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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: General » ARG: Super 8
[UPDATE] Braegen14
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maximus4444
Greenhorn


Joined: 14 Apr 2008
Posts: 7
Location: Milwaukee, WI

Senjut wrote:
The response said:

Sorry, kids. Captain Coop Cooper responds to verified Poppeteers only!

Become a Rocket Poppeteer and join the race to outer space!

http://forums.unfiction.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=711238#711238

This is from the RocketPoppeteers thread, but I'm thinking that if you register as a Rocket Poppeteer, via the maze card mail-in, you will be able to send an email to Coop and receive an update to help with the audio file... just a thought

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 10:32 am
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Mr.Frost
Boot

Joined: 14 May 2010
Posts: 34

SeekerX wrote:
Let my try to explain this.
Gefenm11, from what I understand you inverted the phase of one channel and then combined/mixed it with the other channel. What is left then is the difference in sound between the two channels.

I attached a pic from Wikipedia to make it a little clearer. The left one shows two waves (the lower ones) that add to each other to result in the upper wave. The right shows 2 waves that "extinct" each other because they are of inversed nature.

In our case the original noise is exactly the same on both channels. If you invert one and add it to the other, the sound "extincts" itself and only what is different comes out as the result. In our case some portion of the notes are different in the quality of their frequencies over time. That does not mean they would be really different in pitch or speed.

Overall, cool idea. I'm just not sure what to think about that aspect of the noise being the same on both.




Well, theres our little oscilloscope that pops up on the trailer.


And from now on, no one is allowed to make discoveries while I'm sleeping.

Frost

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 11:17 am
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FilmEdge
Unfettered


Joined: 21 May 2010
Posts: 645
Location: Burbank, CA

Now that you mention it, Frost... I suddenly wondered if the oscilloscope image (recently added) was a cue of some sort? As in play the sound file when the wave image appears as if to sync the tones with the trailer.

Rather like starting "Dark Side of the Moon" on the third roar of the MGM Lion (it's a lion!!) when screening THE WIZARD OF OZ.

Trouble is the wave pattern lasts quite a long time for a precise cue, almost a second. That would leave a bit of variance in start times and throw off synchronization — almost a second could be nearly 24 frames difference in film terms. Just a thought.

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:18 pm
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Tracker_56
Veteran


Joined: 20 May 2010
Posts: 83
Location: Illinois

SeekerX wrote:
Let my try to explain this.
Gefenm11, from what I understand you inverted the phase of one channel and then combined/mixed it with the other channel. What is left then is the difference in sound between the two channels.

I attached a pic from Wikipedia to make it a little clearer. The left one shows two waves (the lower ones) that add to each other to result in the upper wave. The right shows 2 waves that "extinct" each other because they are of inversed nature.

In our case the original noise is exactly the same on both channels. If you invert one and add it to the other, the sound "extincts" itself and only what is different comes out as the result. In our case some portion of the notes are different in the quality of their frequencies over time. That does not mean they would be really different in pitch or speed.

Overall, cool idea. I'm just not sure what to think about that aspect of the noise being the same on both.



Tracker_56 wrote:
I post this only that it may get someone else thinking in a different direction, because my experiment didn't yield anything interesting.

Just for the sake of it, I split the left and right channels of the sound. There is slight variation between the two so once split, I laid them side by side and matched them so that they lined up. I then inverted one of the two tracks thinking that they would mostly cancel each other out and possibly reveal something. The combination was just faint and more garbled, but as I said before, I post this only in hopes that it gets someone else's brain working on something.


I know and understand what he did (though I apparently wasn't exact enough in my methods because I didn't get quite the same results) , I was just a little confused when he said the noise was the same but the notes are different. After some sleep and a re-read, I'm assuming Gefenm11 means the final noise before the cutoff is the same in both channels.


What might this imply to us? Well, it very well could rule out the assumption that this was recorded all at once. If someone was recording the tones that corresponded with a keypad as has been previously suggested, everyting should sound the same in both left and right channels. Seeing as this is not the case, and we have two channels that are slightly different, this file may have been created digitally and the noise at the end could be something else entirely. Perhaps a bit of data corruption? Just some of my thoughts after reading the above posts. Anyone else get what I'm saying?

