unforum

[Dionysus]

Player Betrayals and UnFiction

[addlepated]

It's up to the PMs to deal with the information they're presented. I can think of several in-game ways they could ignore it. If they don't, then enjoy the direction the game has taken.

This isn't like rocket science or life-or-death stuff. It's a game. If it's gotten to the point where you're calling people names on the board and saying that someone has killed Unfiction, I'd argue that you have become over-involved and need to step back to reassess the situation.

[rowan]

Re: Player Betrayals and UnFiction

[jamesi]

Re: Player Betrayals and UnFiction

[Dionysus]

Im not saying I wont play the games.. Im just saying I cant post to UF about it. The information isnt safe there because, althoguh the characters cant come and take it.. Rusty can send it to them (its his right to do so, Im not fighting that).

[addlepated]

It's up to you if you want to form a player clique that only certain people can join in order to share information with each other, but I think that if that's what you're proposing, it's even more fractious than what has you up in arms to begin with.

[colin]

Just to re-enforce what others have said: It's the PM decision. They really do control the game, despite what you think. And if there not controlling the game...Well that's just ugly. I've never really liked interaction that much in ARGs, This is one of the reasons why.

I also prefer ARGs that tell a story, rather than create it as they go. This is where I sympathise with you. If the story is being created on-the-fly then you need to worry about all influences on the story, which includes players. That leaves the door open for inter-player politics...which (again) gets ugly.

I find it interesting though that your forming a smaller group. Seems people always like to fragment based on there interests...which is fair enough, the problem is with the exclusivity. If I was PMing the game and saw groups forming I think I'd make a series of hard puzzles just to force you back together.

[MageSteff]

Dio, I can see how you might feel that way, but trust me on this, no PM wants to see their game come to a premature end. Or end in a manner that doesn't fit the story arc they want to tell.

I don't has as much experience as other PMs but this was also an issue we had to deal with at Orbital Colony. A player thought s/he would "scare" the bad guy by sending an e-mail containing info that could only have come from the "good guys." We chose an in game method for dealing with it in a manner that the intended recipient of the e-mail "never" received it (or received it much later). We did take one e-mail to another in game character and had her react in an age appropriate manner, but one that did not really affect the overall direction of the game.

Now, the PMs can say that it never made it to the intended in box (it happens in real life, why not in a game), that it is discounted as the mad ramblings of a kook, that it takes the game in a slightly different direction that will rejoin the intended story fairly quickly.

It is part of the alure of ARGs, that you, as an individual player, have the power to change the world. It is one of the headaches that the Puppetmasters deal with when taking on this method of storytelling.

The worst thing you could do is stop sharing information with others. I hope you have also seen the downside of not posting to forums with that - that other players don't learn there is a character they can't trust; that a difficult puzzle doesn't get shared and discussed with those who might have the one idea that helps solve the puzzle. PMs understand that you as players can not control who sees the information, or what they do with it. Most PMs will take that into account, the ones that don't... well, you as a player will have to decide if that is a game you can comfortably continue to play.

As a player, I would hope that people post any ideas and information they have, since I work full time and can't be in a chat room every day, all day. I'm not good at puzzles, but I love character interaction.

And one other thing Dionysus, I couldn't say this during Orbital Colony - Welcome to UF, I like reading your posts, and it would upset me greatly if you chose to not talk here at UF because of the actions of another player.

[enaxor]

[rose]

[Dionysus]

Hmm.. Reading all this, I see y'all have a point. I may have been hasty in my panic. I see I need to seriously think about this and figure out where I stand because ya'll have made very interesting - and probably correct - points.

Please understand that I have no problem with a player betraying the group. It does increase the immersion and I love that.. I just want to find away to post to UF to discuss thigns without essentially handing the information we want to keep secret to the bad guy through the admitted spy - and IM not very good at just "assuming the PMs will handle it". Basically I see it like this:John sends us his (new) location. Now, if I post that to the boards, Rusty will immediatly send it to Alex, in which case, from the way this game seems to be structured, Alex wil be abel to get to John. If I dont post it to UF, Im decreasing UF's value and blockign out lurkers. Its liek being trapped between a rock and a hard place. WHich I actually enjoy.. its a challenge I'd have to face if this was real and thuis it makes the experience more real. Unfortunatly, that means discretion may win out.

I will say this, from reading your points, I will not stop postign to other games, even other ones Rusty plays. As for Ashcroft... well I need to figure that out.. decide where I stand on sharing information. I wont not play the games that these situations arise in.. btu I will react as I would in real-world. I may be pulling out of Ashcroft anyway with Wildfire Inustries returning - which Id rather play because its jsut AWESOME from what I read of the original.

Reading through the archives I can see a similar situation sorta... in AWARE 1 there were 'factions'.. and from my understanding you were supposed to just not read information that was only avalable to factions not your own. Or not aknowledge it. I guess that could be done with Rusty and other AShcroft players. I dunno... I know alot of you had issues with AWARE.

ANyway, you've given me lots to think about..

[Phaedra]

Others have already said almost everything I would have said, but I would like to add one more thing:

Not only is it the PMs' responsibility to deal with whatever players do (within reason), but sometimes unpredictable player behavior -- and yes, even "betrayals" -- can result in some of the game's best moments.

I don't know whether you played ILB, but the PMs created the character of the Sleeping Princess with the idea that players would fall in love with her and do whatever was necessary to protect her.

They were a little taken aback when a rat bastard certain player gave her up without hesitation to the entity that was trying to kill her.

But that player's actions forced the PMs to devise a new plot twist in which players got to rescue the Sleeping Princess, which was one of the highlights of the game for many.

Frankly, I think it's a bit rude for a player to divulge information that others have asked him/her not to, but I don't think we need to worry that it will "unravel" UF. Have a little faith in the PMs.

[rose]

[MageSteff]

[Chewy]

In a game currently being played at unFiction, AnotherContestWorthEntering, we players were greeted by a fellow named Jack Trevor. Jack worked for a company investigating the apparent disappearance of a former acquaintance of Jack--- Sarah Fisher.

However, a week or so in, we were confronted by a person who goes by the name *Kain*. Kain has been spying on Jack, revealing he is going against company policy, and wants us to keep tabs on him, telling him what we learn.

This, like in the game you are playing, posed a question to us. Do we tell Kain all? Do we keep everything from him? Do we tell him a little, or even false info?

From the beginning, we are commissioned into believing Jack is good, and Kain is bad. But again, thats a choice. And the PM's, realizing this as possibility, had to evolve the characters. Within the weeks, Kain got less defensive. Jack lied. What now? If you didn't think Kain was good before, now you have reason to.

This story ends up being example. If Rusty decides to tell all, perhaps the PM should evolve the character. Maybe the "bad guy" could switch sides, deflecting to "good". Maybe he can be killed, and the new "bad guy" can't be reached.

Or maybe, as players, you can evolve the game for it. Provide the bad guy with false information. Or tidbits. Make him reveal info, for your info, in a trade.

The possibilities are endless. This doesnt unravel UF. It makes it stronger.