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 Forum index » Archive » Archive: The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!) » The Haunted Apiary (Let Op!): General/Updates
[SPEC] THE KEY- Turn in the Sleeping Princess....
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Incitatus
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Joined: 01 Oct 2004
Posts: 487
Location: Austin, Texas

 		[SPEC] THE KEY- Turn in the Sleeping Princess....
To this date we have seen no major goal completed. While I think it best to convince Mel that dana is of no consiquence, and that she has been manipulated by the PF, we have seen that this will not work (9-28 phone calls)

I think our best course of action is to deliver either Dana or the SP to Mel.
Now this has become either impossible due to the advance warning given to her, or inevitable due to Mel's monitoring of the e-mails...


The SP is almost essential to be delivered to Mel. Because as I have theorized for a while, and has been given substantial proof as of late, the SP IS the donor persona of the AI contruct. She must be reintegrated with Mel. that is the only way that Mel will become more stable, not to mention more capable of thinking.

Consider this:
If all the human personality traits that Mel has shown to lack (IE: compassion, humor, forgiveness*) are contained on the donor-persona that the AI is centered on (Core Module, "I was INSIDE the queen"-sp). Then ONLY by reintegrating the SP with Mel, will we open her up to reason with regards to Dana and the PF.


I think that it is the only way. And I think we are deliberatly and very obviously being coxed into protecting the SP. (The child's voice, the scared and innocent mindset)
While her/others comments have dirrectly indicated that she is the donor persona.
Her brother... and other memories, wiped.
She is quoted as saying "while i was INSIDE the queen..."
Mel reffered to her escape as a "Core Module Hemorage"
Mel seemed to be able to grasp certain human concepts such as emapthy and concern during the Live calls up until the release of the SP.

WE MUST DO ALL WE CAN TO REINTEGRATE THE TWO.

That is the only way to continue.

Anything else is working against that goal, and stalling the progression.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 1:02 am
Last edited by Incitatus on Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:03 am; edited 3 times in total
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_Ghost_
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 		And I'm sure we'll all trust you, the guy with two posts.....

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 1:16 am
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Incitatus
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_Ghost_ wrote:
And I'm sure we'll all trust you, the guy with two posts.....


I am new to unfiction, but trust me...
I am a leading theorist from the Bungie.net forums...
Same name...

after some additional thought though I have adjusted my post to reflect what our goals should really be....
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 1:56 am
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Nova
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 		Can we get a [SPEC] on the thread title, please?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:51 am
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HitsHerMark
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Nova wrote:
Can we get a [SPEC] on the thread title, please?


Agreed.

You've already posted this in the "Response from Dana" thread, and I've already posted my answers there.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 2:55 am
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Incitatus
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 		sorry bout that folks...
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:03 am
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Nova
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 		Thanks Very Happy
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 3:18 am
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AngriBuddhist
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 		I'm going to take a wild stab in the dark and guess that the ILB ARG will not
last past...well I dunno...let's say...Nov. 9th.

From today that's 34-35 days depending on how you look at it. The final
update (and finale) could be on the very same Tuesday that Halo2 comes
out. That's 5 weeks from this Tuesday (10/5).

It's not that hard to imagine that the PMs have a timetable that they have
set events to or that they will hold us to it. I really doubt that they will let
us jump ahead of them.

At one point, SP asked us to email the times that we would be going to
axons so that she could spy on the Queen. She asked us to make sure that
we were there so she wouldn't get caught. As it so happens, that was the
perfect way for weephun to set her up. Coincidence?

Maybe SP getting locked up for a few days was a way for the PMs to show
us that it was possible as a solution for a future problem. Maybe you are
right but...

Even if your [SPEC] is true, what can we do about it?

If it's a path that we must take, the opportunity for it will come when the
PMs wish it.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:30 am
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AngriBuddhist
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 		As for giving up Dana, I really think that it would be much healthier to try
and get Melissa to reassess her threat level than to hand her over to certain
death.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:35 am
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Darketnal
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 		Hm. Well, it makes some sense. It does seem that only certain emotional, memory related thoughts send melissa into -ilovebees- mode. May be that when she hears those, the AI is trying to access memories or emotional reaction processes that are part of the SP.

