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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: General » Old News & Rumors
[TRAILHEAD] Ridley Scott's Prometheus Viral...
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Yoko99
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Joined: 18 Mar 2012
Posts: 97
zort70 wrote:
Don't let me stop you all though, I'm just not going to pay much attention.


It's the same for me. I'm keeping an eye on you guys, but not reading too closely for the same reasons.

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 6:22 am
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IcedMetal
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Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 26

 		Filmedge, to clarify: I don't necessarily think the Company, and therefore by extension, Ash had full knowledge of what to expect on LV-426. As you say, why send space truckers to deal with it if they did?

I do think that Ash's substitution onto the Nostromo crew very heavily hints that the signal had been detected well before the Nostromo happened to pass by. It isn't really explainable otherwise.

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:00 am
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SevenSonicStructures
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Joined: 06 Mar 2012
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 		Don't worry much about reading/not reading the discussion, guys: what we've done so far is clarifying Weyland's role in the interception of the LV-426 warning signal in Alien and how this corresponds to what we *should* see in Prometheus, but not as a prediction but rather as laying some basic grounds when it comes to canon. It's a good thing index found that Ridley Scott quote about "the other ship" because it means that we shouldn't focus on expecting this film to have a direct relationship to Alien save for the events that will unfold somewhere, tying to what we already know. I love discussing film lore the way we've done here, but I think we still have no clear idea of what actually will happen in Prometheus, so it's a good thing Ridley Scott and Lindelof/Spaihts have devoted enough time to remove any sort of doubt regarding the nature of what we'll see, a fresh start.

Also index, I have no idea who that might be, but he's clearly touching her inappropriately in that pic...

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:51 am
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thebruce
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Yoko99 wrote:
zort70 wrote:
Don't let me stop you all though, I'm just not going to pay much attention.

It's the same for me. I'm keeping an eye on you guys, but not reading too closely for the same reasons.

big huge paragraphs? *skipskipskip* Razz
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:01 am
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Yoko99
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thebruce wrote:

big huge paragraphs? *skipskipskip* Razz


Well that's.. that's just.. just preposterous!

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:34 am
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tpbiv
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Joined: 20 Mar 2012
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 		Uncanny Valley
This relates to David, probably not related to a clue, but interesting:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncanny_valley

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 11:53 am
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THEREALOWINN
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 		Re: LV-426
Planetoid (moon)
FilmEdge wrote:
index wrote:
Correction: he does not say he has no idea what it is, he says he's "never seen anything like it". This is atom splitting, but technically he can say that and still be speaking truth while also concealing the fact that he does, indeed, know what it is.

I know what Australia is, despite never having seen it with my own eyes, follow? A fine distinction, but a relevant one if pursuing that line of thought.

Bottom line is there is not enough data in Alien v1 to quantify whether Ash had advanced intelligence about Acheron and the Derelict. This is one of the mysteries that makes the Alien story so great.

Scott knows that he cannot expose too many secrets without replacing with at least a proportional amount of new ones. It will be interesting seeing how he handles the bait and switch here.


I agree both that your distinction is splitting atoms but also may give Ash some wiggle room in telling the truth. It's the mark of good storytelling that we can't pin down his knowledge and motives so easily. Unless we corner Ridley Scott himself and ask him, I doubt we'll ever know the direct answer. On the other hand...

Yes, you know Australia because you've received a LOT of data about it, either through casual or direct sources of education. You've seen maps, globes, TV shows, films, perhaps met people from there, received a solid general education in your life, etc. You could probably rattle off plenty of valid facts about Australia without ever having seen it, let alone set foot on it. So could I and most of us here. And all that without ever formally studying it for a thesis or being briefed on it by one of its inhabitants at length. This proves nothing except that we accumulate knowledge through many sources at varying depths, and that our brains tend to catalogue such data and compile it for reference.

If Ash did "know what the ship was" but had never seen it with his own eyes, must that imply that he was given direct information about the SJ ship and all that implies? And frankly, if Ash was given his secret directive to retrieve the xenomorph in advance, why wouldn't the Company — armed with all that knowledge including it's connection to the SJ ship — NOT include an image of the ship in his mission data so he COULD recognize it on site? That seems a stupid detail to omit if they intend him to carry out their mission single-handedly. If WY has a standing order to seek out and contact any ship like the SJ's, that info would be the FIRST thing they would give to their operative, not the one item they would leave out, and that data would be given to every Ash and Mother out there looking.

This entire question arises from his sudden substitution into Dallas' crew just before takeoff. But to me that fact also raises a huge doubt that Ash knew all (or at least most) of what he'd find on Acheron. If the Company had pre-knowledge of the SJ derelict ship's position, and possibly a new hostile lifeform associated with it — then why the hell would they leave its retrieval to a bunch of truck drivers who, many months in the future, would eventually pass by Acheron to be diverted on their trip home?

