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 Forum index » Chaotic Fiction » Marble Hornets
Troy and Joseph - we can wait for entry #52
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Jordan
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Joined: 19 Oct 2011
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 		 Troy and Joseph - we can wait for entry #52
Thank you Troy and Joseph for creating Marble Hornets which is brilliant - We can wait for #52.
Troy and Joseph, thank you for creating Marble Hornets and for . Thank you for taking the time and putting the effort to create something so brilliant for us and recieving next to nothing in return - and just letting you know: we can wait for entry #52. Just relax and Troy: I don't think it's a good idea to skip classes. I know Marble Hornets is important to you and Joseph, but it might be good to put things in perspective Smile

Here's to entry #104!

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:52 am
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ThinSuit
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 		Re: Troy and Joseph - we can wait for entry #52
Thank you Troy and Joseph for creating Marble Hornets which is brilliant - We can wait for #52.
Jordan wrote:
Troy and Joseph, thank you for creating Marble Hornets and for . Thank you for taking the time and putting the effort to create something so brilliant for us and recieving next to nothing in return - and just letting you know: we can wait for entry #52. Just relax and Troy: I don't think it's a good idea to skip classes. I know Marble Hornets is important to you and Joseph, but it might be good to put things in perspective Smile

Here's to entry #104!


Hell, that was a pointless thread
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 6:56 am
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ALEXGORDON
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 		Since when are you the one who has the right to speak for everyone on the forum?

Personally, as much as I love Marble Hornets, I don't really care if the entry comes out in an hour or a week. Yeah I have my preferences, but I'm not going to cry over it.

However that isn't the point. The point is that I do know that a lot of people have felt cheated these past couple of days for trying to wrap their own schedules around the release date of the new entry only to be screwed over due to their lack of preparation. I have no problem with you making a thread saying that YOU can wait as long as need be, even though it would be a pointless topic—just as this one is, but don't go and speak for everybody here. Many of us are tired of hearing the same old story of "New entry will be uploaded tonight at 3AM. Apologies if you have anything planned in the morning." ..We wait.. "LOL SORRY MAYBE TOMORROW NIGHT."
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:27 am
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awakeasaurusrex
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 		On balance - and I do think both sides of the argument on this have good points - I'm inclined to come down on the side of the people who are pissed off about this one.

If this had been the only time we'd had a situation where an entry was promoted but then delayed due to upload issues or rendering issues, that would be one thing. What tips the balance for me is that this has happened repeatedly. You'd think by now the gang would have learned that they can't rely on things uploading and rendering nicely on YouTube and would act accordingly.

It would be simplicity itself to upload an entry as a private video before any tweets saying "entry tonite!!!" go out, for the purposes of checking that it uploads nicely, renders correctly, and for a last-minute check for any gaffes or bloopers. Then they could post the "entry tonight!" teaser tweets and then either upload the entry again as a public video or - if they aren't bothered about the twitter and YouTube timelines being synced up down to the hour - just make the private video they uploaded public.

Or, if YouTube proves to be unpredictable even on this score, they could just stop with the teaser tweets. It's not like they add anything to the series for people coming along and watching after the fact; all the teasers accomplished in the past was get people hopped up and excited for the new entry. Well, at this point I think it's fairly clear they do more harm than good. The teasers not only create anticipation, they create expectation, and when that expectation is thwarted people get angry - that's completely predictable, and not something it's appropriate to blame the audience for. Yeah, this is free entertainment, but even in free entertainment creating an expectation and then failing to deliver on it still kind of sucks.

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:47 am
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Blank_Zero
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 		If it wasn't always posted so late, too.

I could see it if the teaser came at ~5pm and the vid went up at like 8. But no. They pop up at 1-4am, and some of us like to get up before noon mos days.

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:54 am
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Geneaux486
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 		Shit happens, Troy sounds like a busy guy. It's not like we didn't know that MH uploads were dependent on youtube functioning smoothly or Troy not having computer problems. This ain't his day job, and the only reason we were expecting it these past two nights is because Troy tries to keep his viewers in the loop by estimating when it'll be posted. Sure, I'm bummed that 52 hasn't been posted yet, same as everyone else, but it's really nobody's fault. He's under no obligation to work his videos around our schedules, yet he tries to anyway. We should all ease up.

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 8:13 am
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riderpool
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 		thank you.

someone realizes that these people have lives.

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:36 am
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Capercorn
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 		Dear Troseph:

I am sorry to hear that you computer and/or YouTube is making things difficult right now. I'm sure that you're pretty bummed out that you don't get to see us in massive flamewars over random birds in Entry 52, so that you can't scream "DANCE MONKIES DANCE" while Joseph plays a trumpet on Troy's floor.

I'm also sorry that some people on this forum don't understand the adage, "you get what you pay for," at the same time as they realize that they are paying zero dollars and zero cents to watch this amazing series.

