:38 pm
redct
Entrenched
Joined: 20 Jun 2007 Posts: 1233
Quote:
IO9, part 2: "The Little ARG That Failed"
Quote:
ARGs are not grassroots. They are not about community, or word-of-mouth. They really are about saturating the market with brands in order to generate interest in something, just the way old-fashioned advertising is.
Eww.
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 9:11 pm
pancito
I Have No Life
Joined: 24 Feb 2008 Posts: 2095 Location: In my happy place.
Well, we all agree that these posts are pretty much klooless. For me the irony here is that you probably could launch a grassroots at ComicCon. Certainly not the ideal audience, but doable. You could even do it outside the doors and be effective. But I think an event of some sort, a piece of performance art or whatnot would work a lot better than 1000 postcards. It would get you into the story right away, would attract attention, etc. Heck, I probably wouldn't follow up on their postcard.
I loved this:
Quote:
But so far, ARGs have few of the benefits of a fandom, such as a friendly community of like-minded people; and they have all of the bad parts of fannish behavior like pointless obsessiveness and fetishization of dumb swag.
Yes, it says we aren't friendly, which is wrong, but it did get the swag fetish part right. Mmmmm swag. And I suppose all obsession seems pointless from the outside, whether it be ARG, baseball, or ranting about stuff you don't understand. (Three of my personal favorites).
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Posted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 11:37 pm
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