To me this makes no sense at all, since it's a huge waste of resources and time to accomplish what should be a simple mission: go to Acheron, investigate the signal, retrieve any lifeform found and return it to Earth for exploitation. WY would just send a properly prepared, armed and trained team to go do that one thing if they want it done right... and above all, secretly. You don't send civilians out to meet ET if you want ETs to be kept top secret... even if you kill them one they meet ET. It's introducing a needless risk into the mission which jeopardizes the prime directive of the mission: exclusivity (as WY sees it). Worse, WY would be risking billions in mineral ore profits by 'wasting' the Nostromo on this entirely unrelated mission. If WY is about anything, it's about their bottom line... as evidenced in ALIENS when Ripley is charged by the company of losing all those profits by blowing up her ship.

Here's a fact straight from the film: Special Order 937 (as Ripley reads it on-screen) states --

Quote:
NOSTROMO REROUTED TO NEW COORDINATES. INVESTIGATE LIFE FORM. GATHER SPECIMEN.


I see nothing in that wording which indicates Ash was given a pre-flight briefing on Acheron, the beacon, the SJ derelict ship or what specimen he might find in it. "Rerouted" reads like an improvised order based on conditions of the moment, otherwise Nostromo would have been *routed* there originally in the flight plan (if unbeknownst to the crew except Ash). "New coordinates" also implies a deviation from standing ship orders and navigation plan, not an added (secret) detour which was planned before take off.

I can see Mother deciphering the beacon message as a warning, and perhaps even knowing the warning SJs were sending: "Hostile xenomorph lifeform infestation. Danger. Do not approach this moon" or whatever. Of course Mother would cloud or lie about her translation to Ripley as she investigates the signal, but that still doesn't insist that Mother knew she would FIND the beacon ahead of time. And SO 937's wording only supports that conclusion. Mother acted in conjunction with Ash, but in an improvised manner based on the surprise discovery of the beacon.

Even assuming every bit of knowledge gained from the encounter in PROMETHEUS were programmed into Mother and/or shared with Ash before he joined the Nostromo crew, it still seems to me their discovery caught them off guard and really unprepared to fulfill 937 successfully. And the proof is in the pudding, as it were, since Ash (and Mother) failed miserably in their secret mission for the Company. Again, Ash's directive was exposed about 2/3 the way through the film, which is all the more reason to convince me that the Company didn't mastermind this encounter from the start using the Nostromo crew as their puppets.

I think the Company knows something about what it's looking for in space thanks to events in PROMETHEUS, but has no idea when, where or if they'll ever encounter it again. ALIEN is a tale about the fallout of that undirected directive, and a cautionary tale about looking for bad things when not prepared to handle the results. Some might think, myself included, that this theme is not far off from what we might see in PROMETHEUS, but 'back then' the discovery comes as a total, possibly horrifying shock to humanity's image of itself and the universe beyond our knowledge. Pandora's box, as it were, and a nightmare courtesy of Peter Weyland's bioengineered hubris.

Like the xenomorph as Ash describes it, this Promethean fire... this forbidden knowledge is amoral in its native state. Fire can warm, it can help sustain us, or it can destroy us. If indeed a God or Gods are omniscient, then the more knowledge we learn, the greater our responsibility to respect that knowledge lest we misuse it against our better interests. Perhaps PROMETHEUS teaches us that lesson as a species, and ALIEN shows us the peril when we fail to remember it?


It's all about exclusive rights to specimens - it has to be made to look like nobody knows it even exists for the company to essentially sneak it home and gain complete exclusivity over the project - if everyone knows about it then other rival private enterprise will step in and steal Weyland's thunder.
Take this from Aliens:

Burke: Look, those two specimens are worth millions to the bio-weapons division. Now, if you're smart, we can both come out of it as heroes and we'll be set up for life.

Ripley: You're crazy Burke, you know that? You really think that you can get a dangerous organism like that past ICC quarantine?

Burke: How can they impound it if they don't know about it?

Ripley: Oh they *will* know about it, Burke. From me. Just like they'll know that you were responsible for the deaths if 158 colonists here.

Burke: Wait a second...

Ripley: You sent them to that ship.

Burke: You're wrong.

Ripley: I just checked the colony log. Dated 0-6-1-2-7-9, signed Burke, Carter J. You sent them out there and you didn't even warn them. Why didn't you warn them, Burke?

Burke: Okay, look. What if that ship didn't even exist, huh? Did you ever think about that? I didn't know! So now, if I went in and made a major security issue out of it, everybody steps in. Administration steps in, and there are no exclusive rights for anybody; nobody wins. So I made a decision and it was... wrong. It was a bad call, Ripley, it was a bad call.

