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 Forum index » Diversions » The Master Theorem
Geocaching
Moderators: Cougar Draven
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Guest
Guest
thomfabian wrote:
B isn't wrong but...

Spoiler (Rollover to View):

It is a weird way to ask for the number. It reads at first that the question is how many columns are on the perimeter, but thats not what its asking for. Just follow the formula it lists (2*Columns on the side + 2*Columns on end). It does mean you are double counting 2 of the columns. But that makes the rest of the numbers come out correctly.


I strongly believe you're wrong:

Spoiler (Rollover to View):

Can we first agree that the number of columns on the long side is 17 and the number on the short side is 8? I agree that these values imply 46 outer columns total (see Wikipedia page). When we double-count the corners, that makes 50, not 52; alternatively, 2 x ( 17 + 8 ) = 50.


Does anyone please have another way?

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:26 am
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Cbot
Guest


 		Re: Perimeter Counting
Anonymous wrote:
B is definitely wrong; it's off by two.


This is true, the number in Google Earth (which M seems to be going off of) is different than the actual number (which is what's listed in Wikipedia etc.) It's off by 2. This made for some very frustrating puzzling.

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:27 am
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SoItBegins
Veteran

Joined: 16 May 2011
Posts: 83

 		Re: Perimeter Counting
Cbot wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
B is definitely wrong; it's off by two.


This is true, the number in Google Earth (which M seems to be going off of) is different than the actual number (which is what's listed in Wikipedia etc.) It's off by 2. This made for some very frustrating puzzling.


True dat. I was using Wikipedia, which has a floor plan...

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:29 am
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Rogi Ocnorb
I Have 100 Cats and Smell of Wee


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 4266
Location: Where the cheese is free.

 		Not sure I'll keep at it for another week. That was pretty bad.
_________________
I'm telling you now, so you can't say, "Oh, I didn't know...Nobody told me!"


PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:41 am
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hsifyppah
Kilroy

Joined: 08 Sep 2011
Posts: 1

 		 
I solved it, by guessing various values for B that I feel are wrong. Very Happy

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
The solution lists 52 as the perimeter. I have NO IDEA how he came up with that. It's not the number of columns (46) or 2L+2H (4Cool


PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:42 am
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SoItBegins
Veteran

Joined: 16 May 2011
Posts: 83
hsifyppah wrote:
I solved it, by guessing various values for B that I feel are wrong. Very Happy

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
The solution lists 52 as the perimeter. I have NO IDEA how he came up with that. It's not the number of columns (46) or 2L+2H (4Cool


Apparently, Google Earth lists an incorrect value somewhere in there.

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:43 am
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Annie
Guest


 		Geocashing
I solved it, but this theorem was lame. Lots of mistakes I think.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Can someone explain how B works out? Even if you count some columns twice it doesn't add up to the number M wanted. And what was with the clue changing in the middle of the puzzle?


PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:53 am
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Annie
Guest


 		Geocashing
Thanks, SoItBegins.

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:55 am
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Gorgo
Boot

Joined: 10 Jun 2011
Posts: 35

 		I, for one, would be very interested in seeing how M (or anyone in this forum) came up with the expected total for the longitudinal minutes. It just does not compute.

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:56 am
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Fed up
Guest


 		(B-A+1) deg (D/2)m (E+2+A).(C*3-1)s N
(E+3)deg ((B/4-2)/E+C*3)m (D+A).(B+D+A-1)s E


Spoiler (Rollover to View):

A=3
B=46 (wrongly required to be 52?)
C=8
D=10
E=10


(B-A+1) = 52-3+1 = 50
(D/2) = 10/2 = 5
(E+2+A) = 10+2+3 = 15
(C*3-1) = 8*3-1 = 23
thus 50 degrees 5 ' 15.23 " N

(E+3) = 10+3 =13
((B/4-2)/E+C*3) = ((52/4 - 2)/10+8*3) = ((13-2)/10 + 24) = 11/10 +24 = ???
(D+A) = 10+3 = 13
(B+D+A-1) = (52+10+3-1) = 64
thus 13 degrees ??? ' 13.64 N




As there are already multiple errors in various versions of this, anyone not agreeing with the above numbers please cite your source.