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:32 pm
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Euchre
uF Game Warden


Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 3342

I really think we can safely say the waveform display is just a buffering indicator, as it doesn't happen at all to many people, and happens at random intervals and durations to those that do see it.

The inversion of one channel of the audio and layering it into the other is a common noise cancellation method, as you commonly see in dual microphone Bluetooth earpieces. It's the simplest and most effective way to cancel background noise when you treat audio as a stereo source. If this were true RF noise, it'd basically be mono. The fact there's a difference in stereo channels is a bit telling - this would have to have been recorded as real audio and not generated from a mono waveform. You don't commonly see stereo audio broadcasts for anything but music. If such a radio broadcast were of alien origin, chances are there would be an intentional embedding of more information in the signal ala Contact.

The fact that our audio here is stereo and that the noise is common between channels suggests that either it's meant to reveal more data, or it's an accidental result of the completely synthetic generation of the audio for this project. Basically if they created the track without consideration of the stereo nature it has, they may have 'doped in' the static as you see here, identical in each channel. This seems likely to me. If there is anything meant to be encoded (whether in an IG, 'aliens did it' sense or 'PMs did it' sense), it's probably purely in the differentiated info of the stereo tracks only - the tones.

I did another version of this noise cancellation in Audacity, which tends to mute the audio just a bit. I followed the cancellation with normalization and a volume boost to make it about as loud (if not a touch louder) than the original.
expcnv-noise-cancelled.mp3
Description 
mp3

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Filename  expcnv-noise-cancelled.mp3 
Filesize  147.38KB 
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 12:44 pm
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Mr.Frost
Boot

Joined: 14 May 2010
Posts: 34

Euchre wrote:
I really think we can safely say the waveform display is just a buffering indicator, as it doesn't happen at all to many people, and happens at random intervals and durations to those that do see it.



I'm gonna agree with this as it pops up at different times if I refresh the page and sometimes not at all.

The swoosh or w/e you wanna call it at the end of the audio file sounds to me like someone blowing into a mic or closing their hand around it.

On another note,(see what I did there? note...notes..???I made a funny....... Nothing? Tap..tap...Is this mic on?)

Anyways, I'm trying to contact Kodak to see when exactly those red "Processing" markings/stamps were used.

There is also a Canadian company that still processes old Kodak film, so I might ask them if Kodak doesn't reply.

Frost

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 1:51 pm
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vapor
Entrenched


Joined: 03 Jun 2008
Posts: 1188
Location: Dallas, TX ya'll

Re: Verify something

Oshovah wrote:
Senjut wrote:
Am I right in believing that the 8 tones hit right at the second marks? First tone at 0, 2nd at 1 second, 3rd at 2 seconds, etc?

Just want to confirm that's not an artifact of the way I'm playing it by hearing that other people get the same thing.


Yeah, you're right. I imported the audio into a digital audio workstation and found that if each note is considered a beat, then the "song" plays at 60 BPM (beats per minute). So, since there are sixty seconds in a minute, that would mean that there is a one-second interval between the start of each note.

I also tried matching up notes I created with an oscillator to the notes in the audio, and I came up with something a bit different than what some of you guys have posted. The notes seem to be...

C# F# C# G# C D# D# A#

Though the pitch of the last note seems to wobble a bit, so it could possibly be an A instead of an A#. If this was translated into numerical digits using C as 0, C# as 1, et cetera, it would become...

1 6 1 8 0 3 3 9

But again, the last note is wonky, so it could also translate to an 8.

I still can't figure out what to do with these notes and numbers, though. Using them as IP addresses or website URL's haven't yielded any results for me so far. Hopefully we get some more hints soon!