Ripley: Bad call?

Ripley: These people are *dead *,Burke! Don't you have any idea what you have done here? Well, I'm gonna make sure they nail you right to the wall for this! You're not gonna sleaze your way out of this one! Right to the wall!

Burke: Ripley...! You know, I... I expected more from you. I thought you'd be smarter than this.

Ripley: I'm happy to disappoint you.


couple of things are going to bug me about that movie now though, mainly where the hell are all the androids in Hadley's Hope!?

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:16 pm
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antovolk
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Joined: 13 Feb 2012
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 		Not strictly viral related, but Empire's PROMETHEUS feature comes out tomorrow, and Ridley teases the next bit of viral marketing...

Quote:
Ridley says in the interview that the next piece of marketing will be like the TED Conference, but will be about David - and he will be talking, and at the end he puts his finger on the screen and there is the W for Weyland in his finger print!


A bit more on this at http://weylandinvestors.tumblr.com/post/20065898068/big-weyland-news

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:32 pm
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Yoko99
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 		Re: LV-426
Planetoid (moon)
THEREALOWINN wrote:
couple of things are going to bug me about that movie now though, mainly where the hell are all the androids in Hadley's Hope!?


That's a lot of quoting to say just that,don't you think ? Very Happy

Well, I don't know how many references to Aliens Scott has decided to make. I doubt he ends up doing it much. I kinda consider this "canon" to Alien at the moment. If anything new on that front comes up, I'll deal with it when the time comes, lol
So far, I think the viral campaign has referenced the sequels, but the movie/trailers haven't. Right?

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:59 pm
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antovolk
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 		Empire scans: http://www.avpgalaxy.net/forum/index.php?topic=42700.msg1317200#msg1317200

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 1:09 pm
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FilmEdge
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Joined: 21 May 2010
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 		No worries for those not reading along about story discussions, that's all good. But since the ARG has stalled for the moment, I wanted to start addressing some ideas and questions I had about Peter Weyland himself and how his actions (and WI history) relate to ALIEN, if at all.

No matter how that works or doesn't, we can probably all agree that Peter Weyland will have a LOT to do with the current ARG and future progress in it. I hoped that some discussion about him might spark other ideas which might lead to progress on new clues.

And if the discussion helped us turn away from the idea that the SJ ship in PROMETHEUS is on LV-426, then that might avoid pursuing false leads in the game. We'll see.

I'm guessing we have been given the tools we need to proceed on the websites, but not all the info needed to take that next step forward and unveil a new image, etc. If the ARG is being run on a schedule, we might temporarily be ahead of schedule and the PMs aren't going to rush into the next phase quite yet. If we're at a dead end right now, I think a couple flips of calendar pages will solve that problem soon.

Oh, I'll try to shorten my paragraphs a bit too so others have less to skip past on the pages, ha!

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 1:43 pm
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index
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Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 86
FilmEdge wrote:
No worries for those not reading along about story discussions, that's all good. But since the ARG has stalled for the moment, I wanted to start addressing some ideas and questions I had about Peter Weyland himself and how his actions (and WI history) relate to ALIEN, if at all.


Being the idiot I am for the whole RS/O'Bannon universe, it was a blast having some quality discourse on all that, but I can see how it would lead to an annoyance for others, so I'm going to refrain from engaging further. It wasn't my intention to derail ARG discussions and I feel like an ass now.

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:15 pm
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RHT1
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 		Meanwhile, in the stalled ARG...
All long paragraphs and conjecture aside, has anyone in the midst of all the discussion mentioned or asked why on the WI 'About Weyland Corp' page it says 'Corporate Communication Frequency' at the bottom in the grey bar?

Anyone think it's possibly a suggestion regarding the light blue flash (that I originally thought might be morse, but now not so sure), glitch, spheres, etc...? Something to do a frequency instead?

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:09 pm
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darkkk
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Joined: 22 Mar 2012
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 		thank you antovolk for the Empire scans, and here's another magazine article http://www.prometheusnews.net/movie/film-ink/

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:14 pm
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SLUSHO_ZOOM!
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Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 311
Location: NYC/BROOKLYN

 		Re: Meanwhile, in the stalled ARG...
RHT1 wrote:
All long paragraphs and conjecture aside, has anyone in the midst of all the discussion mentioned or asked why on the WI 'About Weyland Corp' page it says 'Corporate Communication Frequency' at the bottom in the grey bar?

Anyone think it's possibly a suggestion regarding the light blue flash (that I originally thought might be morse, but now not so sure), glitch, spheres, etc...? Something to do a frequency instead?


Perhaps it is a specific microwave/radio frequency used to communicate with distant spacecraft. What do they use to communicate with the Mars roversor other exploration spacecraft?

PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:15 pm
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