Math is based on standard order of operations:
exponentiate
multiply&divide
add&subtract

work each level of operations left to right within each level of parenthesis.

Agree with both Gorgo & Annie

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 1:58 am
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anon1212
Guest


 		Fed up,

Your values for E and C are also incorrect.

But I can only confirm this now that the "correct" value for B was posted here. That one is a terrible, terrible discrepancy, and some possible ambiguities in other places meant it wasn't easy to suss out. (If I was 100% confident in the other values, and if I was 100% confident that M was treating order of operations properly, then I guess the wrong value for B could have been determined by assuming the minute value for longitude must be a whole number)

In any case, terrible. I would have had this one done in 10 or 20 minutes for sure.

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:04 am
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Gorgo
Boot

Joined: 10 Jun 2011
Posts: 35

 		Never mind; I get it now. I was dividing (B/4 - 2) by (E + C*3) instead of just E as I should've been. D'oh! (At least it works if you use M's mysteriously arrived at quantity for B.)

Fed Up, E...
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
should be 11.
I don't recall the source because that number was in the sample text of a Google hit, so once I saw it, I started doing the math.

PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:07 am
Last edited by Gorgo on Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:14 am; edited 1 time in total
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MelissaJames
Guest
anon1212 wrote:
Fed up,

Your values for E and C are also incorrect.

But I can only confirm this now that the "correct" value for B was posted here. That one is a terrible, terrible discrepancy, and some possible ambiguities in other places meant it wasn't easy to suss out. (If I was 100% confident in the other values, and if I was 100% confident that M was treating order of operations properly, then I guess the wrong value for B could have been determined by assuming the minute value for longitude must be a whole number)

In any case, terrible. I would have had this one done in 10 or 20 minutes for sure.


C is correct, unless the map was pointing at another building.

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Unfortunately, given M's colossal screw up in disregarding fact checking this week, I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't pointing at the Forbidden City, but at one of the many palaces within, and put in a number slightly wrong so it wouldn't display properly.


PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:12 am
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KLHarmon
Greenhorn

Joined: 22 Sep 2011
Posts: 3

 		 Re: HELP!
geocaching
annie wrote:
I keep coming to the same city but it's not excepted. I need help! Please!

Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Cancun isn't it, what am I doing wrong?


You made the exact mistake I made. Your numbers are good, but your compass is upside down.

And to everyone else, the only way I got B was by figuring out E and reverse engineering the formula for the second coordinate.
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
Just looking at it you must conclude B/4-2 is a multiple of 11, and B had to be < 59 in order for it to work in the first formula


PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:18 am
Last edited by KLHarmon on Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:47 am; edited 2 times in total
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Fed up
Guest
anon1212 wrote:
Fed up,

Your values for E and C are also incorrect.

But I can only confirm this now that the "correct" value for B was posted here. That one is a terrible, terrible discrepancy, and some possible ambiguities in other places meant it wasn't easy to suss out. (If I was 100% confident in the other values, and if I was 100% confident that M was treating order of operations properly, then I guess the wrong value for B could have been determined by assuming the minute value for longitude must be a whole number)

In any case, terrible. I would have had this one done in 10 or 20 minutes for sure.


What sources are you using?
Spoiler (Rollover to View):
C= 8
A. Meridian Gate
B. Gate of Divine Might
C. West Glorious Gate
D. East Glorious Gate
E. Corner towers (4)
(per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forbidden_City)

E=10 per aerial picture (http://www.globalmountainsummit.org/statue-of-liberty.html & http://www.nyharborparks.org/visit/stli-faq.html 2nd is better and I'm counting the bottom star shaped level)


PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:20 am
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