For completeness sake, I ran expcnv.mp3 through a Melodic Range Spectrogram using Sonic Visualizer and then plotted the warmest part of the audio (the bright yellow area in the attached file). I can confirm that the notes are C# F# C# G# C D# D# A# based on the frequencies of those points.
Melodic Range expcnv.png
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Melodic Range expcnv.png


PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 2:32 pm
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thebruce
Dances With Wikis


Joined: 16 Aug 2004
Posts: 6899
Location: Kitchener, Ontario

Posting the spectrogram waveform analysis again that I did a while back



Yes, we are already pretty confident that the waveform represents the golden ratio. I'm not sold on the significance of musical notation, I believe this is more about the pattern than specific frequencies and values. I also don't believe we have a use for this yet, insomuch as a way to keep people occupied for a while =P
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 2:56 pm
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matty2431
Boot

Joined: 15 May 2010
Posts: 18

Re: Verify something

vapor wrote:
Oshovah wrote:
Senjut wrote:
Am I right in believing that the 8 tones hit right at the second marks? First tone at 0, 2nd at 1 second, 3rd at 2 seconds, etc?

Just want to confirm that's not an artifact of the way I'm playing it by hearing that other people get the same thing.


Yeah, you're right. I imported the audio into a digital audio workstation and found that if each note is considered a beat, then the "song" plays at 60 BPM (beats per minute). So, since there are sixty seconds in a minute, that would mean that there is a one-second interval between the start of each note.

I also tried matching up notes I created with an oscillator to the notes in the audio, and I came up with something a bit different than what some of you guys have posted. The notes seem to be...

C# F# C# G# C D# D# A#

Though the pitch of the last note seems to wobble a bit, so it could possibly be an A instead of an A#. If this was translated into numerical digits using C as 0, C# as 1, et cetera, it would become...

1 6 1 8 0 3 3 9

But again, the last note is wonky, so it could also translate to an 8.

I still can't figure out what to do with these notes and numbers, though. Using them as IP addresses or website URL's haven't yielded any results for me so far. Hopefully we get some more hints soon!


For completeness sake, I ran expcnv.mp3 through a Melodic Range Spectrogram using Sonic Visualizer and then plotted the warmest part of the audio (the bright yellow area in the attached file). I can confirm that the notes are C# F# C# G# C D# D# A# based on the frequencies of those points.


Could we clean this image up even more? To me, now, these tones seem to be forming 8's, as shown by the first tone in this photograph.

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 3:26 pm
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PhobiaFilms
Guest


 

I am a new member Smile But I have an epiphany, what if you used the path of the maze as some kind of clue??

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 3:34 pm
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asda
Guest


8ights
8ights

Thats creepy...But I do see that too...Theres more than one thing to this spectogram...I think we need to go back to the paper to find a link...Im going to look at the paper again...Or the trailer

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 3:42 pm
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B
Guest


Morris, D
RT-11

On wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT-11 , Morris, D is credited along side RT-11 v3 under release history. The release date of RT-11 v3 is Feburary 1977... RT-11 is a real time operating system associated with the PDP-11

Food for thought...

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 3:50 pm
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B
Guest


Sorry

Really sorry for the multiple posts.

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 3:56 pm
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vapor
Entrenched


Joined: 03 Jun 2008
Posts: 1188
Location: Dallas, TX ya'll

thebruce wrote:
Posting the spectrogram waveform analysis again that I did a while back



Yes, we are already pretty confident that the waveform represents the golden ratio. I'm not sold on the significance of musical notation, I believe this is more about the pattern than specific frequencies and values. I also don't believe we have a use for this yet, insomuch as a way to keep people occupied for a while =P


Yeah, not trying to trout or anything. I just wanted more concrete evidence of the actual notes in case they are important and I was able to do so with the melodic spectrogram. It was just a litte hard to tell with the waveform spectrogram (ie the 50Hz fluctuation)

I agree with your points, though. The pattern is probably more important and the notes won't play any part and in the end, this is just a mystery that cannot be solved yet.

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 4:00 pm
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B
Guest


Re: Morris, D
RT-11

B wrote:
On wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RT-11 , Morris, D is credited along side RT-11 v3 under release history. The release date of RT-11 v3 is Feburary 1977... RT-11 is a real time operating system associated with the PDP-11

Food for thought...




The article has been tweaked to add morris d...... sorry really bad information...

PostPosted: Tue Jun 08, 2010 4:06 pm
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