Return to Unfiction unforum
 a.r.g.b.b 
FAQ FAQ   Search Search 
 
Welcome!
New users, PLEASE read these forum guidelines. New posters, SEARCH before posting and read these rules before posting your killer new campaign. New players may also wish to peruse the ARG Player Tutorial.

All users must abide by the Terms of Service.
Website Restoration Project
This archiving project is a collaboration between Unfiction and Sean Stacey (SpaceBass), Brian Enigma (BrianEnigma), and Laura E. Hall (lehall) with
the Center for Immersive Arts.
Announcements
This is a static snapshot of the
Unfiction forums, as of
July 23, 2017.
This site is intended as an archive to chronicle the history of Alternate Reality Games.
  

The time now is Tue Nov 26, 2024 2:00 am
All times are UTC - 4 (DST in action)		 View posts in this forum since last visit
View unanswered posts in this forum
Calendar
 Forum index » Chaotic Fiction » Marble Hornets
[LOCKED] [OT] Let's have ANOTHER rage thread!
Moderators: Giskard, JKatkina, Zarggg
View previous topicView next topic
Page 132 of 207 [3104 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 130, 131, 132, 133, 134, ..., 205, 206, 207  Next
Author Message
LBfly
Decorated


Joined: 17 Nov 2012
Posts: 216

 		That's not how I feel here. Im speaking the way I feel even though Im not raging and actually sad I cant enjoy a good debate here in this forum because some people are rude and arrogant in the way they share their opinions.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:14 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
LBfly
Decorated


Joined: 17 Nov 2012
Posts: 216

 		Sorry Geneaux maybe Im not being clear, english is not my first language. You could divide this people in two groups, the ones that do speak in a more harsh way in order to emphasise their opinions yet they respect other ideas AND the others (I could mention names based on the entry 67 thread) who complain in a rude and arrogant way, some to make their points, some to force others into accepting their ideas too. Even though I dont like the idea of the first group, I respect it and may even act like this if I get angry or something, but the second one totally ruins my experience here at unfiction and watching Marble Hornets.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:24 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Lithp
I Have No Life


Joined: 04 Mar 2012
Posts: 2058

 		Gonna rage once more at the filler debate. I dislike the notion that "filler requires intent." It's basically useless, because you can't criticize the rate of plot development, because the author can just decide that everything was plot development, no matter how little sense that makes. Basically, it relegates "filler" to being synonymous with "non-canon spinoff." Which is pointless, because we already know that doesn't develop the plot.

Quote:
Exactly. I've seen people who pepper their argument with "In my opinion" in like every sentence and it just comes off as... submissive or something, or like they aren't comitted to what they're saying yet.


This is exactly why they tell you not to do it in persuasive writing.

You're generally supposed to assume that your audience knows the difference between fact & opinion. Of course, we know this isn't always true. Like I said, it's a paradox.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:36 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
LBfly
Decorated


Joined: 17 Nov 2012
Posts: 216

 		What does filler mean? Sorry the randomness its just, i dont get it, and you use this word a lot. Embarassed

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:43 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Geneaux486
I Have No Life


Joined: 17 Mar 2011
Posts: 2423
Quote:
Gonna rage once more at the filler debate. I dislike the notion that "filler requires intent." It's basically useless, because you can't criticize the rate of plot development, because the author can just decide that everything was plot development, no matter how little sense that makes.


But then the author would have to follow through with that by somehow reworking the story to make everything important, assuming it wasn't already. Though you do have a valid point with the criticism of the rate of plot developement, I wouldn't call a percieved slow plot advancement and "filler" the same thing. When I think "filler" I think no plot advancement at all.

Quote:
What does filler mean?


Different people will tell you different things. The basic idea is that it's an event in the story that serves no purpose other than to drag the story out, or buy the writer some time. It's like padding.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:48 pm
Last edited by Geneaux486 on Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:54 pm; edited 1 time in total
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
ReynardtaFox
Veteran


Joined: 19 Feb 2012
Posts: 123
twistedpuppet wrote:
ReynardtaFox wrote:


"I didn't like Troy's editing in last video" - Self-report. A statement about one's own aesthetic preferences.

"Troy's editing in last video was awful." - Statement of fact/conjecture. A statement about the objective merits of the video, not simply personal preference.


Neither of those statements are fact. Saying it was awful is still an opinion no matter how much you try to say it otherwise.


Not saying that I think Troy's editing was awful. The word "fact", at least in classical rhetorical theory, designates a claim about reality. That claim could be either true or false. For example, a true fact - apples grow on trees; a false fact - carrots grow on trees. Both of these are claims about reality, and therefore fall under the category of fact/conjecture.

However "I didn't like Troy's editing" is a self-report. My response to this would be to say, "Yes, it is true that you don't like Troy's editing. But I do."

The problem comes when someone makes a fact/conjecture statement which requires an objective standard of judgment, and then fail to supply that standard or any theoretical basis for that standard, thus making themselves sound like whiny 5-year olds.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 9:51 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Lithp
I Have No Life


Joined: 04 Mar 2012
Posts: 2058
Quote:
Different people will tell you different things. The basic idea is that it's an event in the story that serves no purpose other than to drag the story out, or buy the writer some time. It's like padding.


