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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!) » The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!): General/Updates
[SPEC] Melissa trying to kill the Assassin.. Why? Thoughts?
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Gram
Boot


Joined: 28 Jul 2004
Posts: 35
Location: Cold, with a 86% chance of Rain

 		[SPEC] Melissa trying to kill the Assassin.. Why? Thoughts?
Since we all know Assassin is Dana and she's the one who accidentally tried to delete Melissa I can see an obvious want to eliminate her.

But what's with the hunting and stalking of Dana? I mean she left the country and stopped all forms of aggressiveness towards.. well anything. For a super smart AI from the future that doesn't add up. Why eliminate something that's not really a threat? Is it just the crazy vengeance thing Melissa's got going on? Or is it because some sort of future threat thing ala Terminator?

What if not Dana, but her future descendants became candidates for a brain flash for AI creating? Could she be the great billion grandma to the candidate for the SP? Or some other AI or threat? Like maybe Durga, although the evidence points more to a Melissa-Durga connection, still for now the possibility exists. After all both the Flee and SP want to transmit these confidential conversations to her.

If Melissa kills Dana what will happen in the future? What if she doesn't?
Is time one set path or can you really change the future? Why do I keep answering questions with more questions?!

I guess only time will tell. Or will it?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 1:31 am
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Starblade
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 		Way to go, you got me started.

One theory on how the universe can be layed out is like a tree. Every 1/1000000 (let's stop the zeroes here, k?) of a moment, and every possible thing that could happen becomes a branch.

Let's say the universe as we know it is one one branch, and another one, similar to but not exactly like ours is on another. Let's say I make a time machine to go back 100 years. I activate it, and here I go. But I don't go back in OUR universe. The time machine 'jumps' me to another branch, 100 years in the past, and with everything but me being there the same.

I do what I wanted to do, and leave. Here's where it gets more confusing.
Three possible things could happen:
1. I go back to the branch I started from, with nothing different, and the branches of the 'past' branch branching even more because of my interference.
2. I go to another branch, exactly like our universe, except with the change I made in the past being shown.
3. I just f'd up our branch. This one is very bad, because since I went back to do what I wanted, I never needed to go back. So I don't, but because I didn't, the thing I needed to do is still needed to be done, so I go back. Then I don't need to, then I do, etc., etc., etc. Way to go me, I just turned our branch into a loop. And, either the whole branch follows me, I somehow manage to break out of the loop, or some of the branch repeats with me, and the rest does not. Guess why this option is bad.

Confused? Good.

So, if Melissa was trying to kill the descendants of the SP, it would be hard. Because the future could or could not be changed on the 'HALO' branches. It's even harder because they're part of the same AI.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:57 am
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Nightmare Tony
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Joined: 07 Jun 2004
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 		or remember Durga with her obsession with Kamal..... "he just seems....interesting"
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:40 am
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Prominence
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Joined: 28 Aug 2004
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 		I'm not suprised Melissa is so aggresive. Shockingly excesive force is the best deterent, remember?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 11:26 am
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FIRST MATE BEAN
Boot

Joined: 03 Oct 2004
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 		Okay but what should we do? I have a personal call from Melissa scheduled for October 5th at 14:21PDT. Melissa has stated that this week she wants her crew to get her the location of the killer. DO WE DO THIS? I don't want to urinate people off like weephun did, nor do I want to miss my opportunity.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:02 pm
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drizjr
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Joined: 28 Nov 2003
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 		I've been off-line for a few weeks, so this thought has high trout potential, but has anyone actually asked Melissa why she calls Dana a killer? That might clearify the situation. We assumed it was because of Dana's attempts to fix ilovebees, but we could be wrong. Wouldn't it be better to hear it straight from Melissa?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:17 pm
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Karmic
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drizjr wrote:
I've been off-line for a few weeks, so this thought has high trout potential, but has anyone actually asked Melissa why she calls Dana a killer? That might clearify the situation. We assumed it was because of Dana's attempts to fix ilovebees, but we could be wrong. Wouldn't it be better to hear it straight from Melissa?

Pulled from thebruces's transcripts...
Operator Monologues wrote:
Whoa. Not CP ancestor packets. This is something different. Quick quick quick quick - parse this protocol and find some kind of eyeball out. Sister you just made a mistake because this is my *meat* this is what I do and you are - GOT IT. I'm not asleep this time, sweetheart. Holding the eyeball gently but firmly in your right hand, say the magic words and:

[[Killer.jpg created]]


SURPRISE! Look up and smile, honey. Bang! Bang! Bang!

Got the drop on you that time, sweetheart.

Opening shot of my search and destroy. I'm going to know everything about you. Where you live and what you buy, how you think and who you love. Know the enemy.

Young and out of uniform, but one of us. Hacker? Traitor? Fifth columnist (no that's ridiculous).