Would probably explain why it was possible to get to the princess when Mellissa was losing it to. She was trying to access those subprocesses anyway.


The thing is, IIRC the princess was already in the glass coffin and sealed up when the crash happened. She does refer to being able to escape because it was cracked in the crash, right?

Which makes it seem to me that she wasn't just knocked free of Melissa or disrupted, but purposefully sealed away. And while I wouldn't say with any certainly why someone would do that, I would humbly suggest that one does not deactivate an AI's moral constraints if you're planning on doing charity work.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 4:59 am
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Incitatus
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 		good thought... but if the SP is a dormat "sleeping" personality, that is sealed (isolated) and used as a refference for teh main program, in this case the AI, Melissa...
Then the event of the crash wich dis-integrated Melissa, caused the capability fot the Human personality to become awakened and free. (Hence the *memories of her and her brother* before WAaP)
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 5:10 am
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Darketnal
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 		Interesting. Hmm. Thought occurs to me.

Say you're going to sabotage an AI, and you're very good at it - which I assumed you'd have to be for it to work at all. You're probably very clever and know how AIs work pretty well. You'd no doubt also be aware of it's autorepair unit, huh? And you'd probably want to take steps to ensure it's auto-repairing didn't include reintegrating that process you just took so much trouble to sabotage.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 5:23 am
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Incitatus
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Darketnal wrote:
Interesting. Hmm. Thought occurs to me.

Say you're going to sabotage an AI, and you're very good at it - which I assumed you'd have to be for it to work at all. You're probably very clever and know how AIs work pretty well. You'd no doubt also be aware of it's autorepair unit, huh? And you'd probably want to take steps to ensure it's auto-repairing didn't include reintegrating that process you just took so much trouble to sabotage.


so your speculating that the SP is an altered process, and the PF is an insurance protocol?

Doesn't work.

The SP is more or less, the core of a human mind. It cannot be altered or manipulated in any way. this is why whatever the PF is trying to get out of melissa by force and subversion, he is trying to get out of the SP through deception and percistance.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:47 am
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jellyfish_green
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Incitatus wrote:
Darketnal wrote:
Interesting. Hmm. Thought occurs to me.

Say you're going to sabotage an AI, and you're very good at it - which I assumed you'd have to be for it to work at all. You're probably very clever and know how AIs work pretty well. You'd no doubt also be aware of it's autorepair unit, huh? And you'd probably want to take steps to ensure it's auto-repairing didn't include reintegrating that process you just took so much trouble to sabotage.


so your speculating that the SP is an altered process, and the PF is an insurance protocol?

Or do you refer to the Black Widow of autorepair sequences?

If you wanted to *deliberately* cause the Crash to free the Princess, and you knew about the SPDR, a good saboteur like yourself would make sure the SPDR would find nothing wrong, and not attempt repair.
encrypt strong
!triage
fail - As in phase 1.
Hmmm.

PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 7:03 am
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GabrielBlade
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 		Incitatus, I think the suggestion was not to alter the SP in anyway, as you said, that's pretty much impossible. If, however, you could alter the rest of the AI to assume the SP was a threat, and take steps to seal itself off from it, similar to some forms of viral removal (guide the virus into a file and self destruct the file to get rid of the virus.. now where the hell did I get that from? Ahh, that's right. "C-DYL." From the Descent books, IIRC.. anyway)

If the AI Melissa was hacked by someone (or something) very fluent in the operation of an AI, and they managed to alter enough things about the AIs operation so as to convince it the inner "core" was actually a security threat, it's more than possible that the AI could seal the sections "infected". And lose the effect on the whole AI.

Hence, the reunification of the SP and Melissa could be very important.

But on the other hand, how do we know that the Queen won't simply lock the SP away again? No, I think the priorities are wrong. I think we should be convincing the SP that she was originally a part of the Queen, and it should be her infiltrating the Queen more fully, and unexpectedly. She said she never wanted to go back into the glass coffin, right? Well, if she controls the Queen, the Queen can't send her back, right?

Thoughts?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2004 8:39 am
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