With love and slendicles,

Capercorn

P.S. Tim: Try going to a priest again. Maybe the computer is infected with anti-fun demons or something.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:50 am
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Teedub
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 		-

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:55 am
Last edited by Teedub on Sat Nov 12, 2011 5:00 pm; edited 1 time in total
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redherring
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Geneaux486 wrote:
Shit happens, Troy sounds like a busy guy. It's not like we didn't know that MH uploads were dependent on youtube functioning smoothly or Troy not having computer problems. This ain't his day job, and the only reason we were expecting it these past two nights is because Troy tries to keep his viewers in the loop by estimating when it'll be posted. Sure, I'm bummed that 52 hasn't been posted yet, same as everyone else, but it's really nobody's fault. He's under no obligation to work his videos around our schedules, yet he tries to anyway. We should all ease up.


All right, I'm going to try to make this post as clear and concise as possible, since I think people are misunderstanding a bit where people like myself and awakeasaurusrex are coming from.

Everything that awake said is completely reasonable. There's no calling out of Troy, Joseph, or Tim. No bashing or hating on them. It's a perfectly reasonable frustration to have, and isn't presented with a plethora of a) exclamation points b) all-caps c) swearing.

Sure, some people are hating on them, and that's pretty stupid. Calling Troy an idiot or an ass or whatever is just the wrong way to react when you're frustrated. There are those of us (myself and awake in this case that I can point out so far) that have taken a step back before reacting. I was up until almost 3am, woke up around 8-9am the next day, saw there was still no entry, and was disappointed. But I wasn't thinking 'What a douchebag, I'm gonna go shit on him on the Internets!'. I was thinking 'Dang... I wish maybe he would render earlier than he posts more often so he doesn't have to deal with crap like this.'

So when I (and awake, and a few others whose handles I don't know off the top of my head) posted, I posted what I thought was a reasonable, even-tempered, level-headed response. And both of us seem to be misread as butthurt simply on the merit that we aren't saying 'Hey it's all right!' and ending it there. Of course it's all right - neither of us called for Troy's head on a stake. We're just sharing our opinions on how things could have gone better with some pre-planning on their part. We can't change what happened with Entry #52, but it'd be nice for them to see ways they can go about this with Entry #53 and beyond.

Honestly, they're probably just as frustrated about this as we are right now. Trying to be a voice of reason and support by giving some constructive criticism, in spite of all the frustration, isn't something we should be trying to stifle. We should be saving that for when people are being legitimate assholes to these guys.

(And I'm sorry to Tharol, who will likely read this and sigh/roll eyes about the length of my post. I'm just sick of being misread on here in light of the whole Entry #52 fiasco the past few nights and would like it if others would try to understand where we're coming from.)

And since this post:

Teedub wrote:
You should have been waiting with the thought that Troy could experience some kind of problem and not get it uploaded.


came up right before mine, I figured I'd include it. That's a really unfair and pointless comment to make. Of course it's always a possibility, but generally the assumption is if he's been posting to Twitter in-game, it means the video is being uploaded. That's clearly not the case, and we've learned that, and (as you can read above) we're trying to be helpful in suggesting other ways to go about doing this in the future.

There are a number of us with opinions that don't stop at 'Oh, it's fine' who are not crying, and who are trying to be a bit helpful to them. You don't have to agree, but don't start being dicks to us over it without taking a moment to think about where we're coming from. Then you're being no better than everyone who's been a dick to Troy and the gang for not getting it up when they wanted. (And before someone jumps at me for calling everyone on here a 'dick' I am specifically responding to Teedub's post.)
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 9:59 am
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tijde
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 		I'm with OP. Thanks guys.

To the angry fans: You're right, this has happened repeatedly. Which means every time you rearrange your schedule, get your hopes up, etc., you do so knowing this is a possibility. If you've got stuff to do, if you're not a night person, if you need to get up, then suck it up for the night and just go to bed. Seriously, not that hard.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:03 am
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grimcat
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Capercorn wrote:
I'm also sorry that some people on this forum don't understand the adage, "you get what you pay for," at the same time as they realize that they are paying zero dollars and zero cents to watch this amazing series.


I came in here to post exactly this. I would be getting angry if I was paying for this and part of that exchange involved them delivering on a deadline; I'm not, and it doesn't, so I'm not angry. Disappointed? Sure! I'm disappointed along with the rest of the UFers. But I'm still here, and I suspect the majority of UFers will be.

I realize that there's this informal contract that we believe exists between the creators and the audience of MH. This contract means that we support and cheer for MarbleHornets, and we unleash our rage when they don't deliver. But this contract doesn't exist.

You may choose to think it exists because it gives you a sense of ownership in this- not ownership in that you own MH, but ownership in that you are a part of this experience- but that's not the case. The truth is, Troy and Joseph have created something really cool out of a preexisting mythos and are telling us an AWESOME story about loss, betrayal, and the unknown. They're doing this to some degree against their own interest, because I'm sure that this is taking a toll on their grades, their social lives, and their sleep. Wink

All that said, I feel like the reason we rage is because it continues to tie us together, to make us feel we have something in common as a community. But honestly, we don't need to do that. We're here. We'll be here when 52 comes up. We'll be here when there's a break between seasons. It's okay if we don't talk about it for a while. We'll be waiting, moving on to other series and occasionally chuckling about this one to each other or gleefully introducing someone else. At which point someone posts to this forum that their doing a synchtube viewing because he or she got two or three friends to watch it, and do we want to join them?