Related, you'll get different reactions on whether or not it's necessarily bad. I say it can be useful for pacing and characterization.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:05 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Geneaux486
I Have No Life


Joined: 17 Mar 2011
Posts: 2423
Lithp wrote:
Quote:
Different people will tell you different things. The basic idea is that it's an event in the story that serves no purpose other than to drag the story out, or buy the writer some time. It's like padding.


Related, you'll get different reactions on whether or not it's necessarily bad. I say it can be useful for pacing and characterization.


True, I've gotten used to seeing it used with purely negative connotations. I'm given to understand that the term originated with manga becoming anime, and that it was primarily used to keep the anime from catching up to and overtaking their manga counterparts.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:07 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Lithp
I Have No Life


Joined: 04 Mar 2012
Posts: 2058
Geneaux486 wrote:
Lithp wrote:
Quote:
Different people will tell you different things. The basic idea is that it's an event in the story that serves no purpose other than to drag the story out, or buy the writer some time. It's like padding.


Related, you'll get different reactions on whether or not it's necessarily bad. I say it can be useful for pacing and characterization.


True, I've gotten used to seeing it used with purely negative connotations. I'm given to understand that the term originated with manga becoming anime, and that it was primarily used to keep the anime from catching up to and overtaking their manga counterparts.


I don't know if that's where it originally came from, but that's where it's commonly used.

And yes, it is often used very negatively, which might be why there's such a strong aversion to it.

Leave it to us anime fans to ruin everything.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:15 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Geneaux486
I Have No Life


Joined: 17 Mar 2011
Posts: 2423

 		Might have been the fast food industry that made me percieve the term in such a negative way. I hear "filler" and I think of wood-pulp and sand filled beef entres.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:33 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Lithp
I Have No Life


Joined: 04 Mar 2012
Posts: 2058

 		Not sure if I want to know the story behind that.

PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2013 10:38 pm
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
pravado
Unfictologist

Joined: 22 Apr 2011
Posts: 1833

 		"I didn't like Troy's editing in last video" - persons opinion on troys editing


"Troy's editing in last video was awful. - persons opinion on troys editing



If you're assuming what someone says they believe to be fact when it could be inferred as an opinion if they said it was their opinion, then you're basically assuming the person is stupid to the point where they believe it to be fact, and that the counter opinion is factually wrong.

It's not the fault of the person making the statement, it's your fault for perceiving it that way. When I say fault, I don't mean that in a negative connotation, I just mean if you see things that way, then that's your own doing. It doesn't mean it's fact. Kind of ironic if you think about it.

The way I define filler is something that moves the plot along, but provides no new information or anything to work with for theories. Most people assume it's "shit entry and nothing more"

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 1:04 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Serum
Guest


 		I'm angry that the Dewey Decimal System is practically obsolete with the advent of networking technology that allows users from all over the planet (with the exception of police states like North Korea and Australia) to read books on their mobile look-at devices at any given time from almost anywhere. Why can't we go back to writing stuff in longhand? Does the word have no more class? Raaaaage.

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 2:43 am
 Back to top 
Yuki
Decorated

Joined: 17 Apr 2011
Posts: 225
pravado wrote:
"I didn't like Troy's editing in last video" - persons opinion on troys editing


"Troy's editing in last video was awful. - persons opinion on troys editing



If you're assuming what someone says they believe to be fact when it could be inferred as an opinion if they said it was their opinion, then you're basically assuming the person is stupid to the point where they believe it to be fact, and that the counter opinion is factually wrong.

It's not the fault of the person making the statement, it's your fault for perceiving it that way. When I say fault, I don't mean that in a negative connotation, I just mean if you see things that way, then that's your own doing. It doesn't mean it's fact. Kind of ironic if you think about it.

The way I define filler is something that moves the plot along, but provides no new information or anything to work with for theories. Most people assume it's "shit entry and nothing more"


Again: semantics are important. It's all about perception. If someone says "I really liked the editing in this!" and someone else responds with "the editing was awful", it's gone from simple discussion/debate to potential flamewars. It's part of the reason, I'd bet, that you get so much flak here--you don't pull any punches with your opinions, which is fine, but they're all framed as fact.

Of course they're your opinions, but again, it's all in how you phrase it.

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 4:47 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Lithp
I Have No Life


Joined: 04 Mar 2012
Posts: 2058

 		So we're just going to ignore the fact that any rhetorical writing instructor would side with Pravado here? Alright, then.

PostPosted: Mon Feb 18, 2013 7:25 am
 View user's profile
 Back to top 
Display posts from previous:   Sort by:   
Page 132 of 207 [3104 Posts]   Goto page: Previous 1, 2, 3, ..., 130, 131, 132, 133, 134, ..., 205, 206, 207  Next
View previous topicView next topic
 Forum index » Chaotic Fiction » Marble Hornets
Jump to:  


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum
You cannot post calendar events in this forum



Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group