Just in over her head? No. The Spider warning's been deployed. She had every warning that a classified medium was under repair. She just kept purging. Too bad for her. Checking the wiring. There's a lot of ways to skin a - - can't even get to her stupid HOUSE through the stupid BOX: no central thermo controls, no slaved AI, nothing. Christ! No access to wiring. No access to vehicle controls. No access to medbots or pharm regimes. Damn it. Okay. Fine. Matter of time. I don't give up.

This is the passage where Melissa decides that Dana is an enemy. So, in a way, she's already told us herself.

Of course, asking her about it might still be useful.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 1:39 pm
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Crisko
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Joined: 26 Aug 2004
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 		I've brought this up before but I feel like I should bring it up again. Isn't it kind of odd that a smart AI would have such a horrible human-trait? I just don't see Melissa's creator programming vengence into her subroutines.

I'm assuming this is either from the damage she incurred from crashing or this could possibly be the flea's doing. I'm really not sure what to think of it other than I don't like the idea of Dana dying. She's a human, Melissa isn't.

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 2:48 pm
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Evdex
Kilroy

Joined: 23 Sep 2004
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 		Hmm
Idea:
So Melissa, in her home time, is just a bit wonky, as some people have suggested. Her enemies (creators?), knowing that she'll flip out if they try to terminate her, get her sent back to now, knowing about Dana etc.. Her ultimate goal is to get rid of Dana. Considering perhaps that one of Dana's offspring will be the brain donor for Melissa's AI, if Melissa kills Dana, then Melissa will simply cease to exist.

Do-able?

This next part is just me having a little geek field day so skip it if you want, it's a pretty random idea and un-thought-through.

So right. What if all this mucking about that Dana's doing actually LEADS TO her being picked up by some agency in our time who would want to use her brain or the brain of one of her great grandkids? Like a timeloop. Just disregard, I'm rambling.

-a

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 3:24 pm
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Starblade
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 		Referring to the first half of your post, no. It isn't do-able. Not if one of Dana's descendants really is a brain donor for Melissa.

If Melissa kills Dana, her descendants cease to exist. Since they never existed, Melissa was never made. Since Melissa was never made, no one needed to send her back in time. Since she didn't go back in time, Melissa never attempted to kill Dana, so Dana's descendants still live. Since her descendants still live, Melissa is still made. So, Melissa is sent back in time to try and kill Dana. Wash, rinse, and repeat infinitely, or one of the three things happen like I posted earlier.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 4:04 pm
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ABoxInABox
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Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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Starblade wrote:
If Melissa kills Dana, her descendants cease to exist. Since they never existed, Melissa was never made. Since Melissa was never made, no one needed to send her back in time. Since she didn't go back in time, Melissa never attempted to kill Dana, so Dana's descendants still live. Since her descendants still live, Melissa is still made. So, Melissa is sent back in time to try and kill Dana. Wash, rinse, and repeat infinitely, or one of the three things happen like I posted earlier.

Oh how I love time paradoxes.

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 4:07 pm
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Platonix
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Crisko wrote:
I've brought this up before but I feel like I should bring it up again. Isn't it kind of odd that a smart AI would have such a horrible human-trait? I just don't see Melissa's creator programming vengence into her subroutines.

I'm assuming this is either from the damage she incurred from crashing or this could possibly be the flea's doing. I'm really not sure what to think of it other than I don't like the idea of Dana dying. She's a human, Melissa isn't.
Sad fact is, Smart AIs are created from human brains, so they can and should be expected to have human traits. Try programming an artificial intelligence that can react to new information, draw conclusions and follow up on them as proficiently as a human can, and then tell me why we shouldn't just go with photocopying human brains. So much easier.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 4:22 pm
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ABoxInABox
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Joined: 10 Aug 2004
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Platonix wrote:
Sad fact is, Smart AIs are created from human brains, so they can and should be expected to have human traits. Try programming an artificial intelligence that can react to new information, draw conclusions and follow up on them as proficiently as a human can, and then tell me why we shouldn't just go with photocopying human brains. So much easier.

For a start, no one learns anything about intelligence, or how it works. We'd just be copying a human onto a machine.

Now we're wandering off into AI ethics...

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 4:27 pm
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Prominence
Boot


Joined: 28 Aug 2004
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 		Since This is not real, and giving away Dana wont actualy get someone in real life killed, I say we should go for it. It will progress the storyline and get Melissa to trust us more. Besides,ig Whos behind this (Bungie) Didnt want it to happen, they wouldnt have Melissa after her

PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 5:42 pm
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FreemanCorporeal
Boot

Joined: 30 Sep 2004
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Location: i live in beer.

 		How is it that we have determined that Melissa is a "Smart AI" and not a "Dumb AI"?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2004 6:06 pm
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