unforum

[jlr1001]

[ariock]

...

[ScarpeGrosse]

I object to your continued use of the word "rule," especially when using things like 'please search' as an example of such a "rule."

Those are not "rules," per se, as a) they are not written down anywhere and b) are not enforced or policed. Hence, what I think you're trying to discuss is more along the lines of a "community ethic." Ethics evolve and are not hard and fast. They are not written down, but considered to be either common sense, or common courtesy within a given culture or community.

If you'd like to discuss whether or not the community is evolving or should evolve to include an ethic that suggests that OOG information posted on UF should not be passed on in an IG fashion, then that's okay. But please stop suggesting that it needs to be a rule, as it is not and cannot be due to the myriad of aforementioned reasons.

Getting the answers you want and/or starting the discussion you wish to have begins with framing the discussion correctly. I think that removing the discussion about "rules" would help greatly and aid in the discussion of a communal purpose and courtesy in regards to this topic.

[jlr1001]

Re: ariock

You're implying that our separate interactions/experiences within a given game somehow constitutes a zero-sum transaction. I've never conceived of this (ARGs and the like) in those terms.

If I share information that positively impacts your interaction with a game, it shouldn't follow that my interaction somehow suffers. Quite the opposite, really.

One inspiring aspect of this type of gaming is that the endpoint, wherein we really understand the story of the game we've devoted time and energy to play, is reached collectively. If these experiences (and I fully understand that I might be singling out a sub-set of the CF universe) depends on collaborative participation, then this "my interaction vs. your interaction" dialog should be moot.

At the end of the day it's a "we" kind of experience.



-jlr1001

[LordIllidan]

[ariock]

[ariock]

[Rekidk]

IMO, it's a problem when a PM allows one player's interaction to hinder another's. To the extent that a player's enjoyment of a game is lessened by IG-interaction of another player, the PMs are responsible.

Community guidelines are not rules, like Scrappy said. However, the unspoken sense of community tends to prevent issues from happening, eg. Kona's example from Sammeeeees.

In MeiGeist, the players were recognized individually for their personalities but were accepted by the game as a collaborative group. The game design didn't allow for betrayal of other players. The PMs of that game had too much respect for their players to force them to turn against eachother.

Even if the game design would have allowed the players to 'betray' eachother, most communities have a general unspoken code of ethics (again, like Scrappy said) that prevent betrayals and whatnot.

Ultimately, these issues are the responsibility of the PMs, IMHO, but can also be prevented/controlled by the community.

Again, though, I'm not sure that the issue in EniTech was betrayal. The PMs drew players further into the universe via this so-called 'betrayal;' instead of ejecting them from the game's universe, they allowed them to become an even greater part of it. The only issue is the IG-ness of UnFiction, which seems to be another non-issue in EniTech; the only time UF was brought up IG was, as thebruce said, at the beginning of the game.

Let me end with this: I firmly believe that ARGs are most fun when all the players are working towards the same ultimate goal.

[vpisteve]

Here's the thing. I'm seeing a lot of "right" and "wrong" being bandied about. Sure, this ARG has design issues, which every game does, but the idea of a "right" way and a "wrong" way for players to play is kind of troubling to me.

If players CAN do something, one of them most assuredly WILL. Players poke and push and try things to see what will happen. See how the game responds, if it does. That's what makes these fun, right? The lack of a rulebook. And remember, the decision to ACT UPON anything the players do is totally up to the PMs, nobody else. They're the ones crafting the game, and believe me, they have all of us players' best interests and enjoyment at heart.

There is no WRONG, there is no RIGHT (generally speaking, of course) when it comes to playing an ARG. There are different ways of playing. The PMs watch and react and craft the experience choosing to let the players touch/impact the game....or not.

So, brownies are not only good to give neighbors, but also good to share with your family.

[thebruce]

[Rekidk]

[thebruce]