And of course we will. Because we love MH, and we want to share the joy and sheer terror with someone new.

So: I look forward to #52. It'll come. And I'll be waiting. Wink

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:06 am
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redherring
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tijde wrote:
I'm with OP. Thanks guys.

To the angry fans: You're right, this has happened repeatedly. Which means every time you rearrange your schedule, get your hopes up, etc., you do so knowing this is a possibility. If you've got stuff to do, if you're not a night person, if you need to get up, then suck it up for the night and just go to bed. Seriously, not that hard.


Please, read the post I made right above yours?

Or just read this response from the Rage thread, since it's more succinct.

The Reverend wrote:
Re: Complaining

I can honestly see both sides to this. On one hand, yes, Troy, Joseph, and crew are presenting us with free entertainment and "owe" us nothing. To demand anything from them is laughable and sadly most of society is leaning toward a model where everyone feels entitled to something completely non-essential being just handed to them, especially with all of the bells and whistles.

On the OTHER: An expectation has been set every time Jay/Troy or anyone else involved in the production says that something's going to happen, and then it doesn't. Think of it this way: say your friend invites you out to eat. He or she is planning on paying for the full thing - food, drinks, tip - the whole shebang is on him or her. Understandably, you'd look forward to this. So you wait. And you wait. And you wait some more. Maybe your friend phones and says that he or she is running late. But then it gets to be extremely late, and your friend eventually says they were unable to make it, that you'd have to wait another day.

Depending on the situation, one might be angry at the friend, or maybe you understand completely. But I don't know a single human being that wouldn't be in some way, disappointed, especially if they gave up something of some level of importance for this dinner - as many of us have for this video (sleep, for one).

In closing... no matter which direction you lean... just don't be a complete genital.


redherring wrote:
To carry The Reverend's logic about it, we're trying to suggest to our friend that in the future, they can plan ahead a bit. In this case, maybe the reason they couldn't come is their car wasn't working, but they didn't check the car until they were already going to leave.

The car not working isn't her fault, but if this has happened to her a number of times in the past, we would probably suggest she checks that her car is working earlier before making the plans so that this won't happen again. We're still frustrated, but trying to be helpful instead of hurtful.

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:13 am
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awakeasaurusrex
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Geneaux486 wrote:
Shit happens, Troy sounds like a busy guy. It's not like we didn't know that MH uploads were dependent on youtube functioning smoothly or Troy not having computer problems. This ain't his day job, and the only reason we were expecting it these past two nights is because Troy tries to keep his viewers in the loop by estimating when it'll be posted.

Sure, I accept all these points. All I'm saying is that he should stop posting the estimates because they cause more problems than they solve. Tweeting when the video is live and give a couple tweets in the aftermath to give an update on Jay's situation would result in the same amount of content going out, and wouldn't create this sense of breathless anticipation which too often recently has turned into frayed tempers.

PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:27 am
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tijde
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 		red, we were writing at the same time, I think. Your reply wasn't there when I started mine. Still, I fully understood the position you and awake are coming from before reading either of your posts here. I just happen to completely disagree with it. With all the effort they've put into this series, do you really think they've never considered uploading to private first? Or that they don't know the risks of the pre-entry tweets? Of course they do. For some reason, they've chosen to do it this way. It's their series; they don't have to justify or explain anything.

In your example, I line up on this side:
Quote:
Troy, Joseph, and crew are presenting us with free entertainment and "owe" us nothing. To demand anything from them is laughable and sadly most of society is leaning toward a model where everyone feels entitled to something completely non-essential being just handed to them, especially with all of the bells and whistles.


Laughable. Period.

I also think this:
Quote:
... we're trying to suggest to our friend that in the future, they can plan ahead a bit. In this case, maybe the reason they couldn't come is their car wasn't working, but they didn't check the car until they were already going to leave.

The car not working isn't her fault, but if this has happened to her a number of times in the past, we would probably suggest she checks that her car is working earlier before making the plans so that this won't happen again. We're still frustrated, but trying to be helpful instead of hurtful.

... would be kind of a jerk thing to do. I personally would give my friend the benefit of the doubt, since I'm sure having an unreliable car is a much bigger pain in the ass for her than it is for me. Any reasonable person would of course think of getting it fixed. If she hadn't already, I'd assume there was a financial or practical reason holding her back. And if I were that friend, hearing "Hey, maybe you should plan ahead" would be pretty insulting, and yeah, pretty selfish. If I were Troy, I'd be pissed. Hence this thread--so he and the creators know that some of us aren't mad or acting entitled.
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:45 am
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